Does anyone know what (if any) changes are planned to the 220 (220d in particular) for 2008 or 2009? My lease runs out early 2009 and I am hesitant about getting another 220D. I have the 2006 SE with MM and love the car, in particular the MM/SatNv system and general look and feel. However I am not very impressed with the engine/gearbox combination inc mpg. I drove my friends 320D/520D and it was just a much better drive with smoother gear changes that occur at the right speeds eg 6th gear is actually useable at 55-60mpg.
So if lexus are likely to 'fix' the engine/gearbox (even have an auto 220D) then I am likely to stick with it, otherwise it will be audi/bmw/merc.
comments welcome...

I thought I read a post on here a short while ago that said the 220D was going to be discontinued from some point?

Not sure when though

There is a thread in the Lexus General Discussions Section about the diesel being discontinued....

From what I've read on the LOC, the diesel does seem dire, but surely not to warrant dropping it completely? Perhaps Lexus under (over?) estimated the competency of their diesel engine, it is precisely such trials by fire that they can hope to improve it - surely dropping it sends the wrong signal?

I'm not sure they would just drop it, because it will leave Lexus without a potentially fuel efficicent model. Lets face it - that's why they sell it! And they do sell loads - most around where I live are 220d's!

All they need to do is stick in a good Auto box and it will be poifekt

I did see something somewhere a while back stating tht Lexus wanted an All Hybrid showroom by 2012 or omething like that. With current technology, this IS will have no boot and weight over 2 tonnes if the Hybridise it!

Lets wait and see...

i read that too, however this past couple of weeks ive seen the IS220D quite heavily advertised on TV. Up until past couple of weeks, i'd never actually seen an advert for the 220D, which suggests they wont be discontinueing it

That advert has been around for a while, but I agree they've been putting it on really frequently recently........which would give me the impression that they're going for a final blitz before they discontinue it..........

Sorry to continue with rumours, but I've heard there is a new hybrid only model coming out to sit between the IS and GS to fill the gap the diesel will leave behind..........

They are preparing for the new A4 - which is why they are advertising like mad. they did this when the new C Class came out too.

Trying to get in there and get some sales in before Audi start to market the new A4, which according to one test I've seen scores higher than everything else...

But you could be right...they could be clearing the storage pounds...and then not make any more...who knows?

well having read the feedback its looking more and more likely that there won't be a 'better' 220D by the end of 2008 so I'd better start looking at the new A4 and C class (hate the 3 series though). I've heard the auto diesel A4 is really good so will check that out in particular. I will miss the lexus though - especially the reversing camera as i have really got used to using that - and the keyless entry/start.

They won't be discontinuing the IS220D any time in the near future - they need it to attract company car drivers with the lower Benefit in Kind tax advantage. I also have been told there won't be an auto version of the diesel as there is no appropriate auto box to drop in and due to the fact that the IS220D only really sells in Europe and only a small percentage would choose an auto option, it's not considered commercially viable to develop one for the IS. It's a shame because I think it would be a great model to own.

I think Lexus would like a hybrid option for every model they make and with newer battery technology on the way there is no reason why the IS shouldn't have the room, but maybe they will wait until the next generation IS comes out and then quietly phase out the diesel - even at Euro 5 compliancy they can't sell it in the US and and hybrid option would work better there.

In this weeks Fleet news it was stated that Audi expect the 2.0 litre diesel to account for 70% of the sales on the new A4.
A 2.0TDi SE (entry level) is costing £24K. If your looking for economy then go with the A4, if you want comfort, higher spec and better looking car stay with Lexus. Choice is yours

Haf, at a price (!) you can have the Advanced Audi Reversing aids, with guess what? A camera! At £700 odd on top of the £650 for th Bluetooth and £2000 for the Satnav, plus £500 odd for the B&O sound systm, you get almost to the Lexus MM system standard! That'll be almost £4000...and the Lexus one is less than £3000...and a similar story exists for the seating pack in the Audi...you can have Vents etc, but it costs a lot of money...

It's blooming expensive to get these things the germaniac way. Where the Audi is likely to win though is in Interior Quality, especially the materials. The current A5 and A6 are outstandingly well made...and you can have such a huge choice of engines and gearbox's...and it has a much bigger boot and the pictures indicate better rear access...

I know what you mean though - all these niceties for the price make the IS so much better VFM than anything else out there which is why I still have mine. In truth, it only needs a good CVT type Auto and the 220d ould be almost perfect.

