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Lexus Is-f - Crunch Time


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I wanted to get everyone’s thoughts.

I have been reading a lot about the Lexus IS F.

The official figures state the following: 375 lb ft of Torque, 417 BHP, Top Speed 168 mph (restricted) and 0-62 MPH in 4.7 seconds.

I have a lot of respect for the M3 and RS 4 but I’m also a fan of Lexus especially considering how well they have done against their German competitors, but this is their first go at the Performance sector with the F brand. I have been told to never ever underestimate Lexus and I agree with that.

But I want to know from what we’ve all seen so far of the IS F, how will this do against it’s rivals (taking all factors into consideration, how will it do in the TESTS)

I would really appreciate unbiased opinions regardless of who you favour.

Thanks.

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Well Lexus are saying:

5.0litre (bigger than the competition)

402bhp

8 Sp Auto

500nM Torque (370lb/ft)

155 Retricted

0-60 4.9s

or at least that is what the Lexus Mag states.

Good luck Lexus - it's gonna have to be a drivers car to cut it in the UK - that numb steering in the standard UK car will have to be better - drive any Beemer and the steering gives you the "drive by the seat of your pants" experience...Lexus will have to do that too...time will tell, but it's not easy. That RS4 is still amazing - and the new one will be even faster and better - and Audi know how to make AWD systems better than anyone else. Add that to Journo bias's and it has to be exceptional to win plaudits in the UK...

It's key shortcomings could be in the drive...especially the final bit of handling and steering feedback....

They seem to love it where Uncle SAM is - just check out the youtube vids...

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Well Lexus are saying:

5.0litre (bigger than the competition)

402bhp

8 Sp Auto

500nM Torque (370lb/ft)

155 Retricted

0-60 4.9s

or at least that is what the Lexus Mag states.

Good luck Lexus - it's gonna have to be a drivers car to cut it in the UK - that numb steering in the standard UK car will have to be better - drive any Beemer and the steering gives you the "drive by the seat of your pants" experience...Lexus will have to do that too...time will tell, but it's not easy. That RS4 is still amazing - and the new one will be even faster and better - and Audi know how to make AWD systems better than anyone else. Add that to Journo bias's and it has to be exceptional to win plaudits in the UK...

It's key shortcomings could be in the drive...especially the final bit of handling and steering feedback....

They seem to love it where Uncle SAM is - just check out the youtube vids...

Thanks foe posting.

I'm very dissapointed, this is a Lexus related web-site and no one is posting?

I have done abit more research since my last post and the general view is the IS F is a different looking car some think it's ugly others think it looks "wicked" aggressive and has the power to deliver.

I recently read an article, and comments from one of the test drivers who drove the IS F said it's simply "amazing"

I think once we see one on the road, pulling up to the car park outside a Shop of some sort, we will all be "blown away"

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im interested :unsure:

I will do a big write up when i get back in a couple of weeks with pictures and a few small clips of it in action, i will give my opinions on whats good and bad!

im expecting good things but im going to keep my mind open, im sure that it will also have its draw backs??? :unsure:

Jason :P

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As far as i am concerned we can expect the usual Lexus luxury and a reliable well built car which is what Lexus are all about.However peoples opinions will no doubt differ,because it all depends what you think makes a good car and which measurements you choose to use when comparing it against other cars.It is well known that the Nurburgring lap time is the most important figure when discussing PERFORMANCE cars and most will agree that the quicker the lap time,the better the car.But it doesnt mean that all people use this scale, which is only normally referred too between enthusiasts and manufacturers.The average chap on the street who is deciding which dealer to go to for his performance car,most probably isnt gonna look at these times and probably isnt aware that this scale is even used amongst manufacturers when building cars to match rivals,in fact the chap on the street will most probably wait for Jeremy Clarkson to tell him which car is the best,or he will probably wait for some youtube vids which claim that an IS-F just killed an RS4 or an M3 in a straight line and then go and buy the Lex.

