Have you heard that they are changing the rules for dealing with people caught driving without insurance...

Instead of an instant 6-month ban at the moment, they are changing it to a 200 quid fine and 6 points... which wont bother anyone who drives without insurance!

It seems like it's always the honest motorist that gets the raw deal! cos it's our premiums that will go up!!!!

[url="http://www.dailytelegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/06/09/ninsu09.xml&sSheet=/news/2003/06/09/ixhome.html"]linkage to new story[/url]

who on earth makes decisions like this?

its just baffling

Yeah I did hear this new ruling.

Basically...I think it's cr@p.

I was hit by someone who had no insurance and I lost out. The bloke who hit me got away with it....how can that be fair

A 6 months ban was not long enough and a £200 fine is a joke. 6 points seems ok-ish, but surely they deserve a ban for a long time and even a jail sentence. And as you said Ian, it won't bother anyone who drives without insurance.

Do you think I'm being a bit too strict here?

No, I agree with you Ifaz....

And as for the 6-points, well, they don't have insurance anyway, so it's not going to put their premium up is it!!!

As in your case, if they were involved in an accident, they should have to pay for all of the repairs out of their own pocket!

I think they should have their license revoked, and forced to take another driving test!! with the possibility of jail.
Also, the police should be allowed to sieze their car... that'll stop them driving at least!

So they pay £200 whenever they get caught and get 6 points each time - then leave court and carry on driving.

We pay circa £5 - 600 insurance, worry about where to leave our cars, avoid point like the plague ...

Wonder who has really got it right here ?



Rant over.

I saw a program the other night that followed traffic cops in the met (was on BBC World on Wednesday night).

They've got this new camera that reads people's plates, and alerts the drivers of the cop car if it is taxed/insured etc. They said that sometimes they have to turn it off because it goes off so bloody much !!!!!! Is that a joke or what !?!

You're dead right......if you have no insurance, 6points wouldn't bother you in the slightest. Even 12 points wouldn't bother them.....they'd just carry on driving anyway !!

I think the law is unbeleivable. A real joke to us "honest" motorists

[quote name='tony_hetherington' date='Jun 9 2003, 12:18 PM']I saw a program the other night that followed traffic cops in the met (was on BBC World on Wednesday night).

They've got this new camera that reads people's plates, and alerts the drivers of the cop car if it is taxed/insured etc. They said that sometimes they have to turn it off because it goes off so bloody much !!!!!! Is that a joke or what !?!

You're dead right......if you have no insurance, 6points wouldn't bother you in the slightest. Even 12 points wouldn't bother them.....they'd just carry on driving anyway !!

I think the law is unbeleivable. A real joke to us "honest" motorists[/quote]
Saw that program too!

I dont care if they are out there all day on the same spot, bloody start nickin the ***tards, and stop just getting money out of speed cameras!

If all those ppl who do drive illegally saw the program, it just tells them that they are likely to still get away with it......

Rant over (for now)

This winds me up something Rotten....

I saw the program and read about the new laws today, and I can't believe how softly these offenders are treated. This is fraud - simple as that. You get more punishment using someone elses credit card than you do this, and they are both breakiing the law using the same principle - FRAUD.

I feel for people (like Ifraz) who get hit by these selfish drivers. It's unbelieveable that once again, the honest motorist gets stung again.

And here I am paying nearly £1000 on insurance a year........

They should use fines larger than the insurance is ever likely to be.

[quote name='Zee007' date='Jun 9 2003, 01:37 PM']This winds me up something Rotten....

I saw the program and read about the new laws today, and I can't believe how softly these offenders are treated. This is fraud - simple as that. You get more punishment using someone elses credit card than you do this, and they are both breakiing the law using the same principle - FRAUD.

I feel for people (like Ifraz) who get hit by these selfish drivers. It's unbelieveable that once again, the honest motorist gets stung again.

And here I am paying nearly £1000 on insurance a month........ [/quote]
a month!!!!!!!!!!


loc insuranc my boy

[quote name='wildrnes' date='Jun 9 2003, 02:35 PM']a month!!!!!!!!!!


loc insuranc my boy[/quote]
oops........... meant a year...........

I used to own an Escort Cosworth. When I bought it I Was 19, had 1yrs NCB, and it was modded to 330bhp.

Long story short - I paid £4500 to insure my car that yr. That included MONTHS of phone calls, and a "publicity deal" with the company so they could use my photo etc.

Anyway........it worked out that if I drove with no insurance (and more importantly, got caught) then it would have been cheaper to pay the fine / get the points etc than it would have been to actually buy the insurance.

