Petrol Or Diesel?

[Rich13]

ANOTHER UPDATE

I took delivery of my brand new Lexus IS250 SE MM Auto today and absolutely love it! Have spend all day thinking up excuses to take it for a drive. It's in Cadoxton Slate and looks great. Will post some pictures as soon as I have stop driving it long enough to take some :D

[Matus]

congrats!

[Matus]

Why no one has created a Diesel Hybrid I'll never know...I suppose you'd jump out of your skin each time the oiler clanged into life...it wouldn't be seamless at all...and you wouldn't have to watch those coloured arrows on the display to know what was pedalling you along

That made me laugh - lots :lol:

Thank you!

but do you know how close he is to the truth?

New beemer 120d has this feature (swithing off the engine on lights) and all people who drove it had to switch it off, it was so bad.

[dazed]

but do you know how close he is to the truth?

New beemer 120d has this feature (swithing off the engine on lights) and all people who drove it had to switch it off, it was so bad.

Is this how BMW have managed to magically reduce their quoted CO2 emmissions by 20% or so this year?

I thought it all sounded too good to be true.

[dazed]

Back on topic. I've driven both (220d and 250 auto) and I'd pick the petrol everytime.

IMHO they're poles apart - totally different cars really.

The diesel is a competent performer (and probably won't let you down), but it isn't particularly refined or economical by modern standards. The gearbox is also pretty rough and slow to shift, especially the first couple of gears.

The petrol on the otherhand is very refined and quiet. The auto gearbox is wonderfully smooth - you have a job to detect the gear shifts, partly because the engine is so quiet. It's also remarkably efficient for a V6 petrol auto - I was getting about 36mpg on a mix of driving with a slight bias towards dual carriageway cruising.

As a private buyer I'd opt for the petrol (and sacrifice the MM option to keep the price under control!) without any hesitation.

If I was adamant that I wanted to go down the diesel route I'd probably opt for a BMW 320d which IMHO has a more refined engine, slicker gearbox and better fuel economy.

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

Back on topic. I've driven both (220d and 250 auto) and I'd pick the petrol everytime.

IMHO they're poles apart - totally different cars really.

The diesel is a competent performer (and probably won't let you down), but it isn't particularly refined or economical by modern standards. The gearbox is also pretty rough and slow to shift, especially the first couple of gears.

The petrol on the otherhand is very refined and quiet. The auto gearbox is wonderfully smooth - you have a job to detect the gear shifts, partly because the engine is so quiet. It's also remarkably efficient for a V6 petrol auto - I was getting about 36mpg on a mix of driving with a slight bias towards dual carriageway cruising.

As a private buyer I'd opt for the petrol (and sacrifice the MM option to keep the price under control!) without any hesitation.

If I was adamant that I wanted to go down the diesel route I'd probably opt for a BMW 320d which IMHO has a more refined engine, slicker gearbox and better fuel economy.

You've said it all :winky:

The BMW switching engines off sounds fine in theory, but the govt tests (if I remember correctly) are all motion related with no stopping taken into consideration.

Someone posted a link to this test, what MPH, distance etc for each test. Does anyone have it?

[Exiled]

Back on topic. I've driven both (220d and 250 auto) and I'd pick the petrol everytime.

IMHO they're poles apart - totally different cars really.

The diesel is a competent performer (and probably won't let you down), but it isn't particularly refined or economical by modern standards. The gearbox is also pretty rough and slow to shift, especially the first couple of gears.

The petrol on the otherhand is very refined and quiet. The auto gearbox is wonderfully smooth - you have a job to detect the gear shifts, partly because the engine is so quiet. It's also remarkably efficient for a V6 petrol auto - I was getting about 36mpg on a mix of driving with a slight bias towards dual carriageway cruising.

As a private buyer I'd opt for the petrol (and sacrifice the MM option to keep the price under control!) without any hesitation.

If I was adamant that I wanted to go down the diesel route I'd probably opt for a BMW 320d which IMHO has a more refined engine, slicker gearbox and better fuel economy.

Dazed, it could have been me writing that. Had 30mins in a 220d and the same time in a 250 auto last Saturday. IMO you have got it absolutely spot on, including MM, couldn't comment on the 36mpg though as I didn't check. They've offered me one for the day so I'm going to try and arrange my own group test of a car a day for 3 days.

