Why Does My Car Rattle?

[Tel]

Jamboo,

Assume you are going to Leicester & Martin & his Team know the score as Leicester is the bigest Dealer in the Midlands & should have the most experience on "Fixes":accept nothing less than complete resolution so that you can join me & Tango (there may be one or two people I have missed) who have solid cars!

Tel

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

Oh yes - I do have a degree of confidence in Leicester now. They are proactive and know I won't accept anything less.

Can't wait to have a rattle and squeak free car again. Especially as I have a lot of travelling to do over the coming dark, cold winter months, and I hate driving company/rental Peugeot 307 SW's!!

Though once I had a Volvo V70 D5 SE Auto, which I quite liked (amazingly enough) - not a rattle or groan in sight!

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

It's in today. Luckily it started to rattle like a dunno what, and the seat creaked too (sounded just like Victoria Beckham)

Looks like a cetre speaker problem only - meaning dash stays put!

[fatpieman69]

It's in today. Luckily it started to rattle like a dunno what, and the seat creaked too (sounded just like Victoria Beckham)

Looks like a cetre speaker problem only - meaning dash stays put!

whey, im glad your getting it sorted! save you keep mentioning it and putting me off the new one! :D :P

(not that I can aford it!)

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

It's in today. Luckily it started to rattle like a dunno what, and the seat creaked too (sounded just like Victoria Beckham)

Looks like a cetre speaker problem only - meaning dash stays put!

whey, im glad your getting it sorted! save you keep mentioning it and putting me off the new one! :D :P

(not that I can aford it!)

...I'd still have one over any other car in the bracket...

Unless I could afford the RS4... :winky: :winky:

[Matus]

mine is cured...

But not by the dealer. It just stopped to rattle and it's silent now. I hope it stays this way.

[fatpieman69]

mine is cured...

But not by the dealer. It just stopped to rattle and it's silent now. I hope it stays this way.

cool, lexus brings out first car with nano repair tehnology! It's nice though that it's sorted itself with no hassel for you.

[Tango]

Jamboo,

Assume you are going to Leicester & Martin & his Team know the score as Leicester is the bigest Dealer in the Midlands & should have the most experience on "Fixes":accept nothing less than complete resolution so that you can join me & Tango (there may be one or two people I have missed) who have solid cars!

Tel

Tel..fitting my 19" Volks on Friday this week so the full effect of the lower, stiffer suspension and reduced tyre profile will test the rattle resistence to the limit. Probably turn the dash into something resembling an airfix kit by the week-end :D .

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

mine is cured...

But not by the dealer. It just stopped to rattle and it's silent now. I hope it stays this way.

Mine did that all the time. Then it would always come back...

Jamboo,

Assume you are going to Leicester & Martin & his Team know the score as Leicester is the bigest Dealer in the Midlands & should have the most experience on "Fixes":accept nothing less than complete resolution so that you can join me & Tango (there may be one or two people I have missed) who have solid cars!

Tel

Tel..fitting my 19" Volks on Friday this week so the full effect of the lower, stiffer suspension and reduced tyre profile will test the rattle resistence to the limit. Probably turn the dash into something resembling an airfix kit by the week-end :D .

You gotta stick some picture on here at the weekend...

[Tel]

Tango,

Really look forward to the pictures of your new set-up & am sure we are both rooting for Jamboo to be fully resolved so that he can really champion the cause!

My Hoshis improved the ride which was a surprise so I will be interested in your findings as I assume you will have 35 profile tyres to maintain the rolling radius within limits.IMHO, my 2 taps from the Top dash speaker & the radio console have been due to severe road-shocks that have triggered a sudden "tap" which have been rapidly sorted by my Dealer.

So steer clear of crap-road surfaces & badly laid out contra-flow joints & really enjoy the best &,by a country mile,one of the most refined cars on the Planet:mine is definitely more refined than my Brother-in-Laws 2003 LS 430 & my mates rattling(does not bother him one jot) 2006 M3!

Tel

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

Guys - thank you...

the tapping from the top of the dash is what mine has been suffering from. Casually it sounds like a sugar cube in an empty box. It comes and goes and when it's there it can be there 90% of the time, like yesterday when I took technician out.

Take a look at the front centre speaker. If it is not perfectly flush all the way around with the housing/dash, or the grill moves about if you press it, then it's likely to be the cause.

