Lexus IS300h or BMW 3 Series Saloon?

[gdh300]

12 minutes ago, Dave748 said:

Also there are so many Audi's around it's ridiculous, another would be nothing more than white noise in my work car park.

Not a scientific survey, but there are something like ten times as many Audi on Autotrader as there are Lexus (but in the interest of fairness, this evening there are more IS300h than A3 saloons!). I hope you enjoy the test drive and they afford you enough time to get into the unique 'rhythm' of a hybrid. 

[Dave748]

2 minutes ago, gdh300 said:

Not a scientific survey, but there are something like ten times as many Audi on Autotrader as there are Lexus (but in the interest of fairness, this evening there are more IS300h than A3 saloons!). I hope you enjoy the test drive and they afford you enough time to get into the unique 'rhythm' of a hybrid. 

Well maybe it's been pure coincidence that I haven't seen many around, or maybe it makes sense due to the fact there there is a BMW and an Audi dealer a stones throw from town but the nearest Lexus dealer is over 60 miles away.  It's irrelevant anyway as I wouldn't buy an Audi regardless of there commonness due to the fact that I simply find them dull and boring.  

[steveledzep]

From my experience, a certain driving style accompanies the majority of Audi and BMW owners.  I wouldn't want to be associated with that style of driving. 

[ganzoom]

Not to confuse you, but there are some good lease deals on the new BMW 330e.

Standard equipment is good, and with a 20 mile EV range, if your daily commute is short it'll work out to be much cheaper to run compared to the IS300H.

The boot is small though if that's important. Initial reviews are positive but that may be because of inherent Germany bias in some of the car reviewers.

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=247&t=1562704&p=5

Edited January 29, 2016 by ganzoom

[Deadloak]

I had the same choice between the two cars F-sport or M-Sport. But to be honest I don't think I could survived the poor BMW customer service, which I experienced on enquiring about them. To reinforce this my colleagues experiences at multiple BMW dealerships was the same on ownership too.

[Deadloak]

On ‎25‎/‎01‎/‎2016 at 7:13 PM, PaulWhitt20 said:

Hi, welcome to the forum.

I have had my IS for about a month and like it. I have never had a diesel or BMW so cannot comment on that apart from if you intend spending a lot of time going up and down the motorway at 80 mph then get a diesel. The hybrid works best around town where the battery can be used to full affect.

Have a test drive in an IS. You can usually get a 24h test drive if you want and they may even deliver the car to you to try it instead of you going to them. But visiting a Lexus dealer is an experience in itself. No major concerns over reliability. Most negative comments on the IS seem to be about the sat nav.

I am sure others will chip in with more comments and suggestions. Explore the forum.

I do mainly motorway driving and get 51mpg summer/46 winter mpg, which was the same as my 1.4 Honda. So in that respect it didn't matter to me about diesel. As it wouldn't have made much different to me, and it is a quieter ride. The CVT I'm used to as I've driven one for 10 years, so it doesn't bother me. It really only grates if you drive like a boy racer all the time, and that I'm certainly not... :)

 

[Deadloak]

On ‎26‎/‎01‎/‎2016 at 9:03 PM, Dave748 said:

O dear, this is a bit of a shame, I was swinging more towards the Lexus but the informant system was one of the things that I was most looking forward to.  I know a lot of people will say my priority should be the car but we all have our different tastes and priorities.  Also the servicing interval is much shorter than the BMW thats, I think he said 16k or 18k but I can cope with that and will likely get a service package.  I'm back to 50/50 Lexus/BMW now.   :-(

I've not had any issues with the Infotainment system, but I have the latest version. The Bluetooth works well, and the messages are very clearly dictated when you set them on.

The music in the car is very important to me, and I have not been disappointed with it. The difference in the Mark Levinson over the standard Pioneer is only noticible at higher volume levels, and it the car has it, it has the upgraded Sat Nav too.

