Battery Failure

[kev dood]

Lexus must know what is causing the higher than normal current drain when the car is off. I am betting they cannot fix it easily (read cheaply) so they are stalling. You could badger them into fitting a leisure Battery which will drain slower.

A solar trickle charger is not much use if parking indoors, plus why should you have to pay for it. Who will warrenty any damage caused by a failure??

I agree, its poor that Lexus don;t care about customers spending large amounts of money on their cars. I feel Lexus have gone a little down hill over the lat few years. Is it complacency?

[RSCELEG]

Hi people,

I am looking to buy an RX hybrid but I dont drive that much - usually occassionally for long distances and I am a little nervous from these posts if I am going to leave the vehicle in the garage for a couple of weeks at a time without driving it and then finding the Battery is flat. (its no problem with my current car - a petrol mercedes).

When I looked on the Lexus website they say:

Lexus UK Hybrid FAQS

"As with all vehicles, if left for an extended period of time without use in severe weather conditions it may need recharging. However, in the unlikely event that the Battery discharges completely, the petrol engine will start the car and be used to recharge the main advanced compact Battery."

But that advice to say that the petrol engine will start the car if the Battery is flat seems to be at odds with people's experiences on the forum here - could anyone comment?

-thanks

[stringbender]

Surely this whole problem could be easily be eliminated. The Lexus Mark 1 starting handle. Only £99.99 from all good dealers. A high tec. fix seems a long way off. Why doesn't the Prius have this problem? Or does it?

[williz]

Surely this whole problem could be easily be eliminated. The Lexus Mark 1 starting handle. Only £99.99 from all good dealers. A high tec. fix seems a long way off. Why doesn't the Prius have this problem? Or does it?

good idea!

but how do you crank on a computersystem with a handle? (there is no engine to start, only some computers have to be powerd on).

[hamishmac]

I AM A NEW MEMBER TO THIS FORUM,I AM HOPING SOMEBODY FROM LEXUS CUSTOMER RELATIONS IS READING THIS POST, I AM REALLY IMPRESSED WITH THE RX400H, BUT,THIS BUSINESS WITH THE SMALL STARTER Battery IS PATHETIC,IT NEEDS TO BE FIXED , I WILL NOT BUY THIS VEHICLE TILL THE PROBLEM IS SORTED,LEXUS SEEM TO BE HOPING THE PROBLEM GOES AWAY, HOW CAN A COMPANY THAT COMES FIRST FOR CUSTOMER RELATIONS TREAT THEM SO BADLY

[Mike Nav]

I AM A NEW MEMBER TO THIS FORUM,I AM HOPING SOMEBODY FROM LEXUS CUSTOMER RELATIONS IS READING THIS POST, I AM REALLY IMPRESSED WITH THE RX400H, BUT,THIS BUSINESS WITH THE SMALL STARTER BATTERY IS PATHETIC,IT NEEDS TO BE FIXED , I WILL NOT BUY THIS VEHICLE TILL THE PROBLEM IS SORTED,LEXUS SEEM TO BE HOPING THE PROBLEM GOES AWAY, HOW CAN A COMPANY THAT COMES FIRST FOR CUSTOMER RELATIONS TREAT THEM SO BADLY

As others have already remarked, while clearly some owners appear to have had this problem, others like myself have been completely unaffected. My RX400H SE is 3 years old, 40k miles and I have left it parked outdoors in winter at airports (covered in snow and freezing conditions - normally for a week) and returned to a serviceable vehicle and left it for 3 weeks in summer at an airport - again with no problems. I'm not saying there is not a problem but I would remark that it doesn't seem to affect every vehicle. MN

[Ullevi]

I AM A NEW MEMBER TO THIS FORUM,I AM HOPING SOMEBODY FROM LEXUS CUSTOMER RELATIONS IS READING THIS POST, I AM REALLY IMPRESSED WITH THE RX400H, BUT,THIS BUSINESS WITH THE SMALL STARTER BATTERY IS PATHETIC,IT NEEDS TO BE FIXED , I WILL NOT BUY THIS VEHICLE TILL THE PROBLEM IS SORTED,LEXUS SEEM TO BE HOPING THE PROBLEM GOES AWAY, HOW CAN A COMPANY THAT COMES FIRST FOR CUSTOMER RELATIONS TREAT THEM SO BADLY

Again,I can only add that I have had an RX400h for nearly 3 years and it has not missed a beat,including after being left undriven for 2 to 3 week stretches.