(PS: of course, I did buy the insurance, but it just goes to show - what incentive is there for people to buy insurance if it's more expensive than the fine....and that's if you get caught !!!)

[quote name='tony_hetherington' date='Jun 9 2003, 02:48 PM']Anyway........it worked out that if I drove with no insurance (and more importantly, got caught) then it would have been cheaper to pay the fine / get the points etc than it would have been to actually buy the insurance.[/quote]

[quote](PS: of course, I did buy the insurance, but it just goes to show - what incentive is there for people to buy insurance if it's more expensive than the fine....and that's if you get caught !!!)[/quote]

Very good points

[quote name='Zee007' date='Jun 9 2003, 01:37 PM']I feel for people (like Ifraz) who get hit by these selfish drivers.[/quote]
Thanks mate

[quote name='ifraz' date='Jun 9 2003, 02:58 PM'][quote name='Zee007' date='Jun 9 2003, 01:37 PM']
I feel for people (like Ifraz) who get hit by these selfish drivers.[/quote]
[/quote]
To be honest - that's my worst fear!

We all take pride in our cars (we are a car club - it's the nature of it!) and so they're all insured properly, taxed etc and all legit. If I get pranged by joy rider/someone with no insurance etc. then it's ME that gets given the cost, or it's ME that loses my no claims etc. I dread if that ever happens.

As said above......feel for people like yourself Ifraz who have had it happen to them. There's nothing you can do other than bite the bullet if you want your pride and joy restored.

[b]GOVERNMENT.......SORT IT OUT!!!![/b]

Without wanting to turn this into a Political discussion... it seems the current goverment which promised to 'cut crime' has gone soft.

I remember a year ago, the goverment appointed judge (don't know his proper title) said that courts should 'let off' first time offenders for breaking into houses...

The only thing this goverment has done is to repeal a law to make Speed camera's visable, increase the number of speed camera's, introduce congestion charging (without improving the Public transport infrastructure)...

So really, we shouldn't be surprised...

My parked car was hit by a local car thief , a witness gave a statement to the police ,gave the name and everything ,but when it came to going to court would not go ,police came said they would get them next time .

Week later the police in there camera van parked in front of the thiefs house filming the car he drives around in (not insured) next day pick up truck came and took the car away ,not seen it since.

What we should expect next is allowing asylum seekers to drive, because it will help them get a job, but saying they dont need to pass a test, get insurance, or have tax because they wont be able to afford it.



(such a suitable "smilie" !)

[quote name='burnsy234' date='Jun 9 2003, 03:40 PM']My parked car was hit by a local car thief ,[/quote]
so what was the outcome from your point of view ? any compensation / come back!?

Forgot to add my insurance paid out as i had it protected ,but i have been trying to get various quotes for when i take delivery of my new lexus , will be staying with same insurance , reason being the others wont let me protect my insurance with them as i have had a claim on mine.

[quote name='tony_hetherington' date='Jun 9 2003, 03:45 PM'][quote name='burnsy234' date='Jun 9 2003, 03:40 PM'] My parked car was hit by a local car thief ,[/quote]
so what was the outcome from your point of view ? any compensation / come back!? [/quote]
my insurance paid out no problem i was protected its the second time i have been hit while parked up ,so most probaly if i get hit again it will cost me in premium , they never put it up when i was hit with the last two claims.( both in same year)

burnsy234
[quote]they never put it up when i was hit with the last two claims.( both in same year)[/quote]

On most protected policies you can have up to 2 claims in 3 yrs
thats what you pay the extra premium for,i pay an extra £74 p.a for that very reason as there are s******s who drive with nothing(tax,mot,license ins)but then again i've got neighbours that damage my car for no reason whatsoever,other than the fact i've got a LEXUS,so we have to protect ourselves as best we can,which is why im gonna get a camera set up to catch the

Pete

Fines rarely work as the judges let them pay by instalments - all they do is replace the car with another nicked motor and carry on - is shotting the only real answer ?

[quote name='AMH' date='Jun 9 2003, 05:37 PM']Fines rarely work as the judges let them pay by instalments - all they do is replace the car with another nicked motor and carry on - is shotting the only real answer ? [/quote]
I think castration may be a good deterrent??

insurance should have a visible sign that you have it

like tax disks , you can see at a glance who has or hasnt
unlike insurance ,there is no visible signs untill you get hit by them

various countries have a similar thing which is incorporated in the number plate
which then have to be replaced every year

is there a deterent to someone who doesnt want to pay for insurance
it certainly isnt a fine ,they wont want to pay that either

i vote ban them! (and cut their **** off)or (their **** off)

No point in banning them...they will still drive. (but ban them anyway)

A sodding great fine (greater than the cost of insurance in the first place)

If fine isnt payed then a stretch in the cells.

