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Engine Mount/gearbox Problem? Causing Judder And Vibration


LexAsh_220d
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Hello all, I have had a search of the forum but I can't find anything which I think really covers the current issue i'm having. I'll give you the low down of the problems and any advice will be greatly received so thankyou in advance. I have only owned the car just under 4 weeks and it is covered under warranty from the garage I bought it from, they are having it next Thursday to get to the bottom of it. The car is a 2007 IS220d on 66000 miles.

Ok, so a really noticable, almost hair on your legs sort of tickly, vibration has reared it's head when the car is on tickover. You can feel it through the drivers seat and also just by touching the drivers door. I have leant over and touched various parts of the car on the passenger side (including the door) and I can't feel any vibration at all. It's definately seems to be present only on the drivers side. Also in the drivers foot well you can feel it, with your feet flat on the floor in the footwell you can feel a very tickly prominant vibration.

Also something I have noticed only recently, is when sat stationary with the car ticking over and not in gear, you can induce a noticeable change of tone in the engine just by pressing and releasing the clutch pedal? Is this really normal and what would cause it?

When in gear and sat stationary on tickover (i.e sat at a junction in first gear waiting to pull away) the gear stick can be prone to getting rather "excited" shall we say, this is something I've only noticed today. I apologise for the crudeness, but if Ann Summers could replicate this in a s*x toy I have absolutely no doubt it would be a best seller!

Now on the first sign which indicated a problem might be developing somewhere. A very harsh judder when pulling away in first gear. The more revs you give the car the more prominant the judder, if you pull away slowly and really nurse the clutch you can prevent the juddering but once you've experienced the juddering a few times you can tell exactly when it's going to happen and you can almost control it through your driving if that makes sense? It's no problem at all replicating it.

The engine also sounds louder with a more "Tractor" type sounding note to it. Not a rattly sound, more like a loose sounding clacking? I am sort of thinking there could be an engine mount issue, so if anybody has experienced an engine mount issue and could inject a better description of what i'm trying to describe please feel free! :-)

The performance feels like it's suffering as well but I don't know if thats because perhaps the engine is making more noise than it should so it gives the illusion/feeling that you should be going faster.

Also I was in a multi storey car park the other day and i'm sure the clutch slipped on me, is there anyway I could check if the clutch was on it's way out without causing unnecessary wear and tear?

There is also this incredibly annoying squeak which has developed in the base of the drivers seat. Going around corners or round abouts, getting in and out the car, pulling the handbrake on etc, all cause the seat to squeak and creak in a similar way to what you'd expect from a badly assembled DSF sofa. It's almost like something has collapsed in the base of the drivers seat.

Like I mention earlier, any help or advice is much appreciated and I will be very grateful :-) ...and yes I do currently feel like i've bought a lemon...

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All the symptoms you describe are classic for a failed/failing DMF (dual mass flywheel) these were introduced to make gearchanges smoother but have proved unreliable when compared to a standard solid flywheel, the internal springs apparently fail.

If your warrany is comprehensive and covers the repair that's good news because you would be lucky to get it replaced along with the full clutch kit for under a grand but does the warranty cover items for "wear and tear"?

Just make sure that the parts fittted are genuine Lexus/Toyota and the flywheel is not repaired/bodged by welding it up or replaced with a solid flywheel, get everything agreed in writing if possible.

If the dealer refuses to unhold your warranty you still have rights under the sales of goods act as it was a recent purchase from a trader so lemons can be returned for a refund.

If it comes to that make sure you document everything, the good news at the moment is the dealer has offered to repair the car so admitting the defect is present.

Please keep us up to date on how things go.

If you or other members want to see what's involved the short video below explains the construction and operation of the DMF.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Ok, well the car has had a new clutch and engine mount under warranty and the seat has been sorted. I'm still in the process of getting the steering problem sorted, but the bad news is the judder is still there.

Now the judder isn't as bad now but it is still present in the same situation, when pulling off in first gear. It's more prominent when pulling off on an incline.

I'm still sure it's a flywheel problem so I shall be ringing the garage back on monday so they can have the car back to be looked at.

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No the DMF hasn't been done. I think that is the problem though from everything I've been able to research on the forum. I dont think the dmf will have been checked I just think they're throwing parts at the car in hope of a quick fix. I'm not overly fussed though, it's going back again for them to look at so hopefully it'll get sorted this time.

The probelm does feel reduced even though it is still there. Would this make any sense from what has been replaced?

Thankyou for the replies!

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Makes perfect sense, but the DMF is expensive and Lexus seem to not want to replace it unless it is scrap. If it is failing then it's a struggle to get them to admit it - they would rather blame your driving style and alienate you and dismiss your custom. Replacement of DMF when replacing the clutch and there have been reported problems should be mandatory in my opinion and experience.

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It's available car fixing it! Lol I've had it checked at lexus and they have backed me up and said they think the dmf has had it. The car needs a new steering rack as well which lexus have confirmed. They've even rang available car to tell them their findings. It's going in on the 9th for the work to be done so I'll keep the thread updated

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That's good! I bought mine from a Toyota Garage and found that they and Lexus Derby and Sheffield were all saying there's nothing wrong with the DMF even though they deemed there was enough of a problem to change the 3-part clutch! They've been told not to admit there's a problem - when the Tech drives it, they make sure the take their foot off the gas, pause, then press the clutch(this gives the worn/failing DMF time to steady itself). You wouldn't notice unless you know or think about it afterwards. However, analysis is my game!

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Make sure they fit a genuine replacement and don't either weld up the faulty one or fit a solid flywheel, easy way to make sure is ask to see the old one when you collect the car.

Technically I think the clutch should also be replaced again at the same time as the new clutch will now be bedded into the faulty flywheel, the same as always fitting new pads and discs together.

Looks like someones going to be spluttering at the cost.

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Yes my only concern is, lexus derby had the car for 30 minutes and diagnosed the problems with the car, available car had it for a week and didn't really seem to have a clue. I'm just hoping they're up to the job. Lexus did a price break down for the work that needed doing on a report for me and it was just under £5k! Lol

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