[Deadloak]

17 hours ago, Dave748 said:

Well maybe it's been pure coincidence that I haven't seen many around, or maybe it makes sense due to the fact there there is a BMW and an Audi dealer a stones throw from town but the nearest Lexus dealer is over 60 miles away.  It's irrelevant anyway as I wouldn't buy an Audi regardless of there commonness due to the fact that I simply find them dull and boring.  

I do a 80mile round trip every day, and I've seen an F-Sport only 4 times in 4 months of ownership. I do like the exclusivity of owning one.

[200h]

can't wait to hear dave748's review on his test drive starting today

[gdh300]

5 hours ago, 200h said:

can't wait to hear dave748's review on his test drive starting today

I guess if we don't hear back, we can assume it didn't float his boat! Very difficult on a test drive to really get a grasp of a car, I find.

I must admit, the first time I drove an IS300h I was almost disorientated, it was so different to anything I'd driven before. But the second time - when I knew what to expect - I began to appreciate it for what it was. Won't ever be everyone's cup of tea.

[PaulWhitt20]

When I first drove the IS the salesman gave me the car for the day and I just drove it home and back again. By the time I got home on familiar roads I had got used to the car.

When I had the second test drive in the car I was thinking of buying, the salesman was sat next to me and was talking about the car and I was trying to navigate an unfamiliar route. Very difficult to get a feel for the car in this scenario.

You need time on your own to get a feel for it.

[Dave748]

Hello Everyone,

Sorry, I know some of you have been waiting to see what my verdict is of the car, I just wanted to have a really good drive of it and show it about to a few different people to see what they thought too.  I've drove it for quite a while, it was an hour and a half from the dealers home, some motorway, a tiny little bit of town and mostly country and B roads. 

This most defiantly is the car for me! How do I know? Well until I sat down to write this post I completely forgot I was supposed to be choosing between the BMW and the Lexus and instead all I've been thinking of since I got home is shall I have the F-Sport or the Premier? 

Listers Lexus Cheltenham.
The service was great, couldn't fault it one bit, sat me down got me a nice coffee and a biscuit that I didn't even have to make myself.  I had a chat with the sales guy Ben who was very knowledgeable  and gave me a summary run down on all the payment options.  He showed me around a stunning looking Blue F-Sport (the exact one I would choose if I get an F-Sport) and quickly ran me through a few of the features.  Before I knew it I was in the car with the keys ready to go.  I was expecting to be there for quite some time so it was really refreshing that they just wanted to get me on the road and let me loose to have a go myself.  It’s probably a very good idea as I have probably worked out a lot of the stuff myself that he would have had to have spent showing me. 

The info System.
Before I left the dealers I was sat in the car not going anywhere for about 25 minutes messing about with the Info System, your all right, it’s defiantly not the most intuitive interface and I thought the map looked a bit crappy and basic too.  Not sure if it’s any different with the premium navigation package but it did the job and got me home.  I found navigating the system quite cumbersome, as a professional IT consultant I really should have found it a lot easier so I can’t Imagen how hard it would be for someone with not much IT experience.  It took me until I had been driving for 20 minutes to work out how to select the DAB radio instead of FM and it wasn't until I got home that I finally worked out how to shut up that bloody woman’s voice on the NAV system.  It’s not as bad as I thought though; I was expecting it to be a lot worse than it was so not a deal breaker and I’m sure I’ll get used to it.

The Ride.
Sublime, silky smooth, silent, comfortable, in ECO mode driving conservatively, as I do most of the time.  Sport mode, a fair bit of lag when you smash your foot down but apart from over taking in real life it’s a rare event.  After driving diesels for the past two years it felt amazing.

