Mincey

A bloke on Pistonheads hates his IS300h

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https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=1890285

"I didn’t know they were that bad on the motorway. The CVT is annoying, the car feels like it has half the horsepower it actually does and the lack of response at roundabout etc takes some getting used to."

I don't agree with any of that. What say you, my fellow IS300h owners?

 

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https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=1890285

"I didn’t know they were that bad on the motorway. The CVT is annoying, the car feels like it has half the horsepower it actually does and the lack of response at roundabout etc takes some getting used to."

I don't agree with any of that. What say you, my fellow IS300h owners?

 

I don’t agree with what he has said, However he’s made his mind up and there’s nothing that will change it.

 

If he were on here asking the same questions then my advice would be the same as many on PH, loose the 1k and walk away from it

 

 

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1 minute ago, Jayw13702 said:

If he were on here asking the same questions then my advice would be the same as many on PH, loose the 1k and walk away from it

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Absolutely. Go and get the BMW and prepare for lots of waiting around on the hard shoulder.

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Every one to its own.. I found the IS a wonderfully relaxed cruiser on the motorway but i guess it depends what you want from a car. When compared to a big diesel engine yes you will have instant torque without even downshifting when overtaking. Floor the throttle in the IS and we know what happens. The art is to NOT floor the throttle but adapt your drivingstyle, you cant hoon this car around. And on the roundabout? well i had a BMW 3 series with the 2 ltr 4 turbo and 8 speed autobox. Slowly creeping on the roundabout then flooring it as there is a hole was just not possible. From almost idle the turbo has to spool up then the automatic starts to look for the right gear and only then there is power. The lag can be so big the opportunity is gone so next time you look for more room to enter the roundabout. But hey, if you dont like an IS why buy it?

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Absolutely. Go and get the BMW and prepare for lots of waiting around on the hard shoulder.

My 530d has 85k on the clock and has just needed a diff rebuild!!!!

So much for German build quality


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24 minutes ago, Jayw13702 said:


My 530d has 85k on the clock and has just needed a diff rebuild!!!!

So much for German build quality


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Vorsprung durch technik :-)

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3 hours ago, Mincey said:

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=1890285

"I didn’t know they were that bad on the motorway. The CVT is annoying, the car feels like it has half the horsepower it actually does and the lack of response at roundabout etc takes some getting used to."

I don't agree with any of that. What say you, my fellow IS300h owners?

 

I'd actually agree with all of what he said. For me, the most annoying thing about the IS300H is the very unresponsive transmission. I drove a new Toyota Corolla recently with the latest gen eCVT and the difference is night and day. I'm not talking about speed or even acceleration here, just responsiveness. I guess (but haven't driven one) the Lexus ES with its newer generation drive train would also be much better than the IS300H in this respect.

The IS300H will be a very frustrating car if you want to drive it "nimbly" in cut and thrust traffic; by the time it winds itself up, the opportunity will be gone. My last car has a naturally aspirated 2.0 litre petrol engine with a manual gearbox and I do admit, I miss its responsiveness sometimes. The IS300H suffers from the eCVT equivalent of Turbo lag.

But I don't care 99% of the time. Driving it is a relaxing experience and I find that I arrive at my destination much more calm and chilled. Mind you, if I had the money, I'd invest in something like a Caterham for weekend thrills 😉

 

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I suspect he was using the new IS in ECO mode because nobody told him there are other 2 modes.

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if it is better response you want then the pedalbox from dtuk is brilliant here is a link

https://www.diesel-performance.co.uk/tuning/car/lexus/is-iii/300h-ave30_-181ps133kw-2494-ccm/#go

it will reduce the lag in the right pedal by a noticable amount and you wont want to turn it off

i know they arent cheap but they are good

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5 hours ago, 200h said:

if it is better response you want then the pedalbox from dtuk is brilliant here is a link

https://www.diesel-performance.co.uk/tuning/car/lexus/is-iii/300h-ave30_-181ps133kw-2494-ccm/#go

it will reduce the lag in the right pedal by a noticable amount and you wont want to turn it off

i know they arent cheap but they are good

How do these work?

And at what cost? Any damage possible? Warranty void? Increased fuel consumption?