[dazed]

Dazed, it could have been me writing that. Had 30mins in a 220d and the same time in a 250 auto last Saturday. IMO you have got it absolutely spot on, including MM, couldn't comment on the 36mpg though as I didn't check. They've offered me one for the day so I'm going to try and arrange my own group test of a car a day for 3 days.

Cheers Exiled. Glad to hear that my findings chimed with someone else.

I did the test drives back to back and covered near identical routes. The MM option would really have been a bit of an indulgence in any case as I always know where I'm going and the basic audio system is good enough for my old ears!

I also thought that the central arm rest made access to the 220d gear stick slightly awkward. I'm sure I'd have got used to it, but it did strike me as slightly less ergonomic than other cars I've driven recently.

I suspect the 36mpg was better than most will achieve (particularly those who live in urban areas). But in my case , it's definitely better than the 32mpg that I currently average with my trusty old 2 litre auto Accord.

I'm sold on the 250 auto and if necessary I'll wait a few months and save the extra money that I'll probably need. As they say, good things come to those who wait......

[Exiled]

Dazed, it could have been me writing that. Had 30mins in a 220d and the same time in a 250 auto last Saturday. IMO you have got it absolutely spot on, including MM, couldn't comment on the 36mpg though as I didn't check. They've offered me one for the day so I'm going to try and arrange my own group test of a car a day for 3 days.

Cheers Exiled. Glad to hear that my findings chimed with someone else.

I did the test drives back to back and covered near identical routes. The MM option would really have been a bit of an indulgence in any case as I always know where I'm going and the basic audio system is good enough for my old ears!

I also thought that the central arm rest made access to the 220d gear stick slightly awkward. I'm sure I'd have got used to it, but it did strike me as slightly less ergonomic than other cars I've driven recently.

I suspect the 36mpg was better than most will achieve (particularly those who live in urban areas). But in my case , it's definitely better than the 32mpg that I currently average with my trusty old 2 litre auto Accord.

I'm sold on the 250 auto and if necessary I'll wait a few months and save the extra money that I'll probably need. As they say, good things come to those who wait......

Uncanny, I'm on old sod who never goes anywhere new and like you probably going a bit deaf to boot!

With regard to "ergonomics" I find a cup of Horlicks at bedtime helps.

[VrmmVrmm]

UPDATE

Just thought I would give you all an update. I spent the morning at the LEXUS dealership in Bradford. They gave me a IS250 SE Auto for an hour so I could take it for a proper drive. The difference from the 220 was instantly noticeable, it was like driving a different car! After many many hours of negotiation I have placed and order for a IS250 SE Auto with Multimedia. Should arrive on the 16th Nov so not too long to wait. Went for a brand new one in Cadoxton Slate with Pembroke Black interior. Did look at getting it without the multimedia but after playing with it for a bit I decided to blow the budget and spend the extra £55 a month to get it, may live to regret it but at least I'll have plenty of toys to distract me... :D

Thanks again for your help, I'll post some pictures when it arrives.

I've been saying it for almost a year now the IS 220D...it is a different car!...very different...and like Matus I also think its the best diesel in its class.

Nothing compares in this class re:Style, Appearance and Interior finish...for its money nothing comes anywhere near (last two cars E200 Mercedes)

You've just got to get used to it and when you do its a mavellous car. I agree its a great pity that it has not an automatic gearbox...it would be a plus.

But I think if it had, it would be much more expensive.

[Matus]

BMW 320d which IMHO has a more refined engine, slicker gearbox and better fuel economy.

thats true. But this is all what this car can provide.

Interior is rattly, looks crap, suspension is too stiff, way too understeery, tires are expensive (RFT), you have no spare, and with same equipment its about 6k pounds more expensive than IS220d

:)

If you are deciding between IS220d SE-L with MM and IS250 SE Auto, go for IS250... thats clear. Petrol suits this car.

But I disagree with you about the beemer diesel. Yes, its perfect in disciplines you mentioned, but in other disciplines it is loser.

IS220d is more refined and the whole package is consistent. Maybe no ups, but also no downs. And that is why I still think, that it IS220d still the best diesel car in its class.

I am curious about new A4, but current 2.0tdi PD engine is so bad, that it cannot be compared with D4D 180k engine. And 2,7tdi price will be in different universe.

[swager]

Back on topic. I've driven both (220d and 250 auto) and I'd pick the petrol everytime.