Also,the issue of Battery failure in a car that has been left for 2-3 weeks is not exclusive to this make or model.I have heard of similar issues with all sorts of current makes and models where keeping a car immobile for this kind of period of time can result in a discharged Battery.

[jbanfie]

Hi Guys,

I'm glad some people have some better news on this. Mine is over 2 years old with 25K on the clock, never missed a beat but it gets used nearly everday, and as we have very small kids we've taken holidays in England and therefore taken the car and never left it. The longest we must have left it is 3 days max.

Anyway pleased to hear that this doesn't seem to affect everyone, I can believe that some batteries fitted are a bit duff, we've all heard those stories from all over the place.

Cheers

Jon

[maureenh]

I just took delivery of a new RX400h about 4 weeks ago.

I had 3 RX300 before this. On Monday this week my husband was waiting for me in the car listening to the stereo with ipod playing through lexus stereo.

After about 30 mins I came back to the car and it wouldn't start. We had to get RAC to jump start the car.

We regularly followed this pattern in our RX 300 . In fact quite often we would listen to the stereo and kept the heated seats on for up to an hour while waiting or picnicking in the car.

Is this a design flaw with the Hybrid and is there any way we can use in car entertainment while the car is stationary and the engine or "ready" light is not engaged

If not why does Lexus fit a Hybrid with dvd player that can only be played while stationary if the Battery can't take it for as little as 30 mins

Maureen

[martin geden]

I just took delivery of a new RX400h about 4 weeks ago.

I had 3 RX300 before this. On Monday this week my husband was waiting for me in the car listening to the stereo with ipod playing through lexus stereo.

After about 30 mins I came back to the car and it wouldn't start. We had to get RAC to jump start the car.

We regularly followed this pattern in our RX 300 . In fact quite often we would listen to the stereo and kept the heated seats on for up to an hour while waiting or picnicking in the car.

Is this a design flaw with the Hybrid and is there any way we can use in car entertainment while the car is stationary and the engine or "ready" light is not engaged

If not why does Lexus fit a Hybrid with dvd player that can only be played while stationary if the battery can't take it for as little as 30 mins

Maureen

I have an Ipod kit fitted on my RX400h and this can be played whilst the READY light is off. The ignition has three stages. Just before the last stage you should be able to play the stereo, use sat nav, ipod, play DVD on front and back screens

[kns]

Maureen,

I have a Lexus GS450h, and use the car very infrequently in 19 month I have only covered 3,200 odd miles!!!

As a result the car will be left locked in my garage for anything upto THREE MONTHS AND IT USUALY STARTS. The only time I have a problem is if last time its been used is just for a short journey.

I had an Ipod connectivity module recently fitted, but haven't used it with the car off for any length of time, but I think the current draw would be neglagable. I know if I have been in the car listening to the Stereo without the car running I have not experienced the problems you have mentioned.

One thing I would say is, leave the ignition turned off, in other words just press the start button once, that will turn on the Stereo but not all the other car's systems. It could be possible with all the car's systems left running for an extended period of time without the 12v batterey being topped up by the engine (i.e without the 'ready' on) could cause a problem.

Appoligies in advance if I have confused the issue even more. Sometimes its impossible to explain with just the written word!!

Regards

Keith

[rufels]

During a commercial break one night the Black & Decker battery booster "popped" up.

Wonder whether that would be suitable to carry in the boot?

What do you think?

http://www.blackanddecker.co.uk/automotive...hierarchy/1744/

Dear Great Dane,

I took this up with Lexus. My Lexus agency thought it a good idea. I asked them to take it up with Lexus UK Technical Department on my behalf. They in turn also thought it a good idea, thought it should work, but before sanctioning its use, they will be testing it out in their workshop.

Hopefully we are getting somewhere.

I presume once it is shown to work via the cigarette lighter, all RX400h cars should be provided with one.

