I've A Very Bad Problem! Help!

[knitware]

Hello. I shall try and explain this ‘problem’ as best as I can.

This has happened twice since I bought the car last week and it scares the s*** out of me.

Today, coming home from the shops I line the car up with my driveway and prepare to drive up it. My driveway has a slight incline. I am doing about 2-3mph if that. My foot is off the gas and I’m slowing the car and keeping control with the foot brake.

I’m creeping up the incline nice and slow when the car’s revs increase and the car surges forward, (remember, my foot is OFF the gas), towards my house wall! I slam the brakes hard, enough for the ABS to click a few times. I then come to a halt. I look at my wife, she looks at me, and we both say’ what the f was that’.

What the hell is going on?

If the car’s rear wheels detect loss of traction, it is a bit slippy out there, do the electronics compensate somehow and give some revs?

I can’t believe this to be the case as my foot is off the gas and on the brakes, why would the car lunge me forward?

My action is to ring Lexus in the morning, they may know of this problem. I’m also going to ring the garage I bought the car from. Do I have to give them chance to investigate; I don’t see how they could as they don’t have the Lexus tech. gear.

My wife was in the car with me, she isn’t impressed, and quite scared. It has never happened anywhere else, just going slow into my drive, twice.

Does anyone here have any ideas?

Would Lexus be able to get a diagnosis from the car?

If Lexus were to investigate this would cost money, would the garage pay for this work?

Any help very much appreciated!

:(

[Mike246]

This is a serious response, no matter what you think!

Check your driver's floormat. Is it well clear of the pedals?

If not, pressing the brake can apply mat pressure on the organ-type accelerator pedal. It happened to me and I'd even booked the car in to be checked over. The dealership said I wasn't the first.

[knitware]

This is a serious response, no matter what you think!

Check your driver's floormat. Is it well clear of the pedals?

If not, pressing the brake can apply mat pressure on the organ-type accelerator pedal. It happened to me and I'd even booked the car in to be checked over. The dealership said I wasn't the first.

Any response is welcome!

I hope it is the problem, I will check it now!!!!!!!

I checked the mat, It's not the mat, it's clear of the pedal, I wish it as the mat. Thanks though. :(

[Patch234]

This is not going to be much help. But I had a 1996 toyota camry 3.0 GX Auto (well, my wife did, she drove it). She had the same problem when coming to stop at lights or in traffic - it happended twice and them she told me.

I took the power switch off (it was always driven with the sport switch engaged). I also lubed (wd40) the engine compartment. It did not happen again! We have since traded in the car.

Sorry I can not be of further help. Let us know what you find out.

Phil

[Mike_B]

Could be something up with the system that controls revs when the air-conditioner kicks in. When the compressor starts, power is taken from the engine and the revs tend to drop. The ECU then allows the engine to rev higher to compensate for this. If this system is faulty, perhaps it could be applying too much extra throttle and causing a surge?

[dave1]

As you have only just purchased this car, would it not make sense to let the garage that you purchased it from deal with the problem under warranty?

Coupled with your earlier post I would be getting it investigated urgently.

[wildybeast]

i agree with mike.if the idle speed is to low when you load the engine the ecu will apply more revs .good luck

[knitware]

i agree with mike.if the idle speed is to low when you load the engine the ecu will apply more revs .good luck

The above posts are a good observation.

I only travelled for about 10 mins, not enough time for the engine to warm to it's optimum. I noticed the engine revs were high on tick-over, about 1500 rpm, when I was at a stop at the beginning of my drive. I think that it was the high tick-over revs that caught me out when I released pressure from the brake that caused the car to surge. I'm going to see Lexus on Tuesday so i'll ask them to take a peek.

When my engine is cold, as expected, the revs are higher than when the car is warm. When the aircon kicks in, with a warm engine, should the revs remain the same, eg 900-1000 rpm? If the revs increase when aircon is added does this indicate a problem?

Thanks for your advise chaps!

[Saraj]

lucky escape mate, good to hear nothing major happened, report back as soon as you sussed it

[Dilbert D]

Hi there,

I have experienced some similar goings on over the past week. Not identical symptoms but I will explain what I have found. it may help.

I picked up my GS300 6 weeks ago and while I am used to plenty of automatics in the US, I have not driven automatics that often in the snow and ice.

The first time I noticed something similar was when I am putting the car into the garage. My drive slopes down towards the garage and I noticed that when I am creeping down the slope towards the garage I am pressing quite hard on the brake as the car is trying to apply a very slight forward torque as it is in drive. I now drop the level back into neutral as soon as gravity takes over on the drive and I do not have to hold it back on the foot brake.

Now recently in the icy conditions I have noticed that if I am driving normally and try to come to a stop then just at the instant you expect the front wheels to come to a complete stop at less than 1 mph, the rear wheels try to keep driving ever so slighlty as the front wheels are trying (and failing !) to hold the car back as they are both sliding on the ice. I have had a heart stopping moment a couple of times in the past week.

I now expect this when slowing to a stop on ice and I am ready to drop into neutral quickly as soon as I detect this happening. The front wheels then use the little bit of grip they have left to stop the car, and the car stops immediately.

Now I am not saying for a second that you should drop to neutral when braking as this would remove any engine braking. I merely drop into neutral just as the wheels are (or at least should be !) about to stop. I find the car stops much better in the last foot or so when on sheet ice and it has saved my front bumper from the back end of a transit once this week !

