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Scarlet Pimpernell

Is220d Sport

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...at the Open Road event yesterday (which BTW was lovely, especially on a day like that with the weather...)

And the Jamboo verdict (compared to the SE is as follows for those interested):

Gearing and Performance:

Feels quicker due to gearing and so a sportier feel, but 'cos you can't hold the gears long enough it I think it's the same as the SE. You waste time changing gears...Also, as the 220d as we know has a narrowish power band (2300ish to 4000rpm and it's greatest between 2500-3000rpm) you find you're into the 3000+ and running out of wind...which hampers your progress. When you press the car it runs out of puff very quickly within gears 1-4 and you find yourself changing up or down much more. So yes, if you like the sportier drive than it's cool I suppose.The SE on the hand allows you to hold 3rd or 4th longer and therefore on UK A roads and limits it's blindingly quick in the overtaking ranges but at 5th or 6th they are on a par. Ultimately I would say they are on a par (swings and roundabouts).

Road noise, ride and Handling:

Road noise the same. Ride comfort similar, but less floaty due to the Sport suspension. Handling - better than the SE due to the suspension and wheels. I was surprised that even with 18" wheels and a sports suspension, it was very good. Ultimately I would say it's better in that respect and noticeably more favourable over the SE.

Interior bits and bobs:

Escaine was very very comfortable, but already the grey material was look a bit shabby and holding some dirt so I still think Black is the way to go. Maybe 'cos it was a demo...no cooling on the seats. Not a problem as the escaine did not heat up as much as the leather on all the other cars. Wife preferred the escaine. I was not too sure... :duh: The mirror vibrated. Parking sensors really compliment the camera. They are worth having. Ultimately I prefer the high quality leather...

So what do I think (and what do I know?)?

Well, both cars remain fantastically competent in this sector. There's isn't much in it. If you prefer the feeling of a sportier drive, then the Sport is it. The feel of the gearing and and handling make it very enjoyable. The SE on the other hand is approx £1k cheaper, has full leather and what I now call a "Lazier" drive...may be I'm getting older...!

I don't regret not buying the Sport now, and that's not just because I now have a SE and am stuck with it ('cos I could always change it). Genuinely, for me at least, had I driven a Sport before, I probably would have gone SE anyway having compared them properly now.

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Cheers Jamboo.

Very informative comparison. I think I also prefer the lazy drive rather than the urgency of the sport. I also love the overtaking capabilities of the SE so that is something I would miss. I've had escaine and prefer leather.

Did the sport have the hids and auto dimming rear view mirror - these I do miss from my IS300.

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Cheers Jamboo.

Very informative comparison. I think I also prefer the lazy drive rather than the urgency of the sport. I also love the overtaking capabilities of the SE so that is something I would miss. I've had escaine and prefer leather.

Did the sport have the hids and auto dimming rear view mirror - these I do miss from my IS300.

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...at the Open Road event yesterday (which BTW was lovely, especially on a day like that with the weather...)

And the Jamboo verdict (compared to the SE is as follows for those interested):

Gearing and Performance:

Feels quicker due to gearing and so a sportier feel, but 'cos you can't hold the gears long enough it I think it's the same as the SE. You waste time changing gears...Also, as the 220d as we know has a narrowish power band (2300ish to 4000rpm and it's greatest between 2500-3000rpm) you find you're into the 3000+ and running out of wind...which hampers your progress. When you press the car it runs out of puff very quickly within gears 1-4 and you find yourself changing up or down much more. So yes, if you like the sportier drive than it's cool I suppose.The SE on the hand allows you to hold 3rd or 4th longer and therefore on UK A roads and limits it's blindingly quick in the overtaking ranges but at 5th or 6th they are on a par. Ultimately I would say they are on a par (swings and roundabouts).

Road noise, ride and Handling:

Road noise the same. Ride comfort similar, but less floaty due to the Sport suspension. Handling - better than the SE due to the suspension and wheels. I was surprised that even with 18" wheels and a sports suspension, it was very good. Ultimately I would say it's better in that respect and noticeably more favourable over the SE.

Interior bits and bobs:

Escaine was very very comfortable, but already the grey material was look a bit shabby and holding some dirt so I still think Black is the way to go. Maybe 'cos it was a demo...no cooling on the seats. Not a problem as the escaine did not heat up as much as the leather on all the other cars. Wife preferred the escaine. I was not too sure... :duh: The mirror vibrated. Parking sensors really compliment the camera. They are worth having. Ultimately I prefer the high quality leather...

So what do I think (and what do I know?)?

Well, both cars remain fantastically competent in this sector. There's isn't much in it. If you prefer the feeling of a sportier drive, then the Sport is it. The feel of the gearing and and handling make it very enjoyable. The SE on the other hand is approx £1k cheaper, has full leather and what I now call a "Lazier" drive...may be I'm getting older...!

