Brake Issues

[ronnaybarkay]

Ive just had my wifes 53 plate RX 300 SE-L serviced at 61k by Lexus. £384 inc wheel alignment, but excluding plugs as I had them done a few months ago when I had the timing belt done.

I have been aware of a light occasional scraping on the discs for a while so assumed the pads were getting down.

Ive been handed a sheet which advises me I need new discs to the front due to edge corrosion, new pads to the rear, and both rear calipers are seized.... Ive had the car 2 years, and so far its cost me £3000 in maintenance bills (inc 4 tyres). I am far from blown away by the reliability of the RX...

I am on the verge of throwing it in, taking a heavy loss on what I ve spent so far and getting a run around.

I have looked on the Lexus.co.uk re the fixed price repairs. New calipers are £350 each. Pads around £115 ish and discs £175 ish. If I get all this done, thats another £1000.

Then theres the suspension/steering bushes cracked.

And the hand brake cable seized/ sticking.

I can imagine the total bill will be £1300 +. To say I am gutted is an understatement.

We wanted to run the car for another 2 years but I just cannot face the neverending bills. This would take it over £4k in 2 years.... I recall seeing other posts that said if you want a cheap car, buy a Ford...

Constructively, I appreciate a garage may be able to free up the calipers? I have read one post which implies that whenever there are new calipers fitted, new discs and pads are needed to go with them. Is there any truth in that?

In addition, does anyone have any experience of rectifying/ replacing suspension bushes (exact details not known) and freeing up foot brake cable.

Many thanks

[Duncan Roberts]

I'm afraid that it is a ten year old car. Why did you have the timing belt changed at such a low mileage. If 61k is correct for a ten year old car, then the low mileage suggests lack of use hence sticking parts. The pads are normal consumables, the rest suggests something is inherently amiss with this specific car.

[ronnaybarkay]

I was advised by Lexus to get the timing belt done as it was advised at the 10 yr mark along with a new set of plugs - £500. On that basis, I had it done as was planning on running it for another 2 yrs. The rest of the costs have gone on new suspension leg due to excess play, corroded break pipes and a few other bits.

Im happy with the cars mileage, and its in very good condition. It drives beautifully as well.

I fully appreciate the age of the car, but had "hoped" based on comments from other owners, that despite its years, it would still be a solid choice. I equally appreciate the items in question such as discs/ pads are consumables and will always wear out. The old saying "when it rains, it pours" leaves me waiting for the next expense.

In respect of the calipers. The notes say that both "top slides seized". I was advised that if they couldn't be rectified, they would need to be replaced.

Does anyone have any experience on this specific issue, and the likelihood or freeing them up?

[Duncan Roberts]

The thought that went through my mind was the cause of the problems seems to be lack of use if the mileage is indeed correct. I had an RX300 from new to about 70,000 and now an RX400 also from new to just over 75,000 both without these problems. They were both half the age.

[steve2006]

Does the car have a FLSH?

Reason I ask is regular servicing should prevent these problems with sticking calipers, the slide pins fitted on all Lexus models are prone to seizing if not correctly maintained.

I have just serviced my brakes on a 20 year old JDM LS400 and although it was only 6 months since the last time they were becoming tight in the bores and definitely needed removing,cleaning and regreasing. All the brake calipers are the originals as are the discs at 86,000 miles.

Now I am a home mechanic and know what to look for when it comes to common issues like the caliper pins ( it is well documented on the web) so you would expect Lexus trained "technicians" to be well in advance of my knowledge and skill level but dispite,I assume, regular dealer servicing it has happened to your vehicle.

Draw your own conclusions here but I for one know my vehicle is well maintained in a safe roadworthy condition and my brake pipes will not be corroded as they get a good coat of grease yearly after a full underbody wash and my suspension bushes are regularly treated with rubber lubricant to help preserve them.

I bet a full Lexus service doesn't go as far as that, just run your fingers along the rear wheel arch lips and see how much crud falls out of them.

[nelmo]

All those issues makes a mockery of the idea that you need to keep a car serviced...by the sound of it, yours has been and yet still lots of problems...

I would consider getting a second opinion from an independent garage. Much as Lexus dealers have a good rep, they are, at the end of the day, dealers and they need you to keep paying those high prices to stay afloat. Your car's getting on and well outside warranty, so why keep going back to Lexus? You're paying double for almost everything.

I took my 100k miler to a local specialist who charged me £575 for a new cambelt, 100k service and MOT - Lexus wanted £850 for the same thing.

More specifically, he said he had to free up the rear brakes because they were a bit 'sticky' but that's a common issue on hybrids (the rear brakes don't get used much) - he never suggested I needed to change the discs, pads or anything else.

