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i am normally on the IS250 forum but was wondering how many GS450H drivers would like to give me their opinions on changing from IS250 SE MM to the GS450h .

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I am in the same situation - lining up a test drive and checking out a deal with my local dealer. The mpg seems to be mid to late 30's - i am getting that plus a bit more on a run with my 250 auto so i will be checking that out very carefully on the test run. I am not going for new - they seem ridiculously priced compared to a 6 - 12 month old one so it is a case of the right car right price while i am still in the mood.

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hmmmmmmmm? obviously none...what a communicative bunch the hybrid owners must be !!!!

I may be able to help here. I have just dropped my IS250 SE-L Auto MM at Lexus Stockport to have my iPod module changed.

They have given me an RX450h as a courtesy car. My thoughts on the 10 mile trip to work from the dealers (mostly motorway and a couple of miles of A roads).

Feels very heavy. Don't like the interior half as much as mine. A few rattles when going over bumps.

Steering seems to have a lot of play in it and is very light. Quick pick up at low speeds.

It's very quick ! I got about 35mpg when driving it sensibly for first couple of miles.

When I got to the A34 bypass national speed limit I floored it to 70mpg and it flew !

However that few seconds of flooring it took the mpg from 35 to 25 !!!

When I later got stuck in some traffic the mpg went up to about 29 - very wierd.

Road noise is worse than mine and mine is noisy on rough surfaces.

Engine noise is nice but again I prefer my IS250.

Not sure it's my cup of tea and I wouldn't swap it for my IS250 which is a total gem.

Also the dealer said the IS250 should be hybrid in a couple of years !!! Ooh yes please.

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As it seems there aren't many responses I'll my little bit too. Haven't actually driven a GS450h but have done a GS430 and an IS250 and except for the obvious size difference I thought it handled quite well.

If you can live with the tiny boot, then it should be fine as a swap as long as you don't do a lot of motorway miles. Obviously if you're at high speed, you'll be using the engine most of the time, so you'll now be paying to run a 3.5ltr V6 rather than the 2.5ltr in the IS250.

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tnx gary ,but i think the GS is a totally different peice of kit than the RX.

Doh - sorry thought you meant the RX - misread this. I bet the GS450 is a right beast but....

It'd give ok mpg pootling around town but don't expect mid 30s mpg if you floored it for the 0-60 in 5 secs mullarky.

You'd probably get about 10 mpg ! I bet it's blooming quick tho !

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tnx gary ,but i think the GS is a totally different peice of kit than the RX.

Doh - sorry thought you meant the RX - misread this. I bet the GS450 is a right beast but....

It'd give ok mpg pootling around town but don't expect mid 30s mpg if you floored it for the 0-60 in 5 secs mullarky.

You'd probably get about 10 mpg ! I bet it's blooming quick tho !

I have had my GS450h for 21 months, and as I have said in other posts before its used very infrequently. I have only covered some 3.500 miles!! The rest of the time it sits in my garage gathering dust!!

In terms of economy over a complete tank I will average about 28 mpg, whilst purely used in London traffic it can drop down to about 18 mpg (in very heavy traffic the traction batteries have no way to re-charge apart from using the petrol engine, so once they have run down which will happen in about a mile the car turns into a traditional 3.5 litre V6 petrol car with economy to match). On a long run mid 30s mpg are achievable. The key to achieving some of these claimed good mpg figures is to build up to cruising speed using the petrol engine, release the throttle then gently re-apply throttle which will allow the electric motor to run the car without the petrol engine. Gentle braking allows the batteries to re-charge, and it’s quite possible with care to cruise on light throttle at 30 or 40 mph on electric alone - great for economy figures.

The performance as others have mentioned, is, excellent. I have had the opportunity to try cars such as Jaguars supercharged XKR and XJR as well as briefly a Porsche 911 and the Lexus seems equally as quick. Probably the most impressive aspect is n the mid range, where the performance is blisteringly quick but also all but silent. In fact thanks to the hybrid drive when on electric alone the car is absolutely silent, which for me was one of the reasons for buying the car. If you have not driven a hybrid car before that will be the most impressive feature when you start driving.

