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Words fail me - locations with the most 12+ points drivers


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https://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/cars/article-8978035/Locations-12-point-drivers-REVEALED.html

How the bloody hell can someone get away with having 68 points?!

More worrying is the woman who has 49 points in Peterborough. I'll be watching other drivers around here very carefully from now on...

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1 hour ago, LexIS200Sport said:

Do insurance companies even provide cover for these people?

 

maybe NOT and that's why the points mount up everytime they get caught !

Malc

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18 hours ago, Malc said:

maybe NOT and that's why the points mount up everytime they get caught !

Malc

If they didn`t have cover they would have received a driving ban would they not Malc ?

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2 hours ago, royoftherovers said:

a driving ban

many people with a ban still drive, that's why the points mount up and mount up ......  then eventually i guess they get their legs broken so they physically cannot drive

Malc

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I think its pretty easy to hit 12 points these days. Plenty of people I know who I don't think are particularly reckless drivers are on 6 with a couple of 9. Speed cameras are now appearing like never before so its just so easy to slip up slightly and in comes that dreaded letter. I actually think busy areas with lots of congestion are a real risk because you are conditioned to just crawling through unable to get anywhere near the limit anyway. So of course when you get a quiet period its so easy to just slip up and get lettered. 

I thought most patrol cars have software that tracks reg plates and flags any potential vehicles that have a banned driver registered to them?? Some wag I know chanced it with only a few weeks left of a 3 month ban and got pulled over for just that reason.  Ended up getting another 6 months!!!

 

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but I think the point could be that some people with bans just recklessly carry on driving and get banned a few times with mounting points and it's only breaking their legs that might stop them from driving a car .........  irresponsible people aren't often worried about yet another ban that can be flouted

Malc

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On 11/24/2020 at 12:27 PM, Mincey said:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/cars/article-8978035/Locations-12-point-drivers-REVEALED.html

How the bloody hell can someone get away with having 68 points?!

More worrying is the woman who has 49 points in Peterborough. I'll be watching other drivers around here very carefully from now on...

This actually makes sense, every-time I drive I am surprised that it isn't more common. I have no clue how some people got their driving license here?!

I would say in London rules somewhat applies just around speed/red light cameras or bus lanes with cameras - if there are no cameras around it feels like there are no rules. And indeed most of the contraventions are minor - like not indicating, turning around where one should not do it etc. But overall, it is clear that people do not know the rules... I am not angel either, but at least I know what I am doing on the road... but it is evident that many other drivers just don't know. 

Finally, let me tell you the story about one lady I used to know personally to explain how this "exceptional circumstances" thing work. I temporary rented a room when I was studying whilst moving between campuses and my "landlady" had an antisocial niece who visited like every-other day and she was real nuisance. She was "sole" mother of 4 and every-time I seen her she was either drunk or on drugs. How this relates to the story? Well..  she was driving bashed-up Ford Galaxy and had no insurance, nor MOT... she never had one. Simply bought the car and was driving it. Apparently, she had driving license with 9-points, I have no clue how she got the license, but she had one. And during the period I lived there she used to continuously complain about all the court cases she had to go through. Basically, she would get caught like once a week driving in bus lane or stopped by police for not having insurance etc. the case would eventually go to court and she would go and say that she had "exceptional circumstances". Her excuse was that she had to take her 4 kids to nursery (which was 200 metres away from where she lives) and thus needed the car and pleaded not to give her remaining 3 points which would result in driving ban. I am not sure how many times she succeeded with this plea, but in like 8 weeks I was living there it must have been at least 6 times (she would come and leave her 4 kids with her aunt to attend hearings). The outcome would always be along the lines - police asks for 6 points, driving ban and £1875 fine, she asks to consider circumstances and the court would give her like suspended sentence for 2 days social-work and £45 fine due to "exceptional circumstances". Then she would fail to pay that fine and would get sued again at which point she would say that she has no money to pay it (income support, she was obviously never been employed), fine would be reduced to £28 or something along those lines. She would not pay it again and it would be eventually dropped altogether. How do I know she was not lying? Well... she was registered in that address and she would come to pick-up like dozens of letters with various debts and fines and would go around showing them to everyone... and indeed I seen decision saying that considering "exceptional circumstances" the fine will be reduced to £45 and no point will be issued. RIDICULOUS! 