I don't regret not buying the Sport now, and that's not just because I now have a SE and am stuck with it ('cos I could always change it). Genuinely, for me at least, had I driven a Sport before, I probably would have gone SE anyway having compared them properly now.

[/quoi had

Quite agree about the seats the leather is much better and will wear better in the long run

alan

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Cheers Jamboo.

Very informative comparison. I think I also prefer the lazy drive rather than the urgency of the sport. I also love the overtaking capabilities of the SE so that is something I would miss. I've had escaine and prefer leather.

Did the sport have the hids and auto dimming rear view mirror - these I do miss from my IS300.

Yes it did. The standard lights on the SE are very good already (eons better than my old A4), though the Renault Laguna from work has HIDs, which are very good. I did think the parking sensors were good, 'cos you got the camera and a little "car" symbol with a flashing graphic and a beeping sound...very worthwhile but not essential. Then there's no excuse for hitting that brickwall!!!! :duh:

Like you say the SE is like a wolf in Grandmas clothing...bt I can see the merits of the Sport...but for an extra £1K? Hmmm....maybe...or maybe not...close to call, but I think I'm happy with what I have and what it does for me.

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Over the SE you get:-

VDIM

memory seats/mirrors/steering wheel position etc

Rain sensing wipers

front and rear parking sensors

HID headlamps with I-AFS

Electric adjustable steering column

Sports suspension

sports pedals

scuff plates

18" wheels

differnet final drive ratio

Everyones different but for me the Sport is great value. Its worth the extra for the 18" wheels alone in my book. I think its more comparable to the SE-L than the SE for equipment and its alot cheaper than the SE-L

Cheers Jamboo.

Very informative comparison. I think I also prefer the lazy drive rather than the urgency of the sport. I also love the overtaking capabilities of the SE so that is something I would miss.

I don't really understand this? In gear acceleration is meant to be quicker in the Sport..

I would be very surprised if the overtaking capabilities of the SE were better than the Sport

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It depends...the impact of a different final drive is "exponential" from my experience. The final drive changes mean that that the SE/Base/SE-L laze around longer in the sweet spot, where the Sport gets to business quicker and therefore works through the rev raneg quicker, which is no bad thing.

If you keep the Sport in the "sweet spot" (i.e. 2500 - 3000rpm), you need to change gears more frequently and that's where you 'could' be slower...

In the SE, the only way I can put it is that you can stay in a gear a lot longer...(1 - 4).

If you time it right, it's likely that the Sport will definitely be faster, but where you have to change gears up, we can carry on for a lot longer and stay through max torque range longer...have you tried the SE?

The Sport "feels" faster to the senses, but at a point where you change the gear up, the SE is still going...so the SE might not shoot off faster off the line, but on a straight I reckon the SE/Base/SE-L would make up lost time...and there would be very little in it, may be a few tenths at the most to the Sport...

It's like cycling - mountain bikes (short gears) compared to road/racing cycles (tall gears)...if you know what I mean. the mountain biker will shoot off the line, but it won't be long before the road bike catches up...

It's not a criticism at all, more a comparison of the difference that I felt when I drove it, and like I say, the handling and "driver engagement" is good.

From a VFM perspective, you're right, it is closer to the SE-L with all the bits and bobs. It's a personal thing though, no leather and I'm just not sure I would pay for auto wipe, scuff plates, auto dimming mirrors or even HID's as extra's I need, though the Dip facility and parking sensors were very usefull.

PS - having said this, the sports suspension makes a difference....I will consider a mod (WTS).

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I've had an SE diesel for a week now, as mine is in for the famous dash rattles, so I can give a more considered view.

The sport is definitely quicker. No question. If you put your foot down in the sport, you get immediate response (assuming you are using the gears correctly), in the SE it takes some time to get on the power band. Acceleration is better in gear and feels generally quicker overall.

I don't like the gearing on the SE. I have heard peolple speak of the gearing before but having only previously driven the sport, I hadn't really appreciated the difference. Its basically a 5 speed and, as such, I was always in a gear lower in the SE at the same speeds. The gearing in the sport is much better IMO, sorry but thats being honest.

Fuel economy is better in the SE, about 3-4 mpg over my normal commute. I got about 3-4 mpg above the quoted combined figures in both cars, which is nice :winky:

I missed the parking sensors, the electro-chromatic mirrors and the fact that the mirrors dip in the sport in reverse so you can see the curb. I also missed the look of the 18 inch wheels.

I liked the leather seats and the cooling function though, very nice touch.

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Roonaldo, you're probably right having driven them both longer than me.

I've gotten too used to the lazy box in mine now... :yawn:

But I do agree, the Sport feels more "normal", especially the first time you drive one.

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