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here is a video of an installation from DTUK

you put the pedal box into perfect tune mode and press your pedal all the way to the floor and thats it all done.

its the reverse to remove it and leaves no trace once removed

click on the link then scroll down to see a graph showing the response

https://www.chiptuning.com/en/pedalbox.html

 

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On 9/16/2020 at 8:07 AM, Mincey said:

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=1890285

"I didn’t know they were that bad on the motorway. The CVT is annoying, the car feels like it has half the horsepower it actually does and the lack of response at roundabout etc takes some getting used to."

I don't agree with any of that. What say you, my fellow IS300h owners?

 

Humble Pie for Mincey!

Last night I had the "turbo lag" thing coming off a sliproad onto a dual carriageway. A very nice man (or woman - I couldn't tell) flashed me out so I stuck my foot down and nothing. Nada, zilch. Eventually a large dollop of wallop arrived and I was able to carry on with my progress. My destination was an out of town retail park with a rather busy roundabout as the entrance. Not wanting lightning to strike twice (although this was the first time it had struck) I engaged "Child Mode" - sorry, "Sport Mode" and waited for a gap in the traffic. One appeared. Right foot was duly planted into the floor mat and off we went with gusto. I've not had to do that before - it has always been ok off the line. This was more of an experiment than anything else and it got me wondering if the lag occurs at a certain speed, wind direction, day of the week, or I've just been lucky so far?

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That's interesting. I'm wondering if the ECU is set up like that fitted to the Honda IVtec engines in that it "learns" your driving style and adjusts the throttle response to match? I find my IS perfectly acceptable on response when I've decided to have a fast trip and totally relaxed when I'm chilling. Try driving like a vicar then demanding some beans and see what happens, then, set off like a scalded cat from switch on and note the difference. 

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17 minutes ago, Paul Brooksbank said:

That's interesting. I'm wondering if the ECU is set up like that fitted to the Honda IVtec engines in that it "learns" your driving style and adjusts the throttle response to match? I find my IS perfectly acceptable on response when I've decided to have a fast trip and totally relaxed when I'm chilling. Try driving like a vicar then demanding some beans and see what happens, then, set off like a scalded cat from switch on and note the difference. 

You could well have a point there Paul - I will give it a go and report back!

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1 hour ago, Mincey said:

I engaged "Child Mode" - sorry, "Sport Mode" and waited for a gap in the traffic. One appeared. Right foot was duly planted into the floor mat and off we went with gusto. I've not had to do that before - it has always been ok off the line. This was more of an experiment than anything else and it got me wondering if the lag occurs at a certain speed, wind direction, day of the week, or I've just been lucky so far?

Using hybrid in SPORT mode the priority is given to performance, thermal engine is kept ON  and Battery charge high even if this mean worse mpg. 

Besides, accelerator pedal setting  has faster response (the opposite of ECO mode), and probably the same effect of "pedalbox".

Normal mode is a good compromise for everyday use in city traffic, but if you like a spirited driving or everytime you need more power SPORT mode is the right choice.

ECO mode is fine to me when driving in highway with adaptive cruise control to avoid excessive acceleration when a preceeding car disappears.

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5 minutes ago, Zotto said:

ECO mode is fine to me when driving in highway with adaptive cruise control to avoid excessive acceleration when a preceeding car disappears.

That's a great idea - I will try that. 

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4 hours ago, Mincey said:

Humble Pie for Mincey!

Last night I had the "turbo lag" thing coming off a sliproad onto a dual carriageway. A very nice man (or woman - I couldn't tell) flashed me out so I stuck my foot down and nothing. Nada, zilch. Eventually a large dollop of wallop arrived and I was able to carry on with my progress. My destination was an out of town retail park with a rather busy roundabout as the entrance. Not wanting lightning to strike twice (although this was the first time it had struck) I engaged "Child Mode" - sorry, "Sport Mode" and waited for a gap in the traffic. One appeared. Right foot was duly planted into the floor mat and off we went with gusto. I've not had to do that before - it has always been ok off the line. This was more of an experiment than anything else and it got me wondering if the lag occurs at a certain speed, wind direction, day of the week, or I've just been lucky so far?

My experience is that the lag is there all the time. Over time, you can predict the lag, and accelerate before you need to (e.g. slow for a speed ramp, when the front wheels touch the ramp, accelerate. When the back wheels have come off the ramp, acceleration commences).