At the end of the day if the IS-F can prove its quicker or at least as quick as the M3 or RS4 around the ring,then it will definetely be given due respect,if it falls short then it could be heavily slated.Im not sure if other tests matter,if straight line performance is what a person wants to see,im sure there wont be a huge amount in it,but like i said before straight line performance is for wimps,its how it performs overall that matters,seeing as its a performance car.I have a feeling lexus are finalizing the car and they have an RS4 and an M3 in their lair and most probably would have designed the car to match them at least,remember the IS-f is basics,wait for the LF-a that is gonna be what they will really be concentrating on,and i bet they will tone down the IS-f,so as to not steal too much attention away from the LF-a.Its rumoured that BMW toned down their V8 in the new M3 as they were scared that it was entering M5 performance,which would make customers reason toward an M3 rather than the more expensive M5/M6.Either way Its gonna be a serious contender.

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I had a test drive in a GS450h the other week with one of the guys who is doing the IS-F testing in Seville (he used to drive BTTC), and they have done some comparisons with the M3 and RS4 and he says that certainly from their track days the IS-F outperforms both he really did rate it.

I just hope she who must be obeyed can get in it without getting car sick (which is why I had to get rid of my IS200 Sport).

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wait for the ring lap time!people can spout of all day,how in their opinion one out classes the other,but the truth of which is actually the better Performance car will be revealed soon,and if it is true that the IS-f outperforms both the RS4 and the M3 then we will know that cos it will be quicker around the ring than both,if not then we will know not to believe what we hear in the pub or watch on youtube.

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Check this out, the First Test http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans...008_lexus_is_f/

2008 Lexus IS F

POWERTRAIN/CHASSIS

Drivetrain layout Front engine, RWD

Engine type 90-degree V-8, aluminum block/heads

Valvetrain DOHC, 4 valves/cyl

Displacement 303.2 cu in/4969 cc

Compression ratio 11.8:1

Power (SAE net) 416 hp@6600 rpm

Torque (SAE net) 371 lb-ft @ 5200 rpm

Redline 6800 rpm

Weight to Power 09.1 lb/hp

Transmission 8-speed automatic

Axle/Final-drive ratios 2.94:1/2.01:1

Suspension, front; rear Control arms, coil springs, anti-roll bar; multilink, coil springs, anti-roll bar

Steering ratio 13.6:1

Turns lock-to-lock 2.9

Brakes, f;r 14.2-in vented, drilled disc; 13.6-in vented, drilled disc, ABS

Wheels, f;r 8.0 x 19 in; 9.0 x 19 in forged aluminum

Tires, f;r 225/40R19 93Y; 255/35R19 96Y Michelin Pilot Sport PS2

DIMENSIONS

Wheelbase 107.5 in

Track, f;r 61.4/59.6 in

Length x width x height 183.5 x 71.5 x 55.7 in

Turning circle 33.5 ft

Curb weight 3805 lb

Weight dist, f/r 54/46%

Seating capacity 4

Headroom, f/r 37.2/36.7 in

Legroom, f/r 43.9/30.6

Shoulder room, f/r 54.4/52.7 in

Cargo volume 13.3 cu ft

TEST DATA

Acceleration to mph

0-30 1.8 sec

0-40 2.7

0-50 3.6

0-60 4.7

0-70 5.9

0-80 7.2

0-90 8.6

0-100 10.5

Passing, 45-65 mph 2.2

Quarter mile 13.0 sec @ 111.7 mph

Braking, 60-0 mph 106 ft

Lateral acceleration 0.91 g, avg

MT Figure Eight 24.5 sec @ 0.78 g, avg

Top-gear revs @ 60 mph 1600 rpm

CONSUMER INFO

Base Price $60,000 (est)

Price As Tested $64,000 (est)

Stability/traction control Yes/yes

Airbags Dual front, front side, f/r curtain, front knee

Basic warranty 4 yrs/50,000 miles

Powertrain warranty 6 yrs/70,000 miles

Roadside assistance 4 years/Unlimited

Fuel capacity 16.9 gal

EPA city/hwy econ 16/23 mpg (est)

CO2 Emissions 1.05 lb/mile (est)

Recommended fuel Premium

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just to give you an idea of what competition its against,in this test the M3 comes first,it seems the RS4 is old now and not up to the job.

http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/14...w-M3.html?al=98

RS4 is being replaced...it was a fine car anyway, but the replacement will most likely blow away the IS-F and M3.