Economy
Like everyone’s said it depends how you drive it.  I drove all the way home from the dealers conservatively; the drive consisted of some motorway, a tiny bit of town and mainly B roads and country roads.  It took me about an hour and a half and I got about 46 mpg which I thought wasn't too bad for my first go.  After a cuppa I took the missus and my mum who’s visiting out in it for a spin, don’t know why I bothered! They just went on about how safe it was and how fast it was and that I will probably kill myself because it’s a 2.5l engine.  I tried to explain to them that just because it’s a 2.5l that doesn't mean it’s a racing car or even that fast of a car by today’s standards.  They couldn't believe a car costing that much didn't have a reverse cam or auto dipping full beams.  On the plus side they thought it was a very smooth and comfortable ride but I soon got bored of them and kicked them out at home. 

I then drove the 17 or so miles to work, my normal daily commute in the rain and wind in ECO mode very conservatively and got 55.5 mpg which was about the same as what I got from my 2.0l diesel but driving not so conservatively.  I then reset the clock, stuck it in sports mode and drove home, shall we say, not so conservatively and got 23.5 mpg, hence totally depends how you drive it.  I found the CVT gear box a bit strange to get used to, it revved high a lot of the time and although once it’s moving, it really moves, but the lag is irritating and not something I'm used to.  It rolls well with the corners and sticks to the road like glue, my last car had horrendous under-steer even a low speeds so I was a bit nervous and probably didn't push it anywhere near what it’s actually capable of.   

Summary
Like I said, this is the car for me, it’s such a nice place to sit, so comfortable and, well, I can’t really find the word to describe it but it just feels good, another league from the sparse, clinical BMW interior.  The F-Sport looks amazing in the blue, such a shame you can’t have it without the sport suspension and with all the features of the premier, but, as I went through town I got quite a few double takes from people having a look at the car, a BMW or an Audi wouldn’t even batter anyone’s eye lids.  My mind is made up; only thing left to do is choose between the F-Sport and the Premier now.

I'll probably still have more questions but 

hank you everyone for the replies and information you've given, I'm just sorry to say that your Lexus’s are going to be that tiny bit less exclusive because of me.

[PaulWhitt20]

Good lad!

Enjoy. Hope you find the right one soon.

[dutchie01]

great news dave !  another lexus on the road is more aesthetically pleasing for all of us..

 

drive tastefully

[rayaans]

1 hour ago, Dave748 said:

Hello Everyone,

 

Sorry, I know some of you have been waiting to see what my verdict is of the car, I just wanted to have a really good drive of it and show it about to a few different people to see what they thought too.  I've drove it for quite a while, it was an hour and a half from the dealers home, some motorway, a tiny little bit of town and mostly country and B roads. 

 

This most defiantly is the car for me! How do I know? Well until I sat down to write this post I completely forgot I was supposed to be choosing between the BMW and the Lexus and instead all I've been thinking of since I got home is shall I have the F-Sport or the Premier? 

 

Listers Lexus Cheltenham.
The service was great, couldn't fault it one bit, sat me down got me a nice coffee and a biscuit that I didn't even have to make myself.  I had a chat with the sales guy Ben who was very knowledgeable  and gave me a summary run down on all the payment options.  He showed me around a stunning looking Blue F-Sport (the exact one I would choose if I get an F-Sport) and quickly ran me through a few of the features.  Before I knew it I was in the car with the keys ready to go.  I was expecting to be there for quite some time so it was really refreshing that they just wanted to get me on the road and let me loose to have a go myself.  It’s probably a very good idea as I have probably worked out a lot of the stuff myself that he would have had to have spent showing me. 

 

The info System.
Before I left the dealers I was sat in the car not going anywhere for about 25 minutes messing about with the Info System, your all right, it’s defiantly not the most intuitive interface and I thought the map looked a bit crappy and basic too.  Not sure if it’s any different with the premium navigation package but it did the job and got me home.  I found navigating the system quite cumbersome, as a professional IT consultant I really should have found it a lot easier so I can’t Imagen how hard it would be for someone with not much IT experience.  It took me until I had been driving for 20 minutes to work out how to select the DAB radio instead of FM and it wasn't until I got home that I finally worked out how to shut up that bloody woman’s voice on the NAV system.  It’s not as bad as I thought though; I was expecting it to be a lot worse than it was so not a deal breaker and I’m sure I’ll get used to it.