Thanks for the Booster suggestion!!

Ruth

This is a follow-up report:

My local Lexus bought and tried the Black and Decker charger suggested by "Great Dane". They were quite excited, but unfortunately it did not work on a COMPLETELY flat Battery. Apparently is says so on the instruction leaflet. They will now test another charger - the trickle charger - while I will be away next month for four weeks. To do this they have to re-wire the cigarette lighter to be in the active position while the ignition is OFF. I hope this works. It will be better than nothing - but will mean leaving the car outside whenever I go away. Will report back after my return.

Ruth

[stevemate]

I am getting really hacked off with consant Battery failure. Tried to start the car this morning after 24 hour not used following a long motorway trip - Battery completly flat and would not even work the central locking.

My dealer was not interested last time I approached them but am going to try again. Has anyone tried persuing 'fit for purpose' claim is there is clrearly a design fault? Has anyone approached watchdog or something similar - trading standards?

Thanks

[NEV72]

I am getting really hacked off with consant battery failure. Tried to start the car this morning after 24 hour not used following a long motorway trip - battery completly flat and would not even work the central locking.

My dealer was not interested last time I approached them but am going to try again. Has anyone tried persuing 'fit for purpose' claim is there is clrearly a design fault? Has anyone approached watchdog or something similar - trading standards?

Thanks

Steve,

Whilst trolling on another site I noticed this, http://www.theultimatefinish.co.uk/Store/P...x?ProductId=104

Looks like what your looking for, hope it helps Nev ;)

[Unity]

I am getting really hacked off with consant battery failure. Tried to start the car this morning after 24 hour not used following a long motorway trip - battery completly flat and would not even work the central locking.

My dealer was not interested last time I approached them but am going to try again. Has anyone tried persuing 'fit for purpose' claim is there is clrearly a design fault? Has anyone approached watchdog or something similar - trading standards?

Thanks

Stevemate, I bought a 2 year old Rx400 sixth months ago and was completely and utterley horrifed when it had a flat Battery the day after I drove it home! I used the RAC membership to get it started and went for a drive to charge it up. But, low and behold the day after that it was flat again. I had a short and frank "discussion" with the dealership about it as soon as they opened and they came to collect the car and put a replacement auxiliary Battery in. Since then it has never failed to start. Even when I've sat in it for a while listening to the stereo and playing with the sat-nav for 40+ mins.

Anyway, my point is, it might well be better to get a new Battery fitted and have a reliable car rather than spending money on solutions that don't actually fix the root cause of the problem.

[Frustrated 400h]

I am getting really hacked off with consant battery failure. Tried to start the car this morning after 24 hour not used following a long motorway trip - battery completly flat and would not even work the central locking.

My dealer was not interested last time I approached them but am going to try again. Has anyone tried persuing 'fit for purpose' claim is there is clrearly a design fault? Has anyone approached watchdog or something similar - trading standards?

Thanks

Stevemate, I bought a 2 year old Rx400 sixth months ago and was completely and utterley horrifed when it had a flat Battery the day after I drove it home! I used the RAC membership to get it started and went for a drive to charge it up. But, low and behold the day after that it was flat again. I had a short and frank "discussion" with the dealership about it as soon as they opened and they came to collect the car and put a replacement auxiliary Battery in. Since then it has never failed to start. Even when I've sat in it for a while listening to the stereo and playing with the sat-nav for 40+ mins.

Anyway, my point is, it might well be better to get a new Battery fitted and have a reliable car rather than spending money on solutions that don't actually fix the root cause of the problem.

Well now - I have been reading these and several other discussions about Toyota failure to start problems. In the 13 months I have owned a 2006 RX400h Ihave had 5 failures, and 3 warranty replacement 12V batteries. Most failures after one to three weeks of no use. But once after one day following a 3 hour highway drive. I have tried verbally to impress two dealers and management at Lexus Canada's hotline, to no avail. They say its normal for this Battery powered car - I need to plug it in or disconnect the Battery when leaving it. But with a one day failure, and some of what I have read on chat groups, both of these seem impractical - everywhere I go I have to plug it in? Where do I find the plug, let alone the easy plug connection like an engine block heater? So my options now seem to be:

a) Sell it - but I like many other aspects of it.

b) Press the President of Toyota to fix it. Plug-in or Battery disconnection solutions do not seem appropriate or workable. Surely its just a software fix, since not all cars have this problem. The 12V charging is software controlled, so why not take charge from the 288V Battery when the 12V is low - as it does when "Ready?" (Maybe software is also related to why the electrics don't come on much in the city either - city gas mileage is about 30% worse than the highway (highway is as rated - about 32 miles per US gal).

c) Go to the press - which I am doing, having warned Lexus. I don't know if the two local major papers will pick up the story.