In Lexus's defence, you could have these problems with any car. The brake disc for a Ford also probably costs £175 - and you'll still only have a Ford

[ronnaybarkay]

I went back to Lexus for the 60 k as I understood it to be a big one in the life of the car. As such I thought I ll let them do it and at the same time get a good assessment of its condition, and my willingness to run it for another 2 years. The outcome of that school of thought has been these issues. Like you suggest there is nothing wrong with letting a local garage have a look. I have however used the garage where I bought the car to have all previous work done. One one occasion it had to go back a 2nd time for tracking which should have been sorted originally. The timing belt was done and the mechanic cut through a breather pipe and caused a lot of lights on the dash. Extra hassle with having to go back with a very marginal saving against Lexus on those occasions. So that is why on this big service I thought I would let them go through it. I dont want it to appear like I am moaning about what they found out, just that I am perhaps a bit disappointed... Joys of motoring.

The car has its MOT tomorrow so I will see how many of the issues crop up there....?

[ronnaybarkay]

The car does have an early LSH to 40 k + stamped by Croydon, but the last few have been done independently. I have read on the www about the caliper issue. The service manager advised me today that if the caliper cant be freed up, then the affected components can be bougght/ replaced sparing the need for the whole caliper, which is a positive. But the issue is potentially worthy of note for other readers....

[Jaspersilus]

Hi Mike, I had 2 stuck calipers a couple of months ago, usually caused by seized slide pins, got 2 sets from Lexus parts for £25 a set, then got mobile mechanic fit new pins, £30.

Disc edge corrosion is just where a lip builds due to wear caused by break pads, if it gets too high and rusty it binds on the edge of the pads, take a wheel off and gently tap the edge of the disc, inside and outside and the corroded lip should break off, do the same on the inner lip and repeat on all 4 wheels. A set of front pads of decent quality are about £30 from a local motor factor, a decent quality set of Front Discs and Pads are less than £80 off eBay ( mintex, ferodo). Sticking handbrake cable usually caused by stretched cable, again Lexus Parts about £80 depending which cable is stretched, whichever brake is sticking its that side!

I get my car serviced by Lexus, thats all, I appreciate many people who drive Lexus are quite well off, I AM NOT, I run a nice car, properly maintained and looked after for considerably less than many people who run Fords, and Vauxhalls and have them repaired at dealers.

And one last thing Mike, thas a Yorkshireman, have more care for your cash! Im not saying do the work yourself but there a FAR cheaper labour rates than Lexus.

Cheers Jason

[ronnaybarkay]

Well said Jason. The service and wheel alignment is the only money I have spent with Lexus. The resat has been local. I certainly take on board the advice in sourcing any required components and getting them fitted locally.

Thanks for the input!

[tameracingdriver]

Where in Yorkshire are you?

I have spare slide pins and am used to having to overhaul Lexus brakes! If you got a seal and piston kit I'd be happy to sort them for you.

[Duncan Roberts]

I get my car serviced by Lexus, thats all, I appreciate many people who drive Lexus are quite well off, I AM NOT, I run a nice car, properly maintained and looked after for considerably less than many people who run Fords, and Vauxhalls and have them repaired at dealers.

It is actually noticeable how the balance of this board has swung from original owners who tend to use Lexus for service as you say "I appreciate many people who drive Lexus are quite well off" both because the vehicles are new and within warranty and because their budgets are less constrained. Now the cars are older second and third owners with different views on self repair and non-Dealer service are coming to the fore.

Having had all three of my Lexus cars from new (one IS, an RX300 and an RX400) I would still stay with the dealer even at five years old because I am more comfortable with the work they do. The reliability is such that cost is not an issue not likely to be.

[Jaspersilus]

Hi,

in reply to Duncan, I agree up to 5 years old Lexus is the way to go, and yes they are in general very reliable, but quite minor things are incredibly expensive to repair at a Lexus main dealer, I would like to say Lexus spares are comparable in price to BMW spares, but in my experience they are considerably more expensive, and lack a network of non main dealer specialists that are available to BMW, Jaguar and Audi owners. The forums are essential to keep down the cost of running an older premium car.

As for Lexus Dealers giving a higher quality maintenance, and Im not talking of a nice courtesy car and a Lexus branded tin of travel sweets, I had a major service at my local main dealer last year including a drain and refill of the transmission, they overfilled the transmission and the engine oil, both stupid, careless mistakes that should not happen at a main dealer.

I didnt complain because I was silly enough to trust their workmanship, and only noticed a few months later doing a routine check.

As for the reliability,if your inverter fails, or your Battery pack, you can buy a new Dacia for less than the repair cost!

regards Jason

[ronnaybarkay]

Thanks for the offer Scott. Im in Sheffield area incidentally. The cars been in for its MOT today - £35. £15 cheaper than what Lexus offered me at the time of the service. The car has passed.