If you go for an SE-L you will have more gadgets than you usually get on the IS, the most significant if you do a lot of motorway journeys, and a personal favourite is the Adaptive Cruise Control which allows the car to maintain a set distance from the car in front automatically slowing down or accelerating.

Boot space is clearly an issue, and if that is a priority, you should look carefully and try loading the boot to see if it will meet your requirements. Incidentally when I bought my car I got the dealer to throw in as part of the deal a set of Samsonite luggage which Lexus offer as it fits to the boot of the Hybrid GS. Although to date I have never actually used them as my usual luggage if needed seems to fit if carefully arranged.

Build quality is in line with Lexus usual standards, there is the odd creak, but it usually disappears when there is a passenger in the front seat - I'm not sure if its the seat or seat belt or maybe the front passenger door trim. But it certainly doesn't have the trim rattle issues that some comment on with the IS.

One thing, although IMO it looks best in Black with Light beige interior - my chosen combination, in common with any car in this combination it’s a nightmare to keep clean. The black being a non-metallic is the worst colour for showing surface scratches and swirling marks, being that I am fussy I am forever having to polish out marks. Short of having the car machine polished every time it’s washed it’s impossible to avoid. On the upside I have picked up a few tiny chips/specks on the bonnet, and the black colour means, to date at least, they touch in invisibly, with only a couple of very tiny chips on the bumper being slightly visible after repair, which given there inevitably, even if like me you keep a large gap from the car in front (which is something the Adapative Cruise helps with), is a big bonus. The light coloured interior is also equally difficult to keep clean, and in the driver's footwell I use a cover over the carpet mat to help keep it clean. Although I should put these points against the background of someone who is almost fastidiously nuts, according to my wife, about car cleaning and general up keep!!

The only other problem is sometimes difficulty in filling up the tank, with quite a few air lock problems causing the pump to continually shut off, so you never know when the tank is full or it’s just an air lock.

Hope this is of some help.

Regards

Keith

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nicnac,

I just bought a 2007 '07' 450h SE-L, and agree almost completely with Keith. And yes, the performance is absolutely stunning. Mine is Mesa red, beige leither and the woodpack, and I think it's a great colour combination. The wood in the steering wheel really adds a dash of elegance.

My difference with Keith is that I also have another nice car, but since I've had the Lexus it's the other car that gets left at home !

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i am normally on the IS250 forum but was wondering how many GS450H drivers would like to give me their opinions on changing from IS250 SE MM to the GS450h .
Hi,think big ,and big is always better,the IS is a great car,but needs more space inthe cabin,and the GS HAS ALL THIS,just a nice car to be driving,,,,,,,,,go for the GS,Thats the next step :P
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using that logic isn't the LS the car to have?

Surprised at the mpgs reported so far- no different to my 430.

Back on topic- previous owner of my car went to an IS250 - within a couple of weeks he was back at the dealer swapping it for a gs450h which he now seems very happy with.

Seems you are getting similar mpg to a 430 but better performance. Only thing that would put me off is the hybrid technology-

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I've moved from a BMW 730 to a GS 450h. Being dissillusioned with the current 5-series, and not wanting to continue driving a barge, it was going to be a high-spec 3-series, or a GS 450h. I suppose it's inevitable I will tend to make comparisons to the BMW, so please don't be offended by that.

This car isn't going to save the planet, and I don't think fuel economy would be the main reason for buying one. My 730 returned between 23-26 mpg, and so far the GS isn't that much better. To be fair, I am driving the GS slightly more enthusiatically than I did the 730, but even with a lighter foot, I'd consider I was doing well to acheive 30mpg. What I do know is the GS is making every effort to make the best of the fuel available, and it would probably be worse if it wasn't doing that. I can now accelerate without feeling I'm sucking the tank dry every time I do.

The GS has a harder ride than many cars in its class. I wish it didn't have low profile tyres because they don't help. But it is solid on the road, and despite its weight, drives like a smaller car. Acceleration is breathtaking. But more than that, it's the way it is delivered that impresses. There are no obvious gear changes. You put your foot down, and there is a humming noise, seemingly unrelated to the car speed, and the car accelerates forward gracefully without any fuss. There is no aggressive engine noise, and it all seems so effortless. Pulling out of a sideroad to join a fast-moving stream of cars is so easy. You can join in gaps you simply wouldn't consider in a lesser car.