Got any other ideas?

Frustrated John

[stevemate]

Thanks for the comments. I have purchase a new Lexus Battery as the previous owner had changed it for a non-Lexus one (they obviously also had problems). Let see how I go on a new Battery. Watch this space.

Steve

[Unity]

Thanks for the comments. I have purchase a new Lexus battery as the previous owner had changed it for a non-Lexus one (they obviously also had problems). Let see how I go on a new battery. Watch this space.

Steve

Hopefully that will have it sorted Steve. It freaked me out when I thought I couldn't rely on it starting and that's why I bought a RAC Portable Power Station jobby. However, since Lexus changed the Battery I've never had to use the portable Battery and don't even carry it around anymore.

Good luck with it and let us know how it goes.

Cheers,

Unity

[Valkirk]

I would have to say if you have had the Battery replaced numerous times and it fails after short periods of time that would indicate a faulty alternator as it is obviosuly not charging the Battery while the car is running.

(Although as the hybrid is slightly more complex in terms of "running" this may also well be a software problem where the normal Battery is not being charged as the car doesn't register when the petrol engine kicks in as I am assuming the alternator only works when the petrol engine is running) either way I would suggest to Lexus they look at this angle rather than just replacing the Battery.....

[barnyscrap]

I AM A NEW MEMBER TO THIS FORUM,I AM HOPING SOMEBODY FROM LEXUS CUSTOMER RELATIONS IS READING THIS POST, I AM REALLY IMPRESSED WITH THE RX400H, BUT,THIS BUSINESS WITH THE SMALL STARTER BATTERY IS PATHETIC,IT NEEDS TO BE FIXED , I WILL NOT BUY THIS VEHICLE TILL THE PROBLEM IS SORTED,LEXUS SEEM TO BE HOPING THE PROBLEM GOES AWAY, HOW CAN A COMPANY THAT COMES FIRST FOR CUSTOMER RELATIONS TREAT THEM SO BADLY

Hi I am also a new member. Today I was going to go to our local Lexus dealer to book a test drive in a RX400h, before I went however I joined this forum.

Having read the problems people have had with starting their cars I didn't bother to book a test drive.

There is no way on earth I could consider swapping the Swiss-watch reliability of my Rav4 for a car that won't start.

I am totally shattered as the RX400 is the dream car I was going to treat myself to. But until Lexus sort out this problem I will keep my Toyota.

The problem is if Lexus cannot get it right, then where do I go to? Honda, Skoda?

[lfoggy]

I've had my RX400h for 14 months now and never had a problem even after leaving it unsused for up to a week. Clearly this problem doesn't affect all cars....

[williz]

I would have to say if you have had the battery replaced numerous times and it fails after short periods of time that would indicate a faulty alternator as it is obviosuly not charging the battery while the car is running.

(Although as the hybrid is slightly more complex in terms of "running" this may also well be a software problem where the normal battery is not being charged as the car doesn't register when the petrol engine kicks in as I am assuming the alternator only works when the petrol engine is running) either way I would suggest to Lexus they look at this angle rather than just replacing the battery.....

the RX400h is charging the Battery via an electronic inverter, so it is completely independent of the petrol engine. as soon as the "ready" is on (means the computer-systems are up and running), the 12V Battery is charged.

one of the problems is that maximum charging voltage is normally 13,9V (only if the Battery temperature gets down to zero degrees, voltage will be increased up to 14,5V). to fully charge a 12V Battery you have to increase charging voltage up to 14,5V. lexus is not doing so to increase Battery lifetime.

this means on the other hand that the 45Ah Battery in the RX400h normally never gets fully charged by the car itself, i would assume it will reach at maximum 80% of its full capacity by using 13,9V charging voltage.

this is another indication that the 45Ah Battery is absolutely to small for the car.

i needed about 6 jump starts with my RX400 over the last 3 years and all tests have shown that the Battery itself is OK.