IMHO they're poles apart - totally different cars really.

The diesel is a competent performer (and probably won't let you down), but it isn't particularly refined or economical by modern standards. The gearbox is also pretty rough and slow to shift, especially the first couple of gears.

The petrol on the otherhand is very refined and quiet. The auto gearbox is wonderfully smooth - you have a job to detect the gear shifts, partly because the engine is so quiet. It's also remarkably efficient for a V6 petrol auto - I was getting about 36mpg on a mix of driving with a slight bias towards dual carriageway cruising.

As a private buyer I'd opt for the petrol (and sacrifice the MM option to keep the price under control!) without any hesitation.

If I was adamant that I wanted to go down the diesel route I'd probably opt for a BMW 320d which IMHO has a more refined engine, slicker gearbox and better fuel economy.

spot on dazed- started to leave the IS 250 auto mm in the garage over the weekends as the 320D M sport auto coupe is drivind like a dream - average 45-48 mpg with only 3k on the clock - not a rattle in ear shot - auto box smooth -handles well with no under steer ??? great engine with Max torque (Nm/rpm) 350/1750 it pulls like a train .Still say Lexus got it wrong as a manufacture and miss a big market share not having a auto oil burner .

still love the IS 250 sel auto mm and will still go for another lexus in the new year - maybe the GS 450H .

swager

[stuie]

Ive been thinking about the new IS series myself and yes the 250 petrol does look like the best one to go for however what about for those that spend their life in traffic jams and want to reduce things like yearly tax bills etc is the 220d really tht bad a car or is it just that people have no experience with diesel driving hence why they are having problems

[Northern Boys Luv Gravy]

Ive been thinking about the new IS series myself and yes the 250 petrol does look like the best one to go for however what about for those that spend their life in traffic jams and want to reduce things like yearly tax bills etc is the 220d really tht bad a car or is it just that people have no experience with diesel driving hence why they are having problems

If you spend time in traffic jams then the IS250 Auto is definitely the one to go for - you are so comfortable and relaxed that the hold ups don't bother you half so much. As people have said earlier if you have to sacrifice the (IMO vastly overpriced) MM to get a an auto then go for it - you won't regret it.

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

Ive been thinking about the new IS series myself and yes the 250 petrol does look like the best one to go for however what about for those that spend their life in traffic jams and want to reduce things like yearly tax bills etc is the 220d really tht bad a car or is it just that people have no experience with diesel driving hence why they are having problems

I've been driving diesels for 7 years...and could get almost 800 miles out of a diesel tank in my old car (70litres) and not drive like a slouch...

You really need to consider them for yourself...and bear in mind that in city driving and in heavy traffic, the refinement of an Auto is what most people want! Personally I'm not keen on the Manual IS250 - not a lot happens in that until you get to over 4000RPM and cars like the BMW320i Manual (expecially the new 170bhp) make much more sense from an Economy and CO2 perspective (but not VFM). If you want a Lexus however, drive each one for at least 2-3 hours, and get your partner/friend to drive and comment also...

The 220d is supposedly the cleanest diesel from a local particulate perspective, an had they made an Automatic version it would be a pretty good choice. The fact that the IS250 Auto is just so much more refined and nearly as economical (<10/15%) means that it is the safest choice for most people doing moderate to high miles...that's my honest opinion...others will have their own!!

Like I say, only you can decide! This diesel .v. Petrol argument has been going on for almost 18 months here and I'm often surprised how many people still buy the diesel...

[mnobleuk]

I've had my 220d SE for a month now - and I'm getting around 35mpg (by fuel in vs miles driven rather than the computer) in really really bad driving conditions (my IS200 gave 26mpg in the same conditions). It is my first diesel and I have to say I went to the dealers being totally anti diesel and looking for a used IS250.

They did such a good deal on a new 220d SE that I went for it and I have to say I am very happy. The torque is excellent and it actually feels a bit pokier than the IS200 despite being obviously heavier. I cant use 6th gear yet even when cruising at 80. Best I've got is a run of 100 miles on A roads which averaged 45 mpg (according to the computer). If when the car loosens up I get better mpg then I will be extremely happy indeed.

[stuie]

The only thing is I wouldn't buy the auto anyway I prefer the feeling of being more in control and prefer driving a manual anyway

Sounds like a 220d is the way to go plus point being its not 3-400 quid a year to tax