Problems so far revolve around the parking brake. If there's one thing Lexus could do to make this car almost perfect, it would be to use a normal handbrake, or better still an auto-hold parking brake. When arriving at a T-junction to join a main road, the car will stop, and the engine stops with it. But if you're on a hill, and heading upward, the car will then roll back. I suppose I'm used to driving BMWs that simply won't let that happen. You can't go backwards in a BMW if you're in Drive. In the GS, you need to keep your foot on the brake, and then change to accelerator when you set off. This isn't the most elegant way to control a car on a hill.

The GS corners very well. I'm sure IS owners are going to say they prefer the smaller, lighter car. But the GS is what it is, a mid-ranged saloon car. It doesn't have the "throw it anywhere, it'll be OK" feel of the BMWs, but it is a safe ride, with a good feel to the steering. If you feel you need to brake heavily into corners, the 450h gives you back that energy as you come out of the corner, and it's quickly back up to speed. It's almost fun to drive.

Little niggles. The voice recogniition is not one of the best. The BMW would politely ask you if it couldn't understand. The GS seems to go with the nearest fit and gets it wrong most of the time. If it's not sure, it should ask, not guess. The satnav map always seems too close in, and it's not easy to change the scale. I'm sure there is a way, but I can't find it.

I don't want anyone to think I'm criticising this car. I'm not. It's a great car and very different to anything else on the road. I will miss my BMWs, but I am happy to join the Lexus clan, and look forward to getting to know you all.

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...
Tnx to all those who took the time to give their opinions.All sounds good .no REAL bad reports.Will decide and post should I change.cheers!!

Not so much a bad point but I will add what I believe would be a common complaint for a new GS450h. When I purchased the car in 2006 brand new, it was claimed to be an alternative to the Mercedes E320cdi and the BMW 535d. Ok it has similar performance as the other two but its no where as near as good on fuel with them unless you drive the car VERY carefully. I wouldn't buy the GS if you are looking for fuel economy as good as those tractors out there!...

However, the fuel is pretty decent for a car of this size and performance so its not too bad!! ;) Favourite feature for me has got to be the silent "Start" button! Those who have experienced the start button will know what I mean! :winky:

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Mike. The boot was a potential issue for me. Coming from a 7-series, with a boot large enough to house a small family along with their pets, I was concerned I may not be able to live with it. I recently had to transport a larger than normal suitcase, (30in x 21in x 11in), and I thought I'd have to put it on the back seat. To my surprise, I was able to lay it flat, and there was still room for plenty more. It's probably the size of Ford Focus boot.

I have to agree with Duffman's comments regarding fuel consumption. 33 is possible if you drive like a vicar's wife, and I could get that from a BMW 530 if I drove the same way. It is currently showing 26.5 mpg since the last tank fill (the GS resets the MPG gauge when you fill up), and this is for a mixture of short motorway driving and around town. I got the same figure for the 7-series on the same regular journeys. 35 plus is possible on long steady journeys, but unlikely. Having said that, it would probably be fair to compare this car with a M5 than a 530, and the M5 achieves low 20s MPG.

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LexusGS450hBoot.jpg

Hope the picture above is good. Found it on google! :whistling:

The boot is not bad. As said above, it is the same size as the Focus. I looked at the positive side of it! My boot is an excuse to not do airport runs!!! :winky:

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Guus,

i had a good drive in the 450h sel at the open day in belfast .I really enjoyed it and the takeof is better than my car .I nall oter respect it is just on par with my IS250SE MM.I really dont see any advantage in changing at this point .I t would cost me 43.000 for the spec and I probably would only get 15.000 for mine.that a lot of cash for a bit of accceloration.

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Guus,

i had a good drive in the 450h sel at the open day in belfast .I really enjoyed it and the takeof is better than my car .I nall oter respect it is just on par with my IS250SE MM.I really dont see any advantage in changing at this point .I t would cost me 43.000 for the spec and I probably would only get 15.000 for mine.that a lot of cash for a bit of accceloration.