[rufels]

During a commercial break one night the Black & Decker battery booster "popped" up.

Wonder whether that would be suitable to carry in the boot?

What do you think?

http://www.blackanddecker.co.uk/automotive...hierarchy/1744/

Dear Great Dane,

I took this up with Lexus. My Lexus agency thought it a good idea. I asked them to take it up with Lexus UK Technical Department on my behalf. They in turn also thought it a good idea, thought it should work, but before sanctioning its use, they will be testing it out in their workshop.

Hopefully we are getting somewhere.

I presume once it is shown to work via the cigarette lighter, all RX400h cars should be provided with one.

Thanks for the Booster suggestion!!

Ruth

Much time has passed since my last communication re the frequent flat Battery on my 400h- after leaving the car standing for 3-4weeks at a time. To recap: Having changed the Battery twice, we then investigated various methods of charging the small Battery. The Black and Decker starter via the cigarette lighter socket did not work. Lexus said it would not work on an ABSOLUTELY flat Battery. On my subsequent overseas trip, they tried the solar trickle charger via the cigarette lighter socket (after hot-wiring the socket to be connected with the ignition off) - this did not work either. There was just enough power to unlock the door, but that was it. So for my most recent trip, I was instructed how to disconnect the terminal of the Battery. This was much easier to do than I expected. The main problem on reconnecting however were minor electronic problems e.g. can't open all the windows from the drivers seat; the side mirrors no longer dip on reversing; of course I have lost all my saved satnav addresses, and such nuisances. These will all have to be re-set now. But that's the end of my long unsuccessful saga with Lexus and my Battery problem. So - thanks chaps for all your attempts to help.

Ruth

This is a follow-up report:

My local Lexus bought and tried the Black and Decker charger suggested by "Great Dane". They were quite excited, but unfortunately it did not work on a COMPLETELY flat Battery. Apparently is says so on the instruction leaflet. They will now test another charger - the trickle charger - while I will be away next month for four weeks. To do this they have to re-wire the cigarette lighter to be in the active position while the ignition is OFF. I hope this works. It will be better than nothing - but will mean leaving the car outside whenever I go away. Will report back after my return.

Ruth

[jaroph]

I've had my RX400h for 14 months now and never had a problem even after leaving it unsused for up to a week. Clearly this problem doesn't affect all cars....

Just to follow up on this thread...

I can report that after leaving my 400h for 4 weeks, it started first time this morning with no hiccups.

[crb]

did they say how the battery can explode? if they say it is because of a spark when you open/close the contact then ask them will it explode when the battery is changed or the leads removed also?

They told me that becuase the two batterieds are connected and there is a flow of high voltage power between them even when the car is switched off, I should not even think of inserting the Battery switch (mentioned by someone else on this page) as the main Battery could explode. I am thinking of investigating the solar trickle charger via the cigarette lighter socket.

mmm so if there is a flow when the ignition switch is off that means that something is drawing a load all the time - no load = no power flow. it is true that the hybrid batteries are high voltage approx 280V but there is still a normal 12V Battery.

As mentioned before and it has been something that i had my doubts about is the trickle charger via the cigar lighter - the plug is only active when the ignition is in the ACC position so a trickle charger is useless unless its connected directly to the Battery.

a quick look on the lexus.com site says if the vehicle is parked for longer than 30 days then Battery charging may be required.

so its obvois something in the system is drawing a constant current.

The clock etc. :shutit:

Hi

I had a similar problem and bought a solar trickle charge from Maplin leass than £15. At first I connected it via crocodile clips to the Battery terminal as the cigarette lighte works only on ACC. I then spoke to my Lexus dealer and asked them to wire it in so that I can connect it and place it on the dashboard whenever I want. The cost of the direct wiring was £120 ouch bnut better than having to deal with a flat Battery on a dark and wet night or for any other time for that matter.