On mine the speaker stands proud at each rear corner. Apparently, some insulation and proper fixing does the trick.

The creaking defo was the drivers seat. Guess what this means...?

I only have the dreaded main dash rattle to go and I will have had the full set of rattles...and it's the 3rd Warranty repair on the car so far (7.5 months). That's no better then any luxury car I have ever owned, and 2 more than my Audi (which had corroded wheels replaced after 2 years) and the same as a BMW I had a few years ago.

Having said that, my dealer is very proactive and aiming to sort it all completely.

On a slightly different note, the dealership have the most gorgeous IS250 SE-L in the showroom, all the toys, auto, MM and I believe PCS/ACC...Mesa Red and Beige. A stunning car... £34k before any haggling, and remember, November is the quietest month of the year for car sales and registrations!!

[Tango]

Tango,

Really look forward to the pictures of your new set-up & am sure we are both rooting for Jamboo to be fully resolved so that he can really champion the cause!

My Hoshis improved the ride which was a surprise so I will be interested in your findings as I assume you will have 35 profile tyres to maintain the rolling radius within limits.Tel

Toyo TR-1 R Proxies 225/35/19 front 275/30/19 rear. According to my calculations, and presuming the speedometer works off the front wheels then at an indicated 70mph I'll be doing 70.64 mph so should be well withing the tolerance required (and in the right direction). In the unlikely event it reads off the rear then at an indicated 70 it'll be doing 69.5 mph. So hopefully, in reality, my speedo will be slightly more accurate and I should have a slightly lower gearing ratio on the RWD. :)

I'll post some pictures if the weather is OK this week-end

What's the weather like in the UK at the mo? It's getting a little chilly in Texas...I may have to put a coat on if I go out this evening :D

[Matus]

275/30/19 rear

that's like boing :D

post your mpg then..thnx

[Tango]

275/30/19 rear

that's like boing :D

post your mpg then..thnx

Matus, the on-board reading is obviously going to drop because of the slightly larger diameter of the front tyres, but it isn't going to make a lot of difference. I'll work out the actual distance per gallon if you're that interested (I'm not).

Don't understand the 'boing' Boeing?, booing?, boring?

[Matus]

275/30/19 rear

that's like boing :D

post your mpg then..thnx

Matus, the on-board reading is obviously going to drop because of the slightly larger diameter of the front tyres, but it isn't going to make a lot of difference. I'll work out the actual distance per gallon if you're that interested (I'm not).

I was courious about how will the consumption rise with so fat tires.

Don't understand the 'boing' Boeing?, booing?, boring?

boeing

[alpappy]

anyone has squeaky seat? I think I have seen it already some time ago here, that somebody got the seat replaced.

Mine squeaks about 10cm under the headrest...

On monday I go to the dealer, he will love me: rattling dashboard, squeaky seat, aircon smells when under 1deg, and I will ask about the 5th injector change

Mines in on Monday too, Rattles, possible squeaky seat etc too... :duh:

Must be a virus

18 inch wheels and fatter tyres have increased fuel used by 4 mpg on average

alan

[Tango]

18 inch wheels and fatter tyres have increased fuel used by 4 mpg on average

alan

Don't think the wheel diameter should make a difference, just the wider rim and consequently the tyre having a larger contact area and coefficient of friction. As everyone knows you can't get something for nothing :D . That also applies to the tyres ...the two Toyo's for the rear are over 190 quid each, inc. VAT, fitted and balanced, and I could have paid more elsewhere , and even more for Eagle F1's etc..

Just wish I was paying the same price for fuel as I do over here...just filled up my Ford Escape with just over 14 gallons for $30...15.87 Pounds Sterling . Rip off Britain...and I'm not even going to mention Ken Livingston.

[Tel]

Have done 200k miles on 18" tyres & the only trade-off is tyre wear on the driven wheels reducing life to 15-20k.

I have never experienced a noticeable rise in fuel consumption But accurate tyre pressure & geometry set-up IS criticalotherwise wear & fuel will rocket!

Tel

[Sagitar]

18 inch wheels and fatter tyres have increased fuel used by 4 mpg on average

alan

Don't think the wheel diameter should make a difference, just the wider rim and consequently the tyre having a larger contact area and coefficient of friction.

I don't understand your reference to coefficient of friction. Coefficient of friction is a measure of the frictional resistance between two surfaces in contact and trying to move past each other. For rubber on concrete it has a value close to 1. You can change the value of the coefficient of friction by modifying the nature of the two materials - either the tyre, or the road surface, or both, but it is generally independent of the area in contact.