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i know mate,its a silly race.They stopped building the RS4 the day the M3 was revealed.The new RS5 will blow away the new M3,however the CSL is being released in MAY 2008 which is going to shaft the RS5(which apparently is going down the lightweight csl route).Each car is amazingly good,one is a fraction quicker than the other-but at the end of the day in real day to day performance terms,there is very little in it.

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i know mate,its a silly race.They stopped building the RS4 the day the M3 was revealed.The new RS5 will blow away the new M3,however the CSL is being released in MAY 2008 which is going to shaft the RS5(which apparently is going down the lightweight csl route).Each car is amazingly good,one is a fraction quicker than the other-but at the end of the day in real day to day performance terms,there is very little in it.

Sounds like it needs more development....

0710_1_z%202008_lexus_isf%20dyno_graph.jpg

QUOTEYou're in a compact sedan with a 5.0-liter, 416-hp V-8 with four-valve Yamaha heads that contain titanium intake valves. Where do you head? The dyno, of course.

And so we did. The fellas at Ralph Willis Automotive in Salinas, California cleared their schedule for us to sneak the IS-F onto their DynoJet dynamometer. The results, as you can see from the chart below, are impressive. The IS-F is rated at 416 hp and 371 lb-ft of torque at the engine - and it delivered 333 of those horses and 318 lb-ft of torque to its rear wheels.

Those are impressive numbers given that the engine's output is funneled through an eight-speed automatic transmission. And how do they compare to the competition?

An RS4 we tested (see the link below to the full story) put out a very close 331 horsepower (and 276 lb-ft of torque) to its wheels. We should mention that the RS4 was tested on a Dynapack, which may be calibrated differently than the DynoJet model used for the Lexus.

As always, it's not the peak numbers of a dyno graph that are important, it's the shape of the torque curve. The Lexus' torque builds in a linear fashion as revs rise, but then things get a little hairy. Torque dips slightly between 4500 and 5000 rpm, and then peaks at 5200.

What happens afterward is disappointing - the curve drops off steeply, confirming our seat-of-the-pants impression that the engine is running out of breath. If you compare the shape of the curve to the RS4's, you'll notice that the RS4's V-8 doesn't make as much peak torque (it is, after all, 800cc smaller) but its twist is distributed much more evenly over a long rpm range. And from 6500 rpm up, where the Lexus is simply done, it continues pulling - all the way to over 8000 rpm.

The IS-F's V-8 certainly produces a lot of power and torque. We wish, however, that it didn't have such a steep dropoff in torque at high revs - that kind of rev-happy motor would suit the IS-F's track-star personality much better.

0710_z1%202008_lexus_isf%20left_front_view.jpg

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i know mate,its a silly race.They stopped building the RS4 the day the M3 was revealed.The new RS5 will blow away the new M3,however the CSL is being released in MAY 2008 which is going to shaft the RS5(which apparently is going down the lightweight csl route).Each car is amazingly good,one is a fraction quicker than the other-but at the end of the day in real day to day performance terms,there is very little in it.

Sounds like it needs more development....

0710_1_z%202008_lexus_isf%20dyno_graph.jpg

QUOTEYou're in a compact sedan with a 5.0-liter, 416-hp V-8 with four-valve Yamaha heads that contain titanium intake valves. Where do you head? The dyno, of course.

And so we did. The fellas at Ralph Willis Automotive in Salinas, California cleared their schedule for us to sneak the IS-F onto their DynoJet dynamometer. The results, as you can see from the chart below, are impressive. The IS-F is rated at 416 hp and 371 lb-ft of torque at the engine - and it delivered 333 of those horses and 318 lb-ft of torque to its rear wheels.