In your case the car was probably using the antiroll back feature to prevent the car rolling back (hence the engine revs rise) on the incline but the front wheels touched a patch of ice so could not hold the car to it tends to try to keep going forward as it is overdoing the anti-roll back.

I hope this helps add food for thought.

[knitware]

Hi there,

I have experienced some similar goings on over the past week. Not identical symptoms but I will explain what I have found. it may help.

I picked up my GS300 6 weeks ago and while I am used to plenty of automatics in the US, I have not driven automatics that often in the snow and ice.

The first time I noticed something similar was when I am putting the car into the garage. My drive slopes down towards the garage and I noticed that when I am creeping down the slope towards the garage I am pressing quite hard on the brake as the car is trying to apply a very slight forward torque as it is in drive. I now drop the level back into neutral as soon as gravity takes over on the drive and I do not have to hold it back on the foot brake.

Now recently in the icy conditions I have noticed that if I am driving normally and try to come to a stop then just at the instant you expect the front wheels to come to a complete stop at less than 1 mph, the rear wheels try to keep driving ever so slighlty as the front wheels are trying (and failing !) to hold the car back as they are both sliding on the ice. I have had a heart stopping moment a couple of times in the past week.

I now expect this when slowing to a stop on ice and I am ready to drop into neutral quickly as soon as I detect this happening. The front wheels then use the little bit of grip they have left to stop the car, and the car stops immediately.

Now I am not saying for a second that you should drop to neutral when braking as this would remove any engine braking. I merely drop into neutral just as the wheels are (or at least should be !) about to stop. I find the car stops much better in the last foot or so when on sheet ice and it has saved my front bumper from the back end of a transit once this week !

In your case the car was probably using the antiroll back feature to prevent the car rolling back (hence the engine revs rise) on the incline but the front wheels touched a patch of ice so could not hold the car to it tends to try to keep going forward as it is overdoing the anti-roll back.

I hope this helps add food for thought.

At last, someone else who has had this experience, scary isn't it!

It's not happened since the snow and ice has melted. Like you I have driven auto's for years but I have never had this happen before.

Exactly as you say, " just at the instant you expect the front wheels to come to a complete stop at less than 1 mph, the rear wheels try to keep driving". it must be something to do with anti-roll backwards down the hill technology. It has to be this along with icy conditions, the rear wheels grip, the front wheels skid, heart in mouth time as you see a wall coming closer! (although very slowly)

I'm going to Lexus tomorrow, I shall ask them about this.

What I do now is very, very slowly creep up the drive, and as I say since the ice has gone it seems to be ok. I shall let you know what Lexus say tomorrow.

Thanks for replying, it has made me feel better.

PS-With us being new owners it could be a case of us not knowing our cars yet.

[dreamon]

Years ago i had similar problem with Saab 9-5 (automatic). It was indeed scary:) However i noticed something intresting- it happened Very rarely- maybe 2 or 3 times the whole time i owned that car- but cruise control was ON every time. Not active but just switched on.

[P4UL T]

I had exactly the same thing happen to my 2002 GS300 just before I sold it.

I was on a slip road coming up to a bend to enter a petrol station. The car didnt just push forward when I lifted off it went forward with full power and full revs. The brakes and me cutting the engine only just managed to stop the thing going off the road.

I shat myself big time.

As I was selling the car later that day I never did find out what happened.

Good luck.

Paul

[P4UL T]

All this Toyota business in the news at the moment reminded me of this,

Anyone think this could of been a related fault?

[knitware]

All this Toyota business in the news at the moment reminded me of this,

Anyone think this could of been a related fault?

Hello, it's me the OP!

I can't believe you dug this up as I was just thinking about this literally 10 mins ago! How odd!

Anyway, the problem hasn't appeared since. I do remember this though, the car did want to keep going, I remember it well, it was quite scary. I had the ECU changed, other reasons, and the lurching/driving forward hasn't happened since, even during our recent spell of snow.

I wonder if this could be the same problem Toyota are suffering? In my case it was very unnerving, I had the foot off the accelerator and the car wanted to keep going. My wife was in the car at the time and asked, well shouted, 'what are you doing?'. I wasn't doing anything, I had to stamp on the brakes very hard, the ABS came on!!! This is quite worrying in light of the current situation. I assure you my foot was off the accelerator but the car was accelerating forward!

[fildigger]

Modern Technology going wrong! ......Usually to do with cost cutting on mass produced generic components. ( i believe the current problem is with 'Denso' electrical items)

Lets get back to some good sound enginerring principles.

If kinda feel for Toyota (despite their Billions ) They have forged themselves an enviable reputation for build quality over many years!...I dont suppose many other manufacturers will be to bothered though....Especially the American ones who have suffered at the hands of the Japs!

ps. Wonder if there is some industrial espionage going on here??......Controversial.

[P4UL T]

I wonder if this could be the same problem Toyota are suffering? In my case it was very unnerving, I had the foot off the accelerator and the car wanted to keep going. My wife was in the car at the time and asked, well shouted, 'what are you doing?'. I wasn't doing anything, I had to stamp on the brakes very hard, the ABS came on!!! This is quite worrying in light of the current situation. I assure you my foot was off the accelerator but the car was accelerating forward!

More or less exactly what happened to me

[Robin Banks]

the mrs said to me yesterday that she felt the car wanted to accelerate even though she had her foot of the accelerator and on the brake, i always thought it was something to do with it being an auto, as i've never had an auto before, but this whole things makes me think do i have sticky accelerator issue's.