 

The Ride.
Sublime, silky smooth, silent, comfortable, in ECO mode driving conservatively, as I do most of the time.  Sport mode, a fair bit of lag when you smash your foot down but apart from over taking in real life it’s a rare event.  After driving diesels for the past two years it felt amazing.

 

Economy
Like everyone’s said it depends how you drive it.  I drove all the way home from the dealers conservatively; the drive consisted of some motorway, a tiny bit of town and mainly B roads and country roads.  It took me about an hour and a half and I got about 46 mpg which I thought wasn't too bad for my first go.  After a cuppa I took the missus and my mum who’s visiting out in it for a spin, don’t know why I bothered! They just went on about how safe it was and how fast it was and that I will probably kill myself because it’s a 2.5l engine.  I tried to explain to them that just because it’s a 2.5l that doesn't mean it’s a racing car or even that fast of a car by today’s standards.  They couldn't believe a car costing that much didn't have a reverse cam or auto dipping full beams.  On the plus side they thought it was a very smooth and comfortable ride but I soon got bored of them and kicked them out at home. 

 

I then drove the 17 or so miles to work, my normal daily commute in the rain and wind in ECO mode very conservatively and got 55.5 mpg which was about the same as what I got from my 2.0l diesel but driving not so conservatively.  I then reset the clock, stuck it in sports mode and drove home, shall we say, not so conservatively and got 23.5 mpg, hence totally depends how you drive it.  I found the CVT gear box a bit strange to get used to, it revved high a lot of the time and although once it’s moving, it really moves, but the lag is irritating and not something I'm used to.  It rolls well with the corners and sticks to the road like glue, my last car had horrendous under-steer even a low speeds so I was a bit nervous and probably didn't push it anywhere near what it’s actually capable of.   

 

Summary
Like I said, this is the car for me, it’s such a nice place to sit, so comfortable and, well, I can’t really find the word to describe it but it just feels good, another league from the sparse, clinical BMW interior.  The F-Sport looks amazing in the blue, such a shame you can’t have it without the sport suspension and with all the features of the premier, but, as I went through town I got quite a few double takes from people having a look at the car, a BMW or an Audi wouldn’t even batter anyone’s eye lids.  My mind is made up; only thing left to do is choose between the F-Sport and the Premier now.

 

I'll probably still have more questions but 

hank you everyone for the replies and information you've given, I'm just sorry to say that your Lexus’s are going to be that tiny bit less exclusive because of me.

 

Sounds like you've been having fun! 

Which spec did they give you a drive in? The Premier and F Sport (so long as you get premium nav) has reversing camera. 

I don't think many cars in the premium exec class have auto high beams though? 

[gdh300]

That's excellent Dave, and it was good of you to spend so much time on your post. Hope you are soon behind the wheel of whichever spec you go for.

And you'll notice there were no lectures on this forum about driver training... 

[DJP]

Great report Dave, and delighted although not surprised you loved the car [emoji106]. My dealer says the hardest thing about his job is actually getting people into the car in the first place, once they are there the car does the job for him.

Totally agree about the infotainment system it's about as anti intuitive as it could be but you do get used to it. I think the mini sat nav that's in centre display has better graphics than the main screen, but you do get used to it.

For me the F Sport wins hands down. The moving of the speedo is good fun and entertains visitors but it's the external looks that makes the real difference. You'll turn many more heads in the F Sport than the Premier IMO.

And as for the wife and mother, they just don't get it do they?[emoji23]

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Ian J. Parsley]

Good to hear, Dave.

I've only just seen this thread, but if going hybrid was your main concern, it certainly needn't be. I switched from diesel to hybrid in 2013 and I'm not going back. Indeed, my wife has just made the switch, picking up her new CT on Wednesday!

