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when you have it all Rob I'll know who to ask :lol:

i'm sure you will fella!! :lol:

seriously though.....there is SOOOOOOOOOOO much to learn!!

its actually really really interesting, but takes time to understand and appreciate.

you will be buying a da polisher once the bug gets you.

wanna stick to hand detailing mate as i dont trust myself with a DA polisher :whistling: :shutit:

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so clay car, then apply paint cleaner?? then wash, then use paintwork sealant and glaze??

no,clay car, then paint cleaner,no wash,then glaze and finally sealant.if you put sealant on before glaze,the glaze will strip the sealant because it is a polish.

Which glaze are we talking about? No glaze I know of removes a sealant layer, unless you're talking about Lime Prime, which isn't a glaze.

Glazes, inc. Lime Prime Lite, contain no micro-abrasives, and leave a layer of oils on the surface to enhance depth/wetness, but only carnauba waxes can make use of this, as a selant 'bonds' to the paint/clearcoat entirely differently to a carnauba wax.

So, if you plan on using a glaze, make sure it's directly on the paintwork, with a carnauba wax over the top.

If you plan on using a sealant, make sure it's to a functionally clean paintwork, and if you so desire, throw a layer of carnauba wax over the top of that - but you'll be struggling to notice any appreciable difference.

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what other easy to use and cheapish sealants would u reccomend??

when u say wash and rinse.....i presume i have to chamois dry before claying etc??

Invest in a couple of good microfiber towels and buffing cloths, and ditch the chamois.

If you want to hide swirls you've picked up through car washes, poor wash techniques, chamois drying, etc, then you'll be hard pushed to fault a £15 tin of Bilt Hamber Auto Balm.

In fact, as this is about clay bars, I'd planned on recommending their Auto clay, which unlike traditional bars, uses just plain old ordinary tap water. It's also 200g, compared to the 80g the Meguiar's and 100-120g others are.

A full kit - clay, balm, and wash is £30, and the shampoo is one of the most concentrated on the market. Nothing bar functional cleaning ingredients are in it - unlike some other companies' shampoos, which are laced with bulking agents.

So, your regime should be:

Rinse car first

Wash - you are using a sheepskin mitt (www.sheepskinshop.co.uk) and a separate rinse only bucket, rinsing after every panel?

clay - the wetter the better to prevent any marring

Rewash

Dry

LSP - last stage product/protection

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so clay car, then apply paint cleaner?? then wash, then use paintwork sealant and glaze??

no,clay car, then paint cleaner,no wash,then glaze and finally sealant.if you put sealant on before glaze,the glaze will strip the sealant because it is a polish.

Which glaze are we talking about? No glaze I know of removes a sealant layer, unless you're talking about Lime Prime, which isn't a glaze.

Glazes, inc. Lime Prime Lite, contain no micro-abrasives, and leave a layer of oils on the surface to enhance depth/wetness, but only carnauba waxes can make use of this, as a selant 'bonds' to the paint/clearcoat entirely differently to a carnauba wax.

So, if you plan on using a glaze, make sure it's directly on the paintwork, with a carnauba wax over the top.

If you plan on using a sealant, make sure it's to a functionally clean paintwork, and if you so desire, throw a layer of carnauba wax over the top of that - but you'll be struggling to notice any appreciable difference.

the term glaze in the true meaning is a very fine polish,the trouble is that over the years these meanings have been distorted and changed by manufacturers.therefore careful examination of the product and its properties is very important as to the use you have for it and weather you will be using sealant or wax,polished bliss have a comprehensive guide and is worth a visit.ultimately you have to find what works best for you through trial and error.
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I don't know where you think you've been lead to believe the term glaze means very fine polish - it hasn't done, afaik.

People did and still do, misrepresent Lime Prime as a glaze, putting in on a par with Zymöl's HD Cleanse and Swissvax's Cleaner Fluid - neither or which have any abrasiveness to their composition.

A glaze has always been something designed to give an extra depth/wetness to the paint's finish once overlaid with the chosen wax (carnauba).

Anything that has abrasives is by nature, a polish - e.g. AG SRP.

It's a bit like the misunderstanding that Snow Foam is only a pre-wash treatment, rather than a fully functional shampoo - which it is.

Trial and error is one way of doing things - another is to listen to others who've been there and done it, or have researched the heck out of the industry, and ascertained who spins and hypes their products versus those who don't and produce good honest kit at fair prices.

Polished Bliss are certainly well respected when it comes to detailing.

At the end of the day, the whole LSP element is about 5-10% of the equation, the rest is the preparation to get as mirror-like a finish to your paintwork.

In other words, any LSP is only ever the cherry on top of the cake, no matter how much money you throw at it.

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I don't know where you think you've been lead to believe the term glaze means very fine polish - it hasn't done, afaik.