Those are impressive numbers given that the engine's output is funneled through an eight-speed automatic transmission. And how do they compare to the competition?

An RS4 we tested (see the link below to the full story) put out a very close 331 horsepower (and 276 lb-ft of torque) to its wheels. We should mention that the RS4 was tested on a Dynapack, which may be calibrated differently than the DynoJet model used for the Lexus.

As always, it's not the peak numbers of a dyno graph that are important, it's the shape of the torque curve. The Lexus' torque builds in a linear fashion as revs rise, but then things get a little hairy. Torque dips slightly between 4500 and 5000 rpm, and then peaks at 5200.

What happens afterward is disappointing - the curve drops off steeply, confirming our seat-of-the-pants impression that the engine is running out of breath. If you compare the shape of the curve to the RS4's, you'll notice that the RS4's V-8 doesn't make as much peak torque (it is, after all, 800cc smaller) but its twist is distributed much more evenly over a long rpm range. And from 6500 rpm up, where the Lexus is simply done, it continues pulling - all the way to over 8000 rpm.

The IS-F's V-8 certainly produces a lot of power and torque. We wish, however, that it didn't have such a steep dropoff in torque at high revs - that kind of rev-happy motor would suit the IS-F's track-star personality much better.

0710_z1%202008_lexus_isf%20left_front_view.jpg

Its an auto, and i thought you dont put auto's on a dyno :question: well some say you dont :shutit:

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Its an auto, and i thought you dont put auto's on a dyno :question: well some say you dont :shutit:

Well I've posted it on WIM with that same comment..... :whistling: but I think the 8 speed auto transmission is different in that it only uses the torque converter in manual mode for the 1st gear, then from 2nd through 8th it locks up. It's mentioned here: http://www.thecarconnection.com/Vehicle_Re...13557.html?pg=3

Thing that make me angry/sad/frustrated is that I can buy the IS-F in the US for less than I paid for my IS250 SE-L in the UK... :unsure:

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i know that is a bad situation.I paid £23 k for my 2002 M3 and i could have had a brand new one in the states for that money in dollars.As far as the IS-f is concerned,id be surprised if Lexus are even bothered if the RS4 or M3 beat it.I think its being built as the soft version of Lexus power.I think Lexus are going to kick ***** with LF-A and any other cars they decide to produce.Lexus first of all need to be welcomed to the performance stage and then prove themselves,i feel this is just a warm up for things to come.

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i know that is a bad situation.I paid £23 k for my 2002 M3 and i could have had a brand new one in the states for that money in dollars.As far as the IS-f is concerned,id be surprised if Lexus are even bothered if the RS4 or M3 beat it.I think its being built as the soft version of Lexus power.I think Lexus are going to kick ***** with LF-A and any other cars they decide to produce.Lexus first of all need to be welcomed to the performance stage and then prove themselves,i feel this is just a warm up for things to come.

Yep totally agree, what's more annoying is why is it cheaper to produce a RHD car as a LHD and ship to the US than just shipping a RHD car to the uk? Do they ship them on cruise liners? :angry:

I still think the M3 is the better drivers car though than the RS4, not driven either but RS4 doesn't seem to have enough of a rear drive bias to make it look balanced, does appear they've cured it with the R8 though :D

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IS F is going to kick some aR3M4MG4A

"The car is BRUTAL on the track ,but, we now need to see it on the public roads",

I say whren it beats that test in a mighty 5.0 litre V8 fashion, which other Test will it have to pass?

because from what I have read thus far. the first impresion reviews have all been good, even some reluctently

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where does it say its brutal on track?have we got the ring lap time yet(the only figure thats really important when comparing a performance car).If it doesnt beat the RS4,M3,C63AMG on the ring,then no one,i mean no one considering a serious performance car is going to want to buy the slowest of the bunch-and lets face it,its probably going to work out more expensive than the others.Road tests?what for,so we can see which is quicker off the lights?the IS-f is going to be plenty quick enough to dispose of any regular road car and is going to be monstrously fast for UK limits,however its not proved anything yet and its certainly not been directly compared with any of the competition yet.Can you point me to some IS-f reviews please,so i can see exactly where all this hype is coming from.I really want the Is-f to be great,but i want some hard evidence that it is awesome-not just hearsay or peoples personal opinions.