Should also do the 3 strike jobby.

[quote name='Bobski' date='Jun 9 2003, 05:34 PM']No point in banning them...they will still drive. (but ban them anyway)[/quote]
I'll post here what I just posted in the poll.


Insurance certificate to be displayed in car window like tax disk

no insurance certificate - car is towed and crushed.

[quote name='Matthew_McNally' date='Jun 9 2003, 05:39 PM'][quote name='Bobski' date='Jun 9 2003, 05:34 PM'] No point in banning them...they will still drive. (but ban them anyway)[/quote]
I'll post here what I just posted in the poll.


Insurance certificate to be displayed in car window like tax disk

no insurance certificate - car is towed and crushed. [/quote]
best way forward but difficult to implement as would need serious anti-copying technology and therefore bump up premiums

[quote name='rhaines' date='Jun 9 2003, 05:47 PM']best way forward but difficult to implement as would need serious anti-copying technology and therefore bump up premiums[/quote]
we have the technology available to stop people copying £30 concert tickets.

same holographic mularkey could be used on insurance certificate.


cost would not be as much as we are paying to cover the a$$hats driving around with no insurance.

I agree with having to dispay an insurance certificate. A few years ago my insurance company (can't remember who it was) included a mini-certificate, complete with hologram IIRC, along with the usual certificate. They said it was part of a volitary scheme by insurance companies to introduce such a thing 'cos the Government wouldn't. Seems to have died off, which is a shame.

Also agree that fines (all fines) should be linked to income and/or cost forgone. Fines for non-insurance would always exceed the insurance not paid; Parking and speeding fines would be proportional to income or value of car.

The punsihment should fit the crime.

Let's be honest though.......can we see the current government (or indeed any other government for that matter, they're all the same) changing laws such as this?

At the moment, they take from the rich and give to the poor. Simple as that.

Sorry......turning this into a bit of a political conversation, but I think the reasons behind alot of what they do (things like this new insurance fraud law) is purely because of politics. Not road safety. Not revenue (we get stuffed in other places for revenue...cameras....tax....fuel....VAT). Not cleaner environment.

Hang 'em all by their googlies.........

[quote name='Beanie' date='Jun 10 2003, 08:25 AM']Parking and speeding fines would be proportional to income or value of car.[/quote]
I disagree with that mate.

What you're saying is that if I speed, I should pay, say £200, and boy racer in his clapped out death-trap Nova if caught for speeding should pay £20 (figures plucked from air).

I wouldn't be happy with that at all, and I guess neither would anyone else on this board. What we're searching for ...... I assume ...... is a bit of equality. We pay ridiculous prices to stay legal, so should everyone else. If they dont, they should be fined heavily.

[quote name='Zee007' date='Jun 10 2003, 09:31 AM']Hang 'em all by their googlies......... [/quote]
What the politicians ?? Yes definitely
Mind you, very few of them have any balls... if you know what i mean
So have to find another part of their anatomy to string them up by.

If we could get a 'party leader' to voice our view ...
the rest of their party would blindly + unquestioningly agree with every word.
Just like they do on any other subject. What a bunch of toady low lifes.

A persons desire to become a politician should be sufficient grounds to prevent them from ever doing so

[quote name='TonyGoose' date='Jun 10 2003, 10:01 AM']A persons desire to become a politician should be sufficient grounds to prevent them from ever doing so[/quote]
i like that!!!!!!

"...What you're saying is that if I speed, I should pay, say £200, and boy racer in his clapped out death-trap Nova if caught for speeding should pay £20 (figures plucked from air)..."

No, that isn't what I meant at all. Of course fines would be subject to a minimum so he wouldn't get a £20 fine 'cos he was unemployed and only 17. He'd get £200 or £2,000 or whatever and/or go to jail for not paying.

The idea was that the sliding scale should slide upwards, not downwards to ensure that all criminals feel the pain.

... and hang 'em all by their googlies

I know this may sound odd, but perhaps what we need is more normally law-abiding people to drive without insurance ?

I pay £1200 a year on insurance, in theory I would have to get stopped by the cops once every 2 months before it would become cost effective for me to get insurance... hmm.... tempting!!

Once the government see half the drivers in the country figuring this out and driving without insurance maybe they might come up with tougher laws... at that time we can go back to being law-abiding