If Lexus could only take an IS250SE body and put in a BMW 330d engine, you would possible have the best Diesel car in the world, the 330d gives us 1000km on about 60 liters of diesel traveling at 140Kph average, whats that in Miles and galons?
The 330d has breakneck acceleration and fantastic overtaking ability. Just dont like the new BMW dash looks like a 1948 plymouth unless you ad an Idrive then it looks a bit better. I cant wait for the IS350 to come to this country or a Diesel as above.

agree..when i was lookin at purchasin my new car last year..hated the look of the new 3series bm's..even the 5's. look outdated. and merc i didnt like either..drove the new c-class. still doesnt look as nice..only looks nice on exterior if u get the sports model but u get so little compared to lex. lex was much better vfm n looked much better too. the only thing that looks nice out there now is the a4 new model. and possibly the xf.

As much as I like to look of the lexus and the snazzy gadget a number of other things make it a difficult choice for a company car driver. the 3series does seem to be the best value all round (despite being a bit ugly)
- c02 emissions at 168 versus 128 (320d) - i know its 2.2 versus 2.0 but the bmw seems the better engine anyway. In fact even the auto 320d comes in at 144
- the lease costs for a lexus at £28k are 580 versus 520 per month for a £28k 3series (with my company anyway) and lease costs are even higher for a 2 year lease whereas 320d is the same rate-ish
- the new 'edition' versions of 3series inc leather seats etc so getting closer to lexus value

the A4 seems pretty expensive currently (as its a new model) and the merc is both expensive and rubbish at fuel economy/emissions.
My best bet this year maybe to get the 320d on a 2 year lease (minus satnav/bluetooth and with tomtom instead) and then see how things look in 2010 - unless teh A4 starts to get a better lease rate in next 6 months.
As an aside i also looked at the 2.7 audi A5 and that will cost me similar to what i'm paying for the 220D - although with fewer extras.

I've had a couple of CVT Diesel Audis and they have given me some real "browntrouser" moments at roundabouts and junctions. You see the gap, press down on the right hand pedal and there is a l-o-n-g pause as it winds itself up to go. It's like one of those old fashioned steam ships where you ring down from the bridge for more speed and the stokers start shovelling on more coal while you stare at the iceberg looming down on you!

NBLG - sounds just like the 220d manual - you don't half get BTM's at rounabouts. It has a huge flat spot...you really have to try rev it at 2500+rpm and drop the clutch for a quick getaway, and in the wet the rears do actually spin (which means you could "lose" it). The 320d simply doesn't suffer as badly...

I only ever drove the Audi MT once, it was a 1.8T, and that seemed to go very well indeed. The best one was the Tiptronic 3.0TDi...Whoa

can anyone recommend a forum similar to this so i can look into the 3 series and new a4 in more detail?

Try here:

BMW and A4 forums

Hmm - that helps (not!) as i end up back on the front page of this forum :-)

Sorry, my idea of a joke

Try these:

http://www.tyresmoke.net/ubbthreads/postli...oard/BMW3series

http://www.bmwland.co.uk/talker/viewforum.php?f=2

http://www.bmwcarclubforum.co.uk/forum/default.asp

http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=58

Thanks Steve!!

I was told yesterday by the dealer principle at Lexus Leicester that there will be a lower emiss is220 before the end of April and Lexus will have a hybrid in every model range before 2014

That's interesting - I wonder if they'll use the same sort of stop/start technology as on the new BMWs? I'd love it if they applied it to the petrols as well - I reckon you could be looking at an average mpg for IS250 auto of 35mpg, which for that type of car would be great.

That thankfully rules out the current IS ever being a Hybrid then, no doubt. there really is no room for the motors or the battery, unless it is a scalextric car motor and 2AA batteries...2014 seems to fit in with a sort of date by which time the SC and the IS will be replaced with the next generation, and hopefully smaller batteries will be out by then. The RX, GS and LS already have Hyb's.

Anyway, what's all this about lower emmissions for a 220? I thought that Eu5 was supposed to move away from just Co2 and look at local pollutant (soot to you and me)???

Or is the 220d not actually Eu5 compliant, OR is Eu5 not happening???

I always thought that no company car driver would gt a 220d with 168g Co2, not at least until Eu5 was actually out and happening, or have I missed something?

The BMW Stop/Start engine off thingy is well wierd, but it does work...

Agree about stop/start - seeing as Toyota/Lexus have had this tech for years, seems silly not to implement it across the range, especially as it works so well on the hybrids.

Should show BMW a thing or two as well, as their system is horrendous!

I'm intrigued, given that april is round the corner we should see some more details soon-ish. A lower emission 220d plus a improved mpg/gearbox combo will have me seriously considering another 220D..