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Guus,

i had a good drive in the 450h sel at the open day in belfast .I really enjoyed it and the takeof is better than my car .I nall oter respect it is just on par with my IS250SE MM.I really dont see any advantage in changing at this point .I t would cost me 43.000 for the spec and I probably would only get 15.000 for mine.that a lot of cash for a bit of accceloration.

NicNac, I recently (July) purchased an 07 fully specced superb condition 450h SE-L for just less than 31k. It's a beautiful car with stunning acceleration and in my view worth every penny !

Bob G

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LexusGS450hBoot.jpg

Hope the picture above is good. Found it on google! :whistling:

The boot is not bad. As said above, it is the same size as the Focus. I looked at the positive side of it! My boot is an excuse to not do airport runs!!! :winky:

Thanks for that. Looks like the boot is roughly the same size as mine, but minus the higher bit at the back. The Mk II has a step in the boot floor, seems like the higher bit is used for batteries.

Although the mpg would undoubtedly be better with hybrid, I think it would be fair to say that if I filled that portion of my boot with a large LPG tank and fitted a good quality conversion kit, I would probably still be better off than paying the extra for the hybrid.

I was amused by your comment re airport runs - having had large estate cars for years, I got throughly cheesed off with always being asked to do airport runs, trips to Ikea/B&Q, taking stuff to the dump etc. Now I've got a saloon I don't get asked to do that half so much, even though for the most part the items would still fit it!

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I think it's worth talking about the gearbox in the 450h. I'm sure everyone knows it's continuously variable. But before I drove the car, I imagined the sequential shift function would use predefined ratios, (6-speed), as in a normal auto box. It took me a while to realise there's more to this than meets the eye. When you push the stick over to the right, it immediately selects ratio 5. (you can move it back up to 6). But I found it will do this no matter what speed you are travelling. If you are cruising at say 30mph, and you push the stick over, it still selects ratio 5. It seems what's happening is that each step is a percentage of the ratio the car would use at that speed. So when the box selects 5, it is always changing down, which is what you would want. Changing down further, say when going downhill, when the engine would always be idle, the car uses the electric motor to generate, and the kW meter goes well into the blue.

Very clever. :)

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  • 8 months later...

I changed from 06 IS250 SE-L (not MM) to 07 450h SE a couple of weeks ago, and I've a few comments.

The accelaration is the biggest difference, not only because it's alot of fun, which it certainly is, but also it's very useful. It makes driving in traffic much less stressfull, the power is there instantly for pulling out into small gaps. The 250 felt sluggish in comparison.

I thought the 250 was smooth in accelaration, and it is, but the 450h takes it to a new level. The only time I noticed the gear change in the 250 was under hard accelaration, but the 450h never jerks, it's super smooth. The speed gain is very deceptive, the car doesn't feel like it's accelarating fast, it just arrives much more quickly at familliar corners than you expect. I've had a couple of close calls arriving with too much speed at tight corners I know well.

The noise from the rear tyres is noticably lower in the 450h, the Battery pack blocks it out. I'd still prefer for the tyre noise to be lower, but it is an improvement.

Yes, the boot is tiny. I expect the resale value of the 450h to be hit badly by the lack of boot space. The car won't be a viable option for alot of people.

The 450h feels very heavy when asked to change direction rapidly, you can almost feel the Battery pack jump from one set of springs to the other. However it copes fine with sweeping corners. The 450h seems to cope much better with uneven roads than the 250. I've been happy to keep my foot down longer and been able to carry more speed on the same bumpy straights than when in the 250.

Fuel consumption seems to be about 10% better in the 450h if driven very carefully. I've had 43mpg on the drive to work, with the round trip being about 37mpg, about 3/4 of which is motorway. I had a very hard drive of the car, with 2 people and a full tank over some of the best roads in the pennines and made 27.5mpg. Empty batteries at the top of the hills and full at the bottom.

Road tax is less, insurance only £50 more per year for me, fuel should save me £100 per year, and I'm told the servicing costs arn't much more.

The 450h is a whole lot more more car for surprisingly little extra purchace cost when bought used. I won't be going back to an IS unless it's the ISF.

EDIT : Beware when running on batteries only (stealth mode). I had a close encounter with a group of school kids that decided to cross the road without looking, they didn't hear the car. Fortunately there was no contact, but they did look very surprised.

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