The only advisory was that a rubber gaitor has a small split in which may allow the elements in over time. As such Ive booked it in at the local garage to replace to prevent winter corrosion etc. I mentioned the recent service and the points highlighted which we have been discussing. I spoke with the MOT tester who said all was well. The rear pads were legal but getting down. As a result I will let them replace these when the rubber gaitor is sorted, and at the same time check the calipers.... No braking deficiencies.

On reflection of what were my worst concerns, the above has put my mind and wallet at rest. I was looking on the web last night and found a set of brembo rear discs AND pads for £47 delivered. Lexus = pads £115 fitted. Its a no brainer for a vehicle which is as old as mine. Like you say, up to 5 years, the value of the vehicle is worth the Lexus expertise. Its always down to the individual, but the garage in question is a member of the "good garage scheme" which is supposed to be a sign of honest, reasonable costs, and a good standard of service/ workmanship. It also has a lot to do with finding a garage where you trust, and receive good service. Local or otherwise.

[ColinBarber]

I doubt the discs actually need to be changed.

Rear callipers seized. A few pounds for new slide pins and a couple of hours labour from a local mechanic would probably solve the issue.

Do you use your parking brake? They don't seize if they are used, unfortunately many owners don't bother and just rely on the transmission to lock the wheels.

[ColinBarber]

Does the car have a FLSH?

Reason I ask is regular servicing should prevent these problems with sticking calipers, the slide pins fitted on all Lexus models are prone to seizing if not correctly maintained.

I have just serviced my brakes on a 20 year old JDM LS400 and although it was only 6 months since the last time they were becoming tight in the bores and definitely needed removing,cleaning and regreasing. All the brake calipers are the originals as are the discs at 86,000 miles.

Now I am a home mechanic and know what to look for when it comes to common issues like the caliper pins ( it is well documented on the web) so you would expect Lexus trained "technicians" to be well in advance of my knowledge and skill level but dispite,I assume, regular dealer servicing it has happened to your vehicle.

Draw your own conclusions here but I for one know my vehicle is well maintained in a safe roadworthy condition and my brake pipes will not be corroded as they get a good coat of grease yearly after a full underbody wash and my suspension bushes are regularly treated with rubber lubricant to help preserve them.

I bet a full Lexus service doesn't go as far as that, just run your fingers along the rear wheel arch lips and see how much crud falls out of them.

Unfortunately dealers won't do preventative maintenance on slide pins - not as part of a standard service at least, it isn't in the service schedule.

[ronnaybarkay]

I do use the parking brake all the time. The service manager asked the same question. I always assumed it was essential.

[ronnaybarkay]

Cars running superb after its service. Just been to local garage and had rear mintex pads (£24.95) fitted, and the garage has been able to free up and grease the slide pins on the calipers - £60 labour on brakes. Good brake feel again.

The total bill was £118, including the fitting of a £25 rubber gaitor that picked up an advisory on the MOT. Considering my initial worst fears. Very happy with the outcome!!!

Will look at some new front discs in new year I think.

[malibu]

Appears to be a good outcome.

I've got mine going in for a service next Wednesday. There's a slight rumbling from the brakes and I've asked Lexus Plymouth to quote me for any additional expense before going ahead with the work. I have a feeling that pads and maybe discs could be required. I'll be taking their estimate to another garage for comparison.

I'm of the opinion that brake and disc work shouldn't be too complicated for an experienced mechanic, therefore I really don't want to go with main dealer prices if they will be unnecessarily high.

[ronnaybarkay]

The pads were from a local motor factors, but you can get the rear's online for around £18. New front disks look about £100, so you could save a lot. Look at the fixed prices for the RX on lexus.co.uk to see what you would be paying for discs and pads... Search for "the good garage scheme" near you for a reputable local place to try for fitting any parts you pick up.

[nelmo]

Cars running superb after its service. Just been to local garage and had rear mintex pads (£24.95) fitted, and the garage has been able to free up and grease the slide pins on the calipers - £60 labour on brakes. Good brake feel again.

The total bill was £118, including the fitting of a £25 rubber gaitor that picked up an advisory on the MOT. Considering my initial worst fears. Very happy with the outcome!!!

Will look at some new front discs in new year I think.

That is why I hate going to dealers - if you didn't know better, you'd be £1,100 poorer now. Not wasted money (you have got new discs etc), obviously, but unnecessary to keep the car running.

I was at Kwik-fit earlier this year and I saw a woman arrive in a year-old Golf. I overheard her ask the guy how much a set of front tyres would be for her car - the VW dealer told her she needed new ones and she hoped she could get them cheaper from Kwik-fit. I had a quick glance at the tyres and they looked almost brand new - bucket load of tread on them. The Kwik-fit guy, to his credit, said the same thing and sent her on her way.