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 Are you confused @Mincey?image.png.c9b9fe032cc0bbec1d6d0ed8dddd3eaa.png

I was confused as well when I came to London like 12 years ago... you see I came from republic with "two tier system", where everyone are equal by the law, but some are "more equal". That is - if you rich you still going to get arrested, but the sentence will be more lenient then in case you just normal person or poor (in which case you will feel full brunt of the law).

It is somewhat similar in UK - look at Mr. Sir. Lord. King. Philip Green, he goes around pillaging pension funds, gutting companies, leaving tens of thousands unemployed, paying himself £1.5bn in dividends, living in £200mln mega-yacht in Monaco and facing no consequences ever. Although, I despise such "two tier system" I was used to it.

However, what confused me the most - in UK it seems you have "four tier system", you could be normal working person in which case you have to follow the law, have insurance etc,, or you could be violent criminal in which case you will be arrested and put in jail, or you could be rich in which case you going to avoid jail, but as well there is forth group with acronym S.C.U.M. - that is poor antisocial group which isn't violent, but equally law does not really apply to them. This is the same group which could drive around with 68 points on the license, without MOT or Insurance and somehow there is nobody to stop them! It is really confusing for me why this is allowed to happen... I don't have answer either - just seems like government is only interested in applying the law if there is money to be recovered.

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It is madness Linas, absolute madness. I used the "confused" smiley as there isn't a "I just can't believe it" smiley! 

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21 hours ago, Linas.P said:

and somehow there is nobody to stop them! It is really confusing for me why this is allowed to happen... I don't have answer either -

 

On 11/27/2020 at 7:37 AM, Malc said:

and it's only breaking their legs that might stop them from driving a car .........  irresponsible people aren't often worried about yet another ban that can be flouted

maybe this is really the only solution !

Malc

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Potentially...

However, the other side of the coin - I assume government thinks it is cheaper to leave this anti-social group of people be as long as they are not violent. If they enforce the laws properly, confiscate their cars, ban them from driving etc. I am sure they still drive, still without insurance, just instead of getting some banged-up car for £200, they would steal it across the street from working neighbours (with violence if needed). Then as results government will have not only to cover costs for neighbours, spend extra on enforcement, but as well fill prisons with thousands more criminals.

Problem is - between anti-social and violent anti-social is very thin line, especially when drugs and alcohol is involved, so I don't believe the "leniency policy" works. I am more for "total policing" - meaning that every crime has to be investigated, no matter how small and ideally the perpetrator found, finned or otherwise dealt with ("total policing" is apparently Metropolitan Police slogan, which cannot be further from the truth). Over time lack of enforcement on petty crimes, creates environment where anti-social people feel untouchable and this leads into increase of criminals overall. 

I know you probably meant it as a joke, but breaking their legs or spines probably would not work. Doesn't sound very humane to begin with, but it could be argued they are sub-human anyway (not my opinion, just potential point of view). The problem is that we live in welfare-state and we would still need to cover their health expenses. Unless suggestion is to put them down like an animals straight away... dark jokes aside there are several cases where such anti-social "mothers" deliberately maims their kids to get extra benefits - as you can see we don't even need to break their legs they will do it themselves for more benefits... 

On the serious note - this is not just relating to motoring, this this huge problem in UK - the article simply highlights the area where motoring issues overlaps underlying social issue. What is worse -  such people are no longer exception, they are still minority, but in some areas they may be substantial minority. The situation is so bad, that it is becoming generational thing.

My idea would be to somehow implement birth control, perhaps curtain certain people from benefits - essentially removing the motivation to have kids for financial gain and benefits. Yes it will hurt genuinely poor families and it would still take few generations to take effect, but it is still better than current situation where we basically paying anti-social people to get as many kids as they can in a hope that somehow those kids grow-up normal (spoiler alert, majority don't grow-up normal).

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3 hours ago, Linas.P said:

essentially removing the motivation to have kids for financial gain

there is a huge motivation with people from all generations and ilk to have kids, the process anyway, it's called s*x .........  be the end resulting with financial gain or nowt

I don't think there really is a solution to be had here, especially  in banning s*x :unsure:

Malc

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No... I didn't proposed to ban that... besides protection and contraception exists for better half of last century. I think my point was towards family planning - responsible people plan it carefully and financial situation has a lot to do with. If having kids would be more of financial burden and less of source of income then less antisocial families/mothers would go through with it - you do realise that there is group of people who count the "best number" of kids to have to min/max on benefits right? Is this comprehensive solution - no probably it isn't. Without financial motivation we would probably comeback to times of orphanages - although that sounds better than your own mother twisting your arms and legs just because child support is £60/week higher for child with disability (disgusting)!

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