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Forget the numbers. Unfortunately, there are a lot of anti-Lexus journos out there, so the car with undoubtedly live up (or down) to their expectations.

For me, it's about freedom of choice - everyone has different priorities / needs / pre-conceptions when buying a car; I just want something that puts a smile on my face after a crap day at work, and has bullet-proof reliability. It also helps that the IS is still reasonably rare in these parts, unlike its competitors, so it feels special.

So what if the Audi/Beemer next to you at the lights has 4 more horsepower? Buy what you love and enjoy it.

All the best

Amanda

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in any case 4hp isnt really much of an issue when comparing two cars,however suggesting to ignore the figures when the original discussion is about how the IS-F compares to the competition is a little silly,cos lap times,0-60 times,1/4mile runs etc are extremely relevant to the buyers of these cars and more often than not is the reason they go for one over the other.

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Forget the numbers. Unfortunately, there are a lot of anti-Lexus journos out there, so the car with undoubtedly live up (or down) to their expectations.

For me, it's about freedom of choice - everyone has different priorities / needs / pre-conceptions when buying a car; I just want something that puts a smile on my face after a crap day at work, and has bullet-proof reliability. It also helps that the IS is still reasonably rare in these parts, unlike its competitors, so it feels special.

So what if the Audi/Beemer next to you at the lights has 4 more horsepower? Buy what you love and enjoy it.

All the best

Amanda

you said it the Lexus has the (reliability) and with that. if it turns out as good as the M3 and the RS, then i think more will go for the Lexus

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I'm just amazed that the Lexus mag has 12 less BHP stated in it for the same car. Is the one we're getting in the UK less powered? Or whe it says a "minimum of 404bhp" they were trying to stay tight lipped? Well either way, it's gonna have no more HP than anything else out of the contenders...

Either way, it'll be interesting. There are loads of drag races in an IS-F on Youtube, some great ones at Laguna Seca, but remember - most of the comments from Journo's saying how good the ISF is are American ones, where people see hard suspensions and cars that corner like they're on rails as being odd...so no German car will ever win fairly there...and they have a love afair with Lexus too - like everyone says on here they are so cheap there especially compared to BMW's and german cars. So it's bound to win.

If Lexus do price them at over £45k, there won't be many bought at all...unless it really is good and it wins in the car mag battles...I certainly wouldn't buy a new car again. Having travelled to different countries this year - it is shocki9ng why we spend so much. We should all boycott new cars - just stop buyig them. That way the manufacturers would have to lower the prices...Oh forgot - most sales are to lease companies here...who get them very cheap...it's just the poor joe bloggs buying himself who gets stung...

On the other hand, any one spending this sort of cash on a compact supercar car will be swayed by what the stats state.

OBTW, remember that Audi now have the S6 engine to play with too - 5.2 V10 with 429bhp , which I'm sure could be tuned to over 500bhp. They also seems to have sorted out the chassis since the A6 came out. It's all in the steering feedback - which BMW have nailed down very well...and Audi have almost caught up...

WTS...the German makers won't take a Japanese car coming into their terra lightly! It could get messy!

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I've seen it in the flesh, so to speak and my main beef is it's looks. It's obviously still a second generation IS but IMO it lacks the refinement of the competition in the overall appearance. Some of the performance mods like the side vents, the V8 badge and the bulbous bonnet look bolted on, rather than seamlessly integrated. Even compared to the 'old' RS4 it looked second rate.

If I was paying $63K (under £31K) for the car as they will in the U.S. I could live with it, and with the price of fuel in the U.S. I could also live with the 16 mpg, but for the £50K+ its going to cost in the UK..no way.

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