People did and still do, misrepresent Lime Prime as a glaze, putting in on a par with Zymöl's HD Cleanse and Swissvax's Cleaner Fluid - neither or which have any abrasiveness to their composition.

A glaze has always been something designed to give an extra depth/wetness to the paint's finish once overlaid with the chosen wax (carnauba).

Anything that has abrasives is by nature, a polish - e.g. AG SRP.

It's a bit like the misunderstanding that Snow Foam is only a pre-wash treatment, rather than a fully functional shampoo - which it is.

Trial and error is one way of doing things - another is to listen to others who've been there and done it, or have researched the heck out of the industry, and ascertained who spins and hypes their products versus those who don't and produce good honest kit at fair prices.

Polished Bliss are certainly well respected when it comes to detailing.

At the end of the day, the whole LSP element is about 5-10% of the equation, the rest is the preparation to get as mirror-like a finish to your paintwork.

In other words, any LSP is only ever the cherry on top of the cake, no matter how much money you throw at it.

Below is the text copied from the polished bliss web site. It clearly explains the position on glazes and also says that you can apply sealant over glaze where as, you state that only wax can be applied over glaze. See copied text below:

"Glazes are a seemingly misunderstood category of polishing products, perhaps because of confusion caused by the naming of certain products. In the true sense of the word, a glaze is a pure polish that does not contain any abrasives or cleaning agents. Glazes are designed to improve the brilliance and clarity of painted surfaces, and mask or visually reduce the extent of any remaining imperfections. In order to do this, glazes typically comprise mineral oils that enhance the wetness and richness of the finish, and kaolin (China Clay), which fills and hides minor swirl marks and other flaws. Somewhat confusingly, some glazes only contain mineral oils, meaning that they do not have any masking abilities, and some products that are called glazes actually comprise fine abrasive particles and solvent-based polishing agents, meaning that they are not glazes in the true sense of the word. We therefore recommend that you read product descriptions carefully before choosing an appropriate glaze.

A few important points should be noted about the use of glazes. Firstly, glazes are underused in the UK. In our opinion, it is far better to apply a glaze on a regular basis and hide any defects rather than polish your paint with abrasives on a regular basis. We only tend to polish our own cars with abrasive polishes once a year, and in the intervening period we use glazes to keep them looking good. Our reasoning for this is very simple - every time you use an abrasive polish you remove a further fraction of your clear coat. Do this too often and you risk compromising the integrity of your clear coat. Keeping daily drivers looking good is hard, but glazes offer a convenient solution that avoids the risk of over polishing. Secondly, once a glaze is applied you should apply wax or sealant protection immediately, in order to seal in the fillers. Whatever you do, you should never apply any product containing solvent-based cleaning agents over a glaze, as the fillers and the oils will be stripped away."

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A sealant adheres to the paintwork differently from a carnauba wax, and as such, the use of a glaze prior to applying the sealant is eschewed by the manufacturers.

I can only surmise the sealants used, have displaced the oils of the glaze, and therefore the glaze step was a waste of time or effort.

Their attempt to pigeon hole glaze makes no sense. A polish is just that - it chemically or mechanically reacts/removes an amount of the paint/clearcoat.

A glaze in the truest sense, does neither, and only serves to increase depth and/or wetness.

They mention some contain abrasives - well, if that's a reference to Dodo Juice Lime Prime, they are fundamentally wrong in presuming it is a glaze, since Dodo themselves don't claim it to be. Their new LP Lite is, since it is designed to serve only the glaze function - nothing more. No filling, which again is not something a glaze should be doing.

I could go on, but I'll leave it there, and say that they've not really explained things very well - in fact, almost serving to confuse the issue more.

If I can find a better explanation, I'll post it up, but take it from me, glazes under sealants are pretty much a no-no.

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  • 4 weeks later...

i do:

wash/rinse/dry

claybar (meguairs)

paint cleanser (p21)

Car-Lack 68 Nano Systematic Care

Car-Lack 68 Long Life Sealant

p21 wax (tho mite switch to collinite when this tub is finished)

is that reasonable?

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i do:

wash/rinse/dry

claybar (meguairs)

paint cleanser (p21)

Car-Lack 68 Nano Systematic Care

Car-Lack 68 Long Life Sealant

p21 wax (tho mite switch to collinite when this tub is finished)

is that reasonable?

nsc will clean your paint,so you would'nt need to use the p21 paint cleaner.
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i do:

wash/rinse/dry

claybar (meguairs)

paint cleanser (p21)

Car-Lack 68 Nano Systematic Care

Car-Lack 68 Long Life Sealant

p21 wax (tho mite switch to collinite when this tub is finished)

is that reasonable?

nsc will clean your paint,so you would'nt need to use the p21 paint cleaner.

yep, agree with the above. no need for the paint cleaner. you'll be amazed how much more stuff comes off with the NSC even after claying....

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