You get used to the infotainment too. It's quirky, that's for sure, but in the end you can get everything to work fine! Mine's been super for over a year now once I got an upgrade and sorted my phone settings out.

(By the way to those suggesting an Audi, remember we should be boycotting all VW vehicles because they're a bunch of emissions cheats. We hybrid drivers should feel that most strongly!)

[Ian J. Parsley]

Dave,

Just one last thing - don't totally rule out going new. You may well find there's a deal there - current APR is only 3.9%.

[Dave748]

Hi Ian,

I get what your saying and I'm fully aware that it's the dealers job to try and sell new cars and that's fine, I get that but I'm a very hard sell and once I'm set on a budget or an idea of what I want that's it.  The sales guy had a real good crack at me, showing me all the numbers and figures but for the car I wanted brand new it doesn't matter over how long you pay it or how much you initial put down etc. I'd still end up paying about 40K for a brand new car that's a fast depreciating asset.  

Taking into account that as soon as I'd agree to pay and drove it off the forecourt that's an instant 8K gone just in VAT not to mention that the first years depreciation is the steepest in the life time of the car.  It's a personal thing too that I just don't like monthly payments, even if it was 0% APR I'd much rather, if I can, pay something off in one go and then it's done.  For me it's even more complicated still, having my own business and been a self employed contractor I have to consider how taking that amount out of my business at once will affect my divined taxation limits for the year.  

Also I have to consider the fact that at any point if one of my contracts ends and I can't find a new one for a while having a second large monthly payment hanging over my head on top of the mortgage with no money coming in is not something I want. 

And one more thing, the sales guy may have hinted that the facelift model will be out soon so I'd rather wait till it is as I believe it may drop the price of the current model.  Nop, I know what I want and I know how I'm going to pay for it and how much.  Yes it may mean waiting till the right one I want comes along but that's fine I'm happy to do that.  Considering that you can get 15 plates with less than 10K miles on the clock (practically brand new) for between 22 - 25K which is about 12 - 15K cheeper than brand new, it's a no brain'er.

[ganzoom]

Glad you enjoyed the test drive. We bought new because I simply couldn't find the spec/colour my wife wanted - I really wanted the 'safety pack' for adaptive curise and pre-crash braking. 

Have never bought new before and doubt we will do it again. The IS is my wife car and she keept her last two cars lasted for 7 and 8 years, so deprecation isn't much of a concern.

When it comes to changing my own car end of this year will be 100% going down the used route- Gives me an excuse to change the car sooner too :)

[Zotto]

Just my opinion, but if you are thinking about spending some more money for a IS 300h Premier, try a GS 300h, it is more refined and it has  rear  camera and other comfy features also in base version.

[Ian J. Parsley]

I don't wish to veer too far off topic, but of course how you buy depends very much on circumstances. I bought four cars pre-reg and swore I'd never buy brand new. But in the current market (though probably more so here in NI, where car sales are notably slower currently than in England), there are deals to be had which effectively mean you can order new and pay pre-reg (as my wife has just done).

Mine goes through my business anyway, so the lease suits as it makes it easier to see what is taxable and what isn't, which is another consideration.

That said, if you want a particular precise spec or a particular colour, you're always going to find it trickier to get the deal you're looking for. That's not to say you shouldn't insist on those things - it's the individual's choice.

Anyway, back to the point - Lexus IS300h or BMW 320d? The former, all day long :)

[Deadloak]

7 hours ago, Zotto said:

Just my opinion, but if you are thinking about spending some more money for a IS 300h Premier, try a GS 300h, it is more refined and it has  rear  camera and other comfy features also in base version.

I'd like the 450h next, but got to be under the 40k to best Mr Osborne's tax.

[Zotto]

My former GS was a 450h, and I decided to choose a smaller engine for excessive taxes here...