The force required to overcome friction is equal to the downward force times the coefficient of friction. If you change the area over which the downward force is applied then the force per unit of area is reduced in proportion and the total effect remains the same.

Of course this standard "physics" model does not represent totally the forces at work in achieving good traction. If the road surface is "rough" and the tyre surface is soft enough and sufficiently highly loaded, the tyre will deform into the road surface and resistance to sliding is improved i.e. shearing forces are added to the frictional forces.

There may be some argument that a wide tyre is more likely to provide a stable area of contact with the road under severe dynamic conditions, but such research as I have been able to find does not support unequivocally the simplistic view that wider tyres give better grip.

The cynic in me says that it may be more about OEMs screwing extra money out of enthusiasts.

[Tango]

18 inch wheels and fatter tyres have increased fuel used by 4 mpg on average

alan

Don't think the wheel diameter should make a difference, just the wider rim and consequently the tyre having a larger contact area and coefficient of friction.

I don't understand your reference to coefficient of friction. Coefficient of friction is a measure of the frictional resistance between two surfaces in contact and trying to move past each other. For rubber on concrete it has a value close to 1. You can change the value of the coefficient of friction by modifying the nature of the two materials - either the tyre, or the road surface, or both, but it is generally independent of the area in contact.

The force required to overcome friction is equal to the downward force times the coefficient of friction. If you change the area over which the downward force is applied then the force per unit of area is reduced in proportion and the total effect remains the same.

Of course this standard "physics" model does not represent totally the forces at work in achieving good traction. If the road surface is "rough" and the tyre surface is soft enough and sufficiently highly loaded, the tyre will deform into the road surface and resistance to sliding is improved i.e. shearing forces are added to the frictional forces.

There may be some argument that a wide tyre is more likely to provide a stable area of contact with the road under severe dynamic conditions, but such research as I have been able to find does not support unequivocally the simplistic view that wider tyres give better grip.

The cynic in me says that it may be more about OEMs screwing extra money out of enthusiasts.

Thank you for that...nowt to do with the contact area, just the Toyo's are a performance tyre and constructed of softer compound than the all purpose tyres fitted by the OEM..hence the higher CoF, although it'll be marginal...and in this country it's safer to assume a value of 0.72 for rubber on tarmac/asphalt.

The trade off is a shorter tyre life. The wheels aren't OEM and the decision to fit is for cosmetic reasons.

Geometry check with Mr Bones next week due to the wheel/tyre change.

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

Any pictures?

[Tango]

Any pictures?

Still in Texas, car's in the UK. Wheels & Tyres to be fitted tomorrow.

..and just to finish off the earlier issue on Sagitar's understanding,

you can apply the standard friction equation for rolling wheels to try to determine the value of rolling friction. That equation is:

FR = μR*W

where

• FR is the resistive force of rolling friction,
  
• μR is the coefficient of rolling friction for the two surfaces (Greek letter "mu" sub R), and
  
• W is the weight of the wheel plus the weight of the automobile.
  

This equation is not as straightforward as with sliding friction for hard surfaces, since μR varies with the radius, width, treads, amount of inflation and temperature of the tire, as well as the type of rubber and the value of W. The surface roughness of the road is also a factor. Sorry, promise I'll :shutit: .

[Matus]

I don't understand your reference to coefficient of friction. Coefficient of friction is a measure of the frictional resistance between two surfaces in contact and trying to move past each other. For rubber on concrete it has a value close to 1. You can change the value of the coefficient of friction by modifying the nature of the two materials - either the tyre, or the road surface, or both, but it is generally independent of the area in contact.

It sounds good, but - I hear all my life, that wider tire rises the consumption.

BTW also the tech specs from lexus say, that the "luxury" and "sport" versions have consumption higher by approximately 15%. I know that better equipped versions are heavier, but the consumption rises also by out of city driving. And when the car goes with constant speed, the weight doesn't matter. So I think that also the tires matter.

But honestly, last week I swapped from 17" (225 & 245) to 16" (205) with winter tires and I don't see any difference in consumption.

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

Back to rattling cars - mines back. Technician had gone by the time I picked the car up, but it's as quiet as new...

Will find out tomorrow what it is he actually did...

[Matus]

congrats. mine OK also...