You can reduce the effects of the lag by going in to sports mode and moving the "gear" lever to the right for manual "gear" selection mode (or use the flappy paddle), but at the end of the day, there is no getting around the fact that it takes time for the eCVT system gubbins to align before acceleration can begin. The only real solution - and not a very practical one - is to get a Lexus with the latest gen of eCVT. As mentioned above, there is a night and day difference - I guess there are both enhanced mechanical and electronic improvements involved. From what I understand, the newest cars have 4th generation systems (Wiki link)

For context, Lexus/Toyota eCVTs are not alone in suffering from lag. I've driven lots of other cars that also suffer from a combination of turbo lag and transmission lag. The worst I experienced was probably a diesel powered Fiesta I rented a few years ago in France. With the multitude of mini roundabouts I came across over the 2 week holiday period, I became expert at predicting the lag and accelerating before I needed to. The problem was, trying to react quickly and get into a gap in traffic was nearly impossible. As above, the only real solution is perhaps to just not bother, take it easy and arrive calmer (albeit later ...).

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I must admit I don’t tend to notice any lag if I’m in sports mode. That’s an RC300h but I’m pretty sure it’s the same generation hybrid as the IS. For this reason I do use sports mode when I’m driving on the motorway as in this scenario sports mode doesn’t seem to affect fuel consumption (as the engine is running all the time anyway) and it’s much more responsive if you want to accelerate into a gap. If I hit heavy traffic then I’ll put it back into normal or eco as it definitely does affect fuel consumption then.

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I don't really find much difference in the IS300h responsiveness compared to a Lexus with an auto transmission, say a GS430 - the hybrid system seems to have been designed to provide a very similar, somewhat lazy, feel.

Even my F will hesitate if I'm in normal mode and I push down the throttle, but not all the way and press the kick down button, whilst it tries to accelerate in the current high gear before it decides to drops down 3 or 4 cogs and take off.

But to route66's point, things improve - the IS300h/RC300h/GS300h has a hybrid system that is 2 generations out of date (well at least 1.5 generations).

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I had a Mercedes C Class 200 (petrol) with 8 speed auto a couple of years back as a hire car for about 5 weeks while my IS 300h was in for bodywork repairs - the lag in that gearbox was much worse than anything in the IS 300h. It would arrive at junctions and roundabouts in a highish gear then I'd accelerate to pull out and it would take what seemed like an eternity to change down so I could accelerate - quite scared me on a few junctions early on until I realised just how slow it was! 

 

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14 hours ago, Mincey said:

 

Last night I had the "turbo lag" thing coming off a sliproad onto a dual carriageway.

that is exactly when you can feel how laggy the 300h is,

if you feather the throttle then the lag isnt bad you really notice it when you

suddenly plant your foot to the floor nothing nothing power with the pedal box

that nothing nothing has gone and so are you with your foot to the floor 🙂

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Is there a big difference in the CVT gearbox between IS300h/GS300h compared to the one in the new Camry, I believe the same engine.

Is the lag an drone noticibly different

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Can one not use the sport setting on the transmission and manually select a lower/lowest gear in preparation for the swift manoeuvre? It's what I do if "making progress" in traffic, for the quick overtake.

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I have the Blitz "Sma Thro" fitted to mine. Installation is pretty straight forward and it comes with a Toyota bracket to replace a redundant blank in the drivers control area. The module itself has around 10 throttle settings. I have mine set in "Sport" but the lowest setting for that sub category as I find the throttle is way too aggressive even for a spirited drive! Cost was around £140 inc tax via amazon Japan. Its a great little box as I now no longer need to flick the dial to sports mode to have the snappy response. Putting it into sport mode now the throttle response is even more snappier than before. In fact its too aggresive 🙂 There are "Auto" modes in which it can learn in time but I haven't played around with it yet. Downside, In its current installation you will need to push the button to activate it everytime you start the car, there is an optional harness that it comes on regardless, however I'm happy with the current setup.

 

It doesn't increase BHP, 0-60 times etc however the throttle response is alot crisper and I find sometimes when approaching roundabouts the acceleration is simply not there. But this eradicates the problem for me.

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2018-0023EN.pdf

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2 hours ago, Rolando1 said:

Is there a big difference in the CVT gearbox between IS300h/GS300h compared to the one in the new Camry, I believe the same engine.

completely different engine and transmission is an update.

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