Anti-roll Bars

[Steviewevie]

Out of interest, I thought I'd see if others can help me fill in the table below, showing the stiffness of various sets of ARBs compared to the OEM ones. I've managed to find out some of the info fairly easily, but perhaps others have more they can add ?

Brand/Colour/Front Stiffness/Rear Stiffness/Bushes ?

TTE - Eibach/Red/?/?/no

TRD/Blue/+49%/+99%/yes

TRD/Yellow/+49%/+99%/?

C-One/Red/+60%/+100%/yes

Cusco/Blue/+140%/+125%/no

Hotchkis/Red/+56%,+61%/+144%,+227%/yes

Tanabe/Red/?/?/?

HKS/?/+130%/+116%/?

The "Bushes" bit indicates whether new bushes are included in the kit. Where multiple percentages are given for either front or rear, then that means the bar is adjustable.

So does anyone have the stiffness ratings of the bars with missing details above ? Or any other bars to add to the list ?

P.S. Sorry about the poor formatting, I couldn't get any sort of table with tabs/spaces to display correctly

[Monster-Mat]

Stock

28mm Front

14mm Rear

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ARC

Front +216%

Rear +146%

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Do-Luck

Solid design

29mm Front (Non-Adjustable) - Front Only

25.8mm Rear (3-Way Adjustable) - Rear Only

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Area51

30mm Front

16mm Rear

NO LONGER AVAILABLE

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TRD Yellow

30mm Front 49%

19.1mm Rear 99%

LIMITED SUPPLY

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TRD Blue

front 28.6mm

rear 16.0mm

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Cusco

30mm front F140%

16mm rear R125%

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Cusco DR (Track orientated ARB)

30mm solid front +218%

25mm solid Hollow +220%

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Eibach same as L-Tuned, and TTE as listed below

28mm Front

17mm Rear 3-way adjustable

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Daizen

32mm Front

19mm Rear

Hollow design

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Hotchicks

32mm Front Hollow 2 way adjustable +56%, +61%

19mm Rear Hollow 2 way adjustable +144%, +227%

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Tanabe

30mm Front F440kg/0.05m

18mm Rear R92kg/0.05m

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HKS

28mm Front +130%

16mm or 17mm? Rear +116%

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Stillen

30.61mm Front

19.43mm Rear

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TTE

28mm Front

17mm Adjustable settings at.. 90mm 105mm 120mm

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TRD Sportivo White

28.6mm Front Hollow type

16.0mm Rear Solid type

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Intrax

30mm Front

19mm Rear

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C-One

32mm Front

17mm Rear

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Largus

Front 35.1mm - 140% Stiffer

Rear 27.5mm - 220% Stiffer

High precision seamless pipe

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L-TUNED

Front +49%

Rear +99%

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DTec

Front 30mm 40% Stiffer (Hollow)

Rear 16 25% Stiffer (Solid)

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[Mr Mole]

Ok but which ones should we go for.

Just for normal every day

[Noel]

Cusco are the favourite with Altezza's over here ....

[edeath]

I think TDI have a TTE set in stock, well they did a week or 2 ago.

[Steviewevie]

Ok but which ones should we go for.

Just for normal every day

That's a very good question, and of course not one I can answer. But when looking into the subject, e.g. searching the LOC forums for threads discussing ARBs, the one common factor seems to be that anyone who's installed *any* sort of upgraded ARBs seems to love them. So my impression so far is that whatever set you choose you're not going to go far wrong, so perhaps you should just go on price (and/or easiest to get hold) ?

It might be that certain ARBs can be highlighted as being the stiffest, but is any road user going to notice any difference over the others ? I'm starting to suspect that it's only serious track users who are going to want to be particular over which ARBs they install.

As I say, this isn't really a well-informed opinion, I'm just going by what I've read in past threads on this.

[Steviewevie]

I think TDI have a TTE set in stock, well they did a week or 2 ago.

They do indeed, although they seem to be asking quite a lot for them considering they don't come with bushes.

[Monster-Mat]

I think TDI have a TTE set in stock, well they did a week or 2 ago.

They do indeed, although they seem to be asking quite a lot for them considering they don't come with bushes.

the TTE bars can be used with std bushes

[Monster-Mat]

in normal driving the stiffness of the ARB, wouldnt be noticed, only in cornering.

However, what the various bars do do, when cornering, is alter the way the car handles.

stiffer rear bars will induce oversteer, softer front bars will induce over steer aswell, harder fronts and softer rears will cause understeer,

if you are going to upgrade you need to match like for like front and rear, and remember the majority, (all but the hotchkis bars) were designed for the Altezza with 3sge

however most have found to be perfect with the 6 cylinder is200.

the only bars that have been designed for the IS200 from the outset has been the TTE/Eibach bars

[Monster-Mat]

in normal driving the stiffness of the ARB, wouldnt be noticed, only in cornering.

However, what the various bars do do, when cornering, is alter the way the car handles.

stiffer rear bars will induce oversteer, softer front bars will induce over steer aswell, harder fronts and softer rears will cause understeer,

if you are going to upgrade you need to match like for like front and rear, and remember the majority, (all but the hotchkis bars) were designed for the Altezza with 3sge

however most have found to be perfect with the 6 cylinder is200.

the only bars that have been designed for the IS200 from the outset has been the TTE/Eibach bars

i will be swapping my TRD yellows for my Cusco bars when i get the car back over here

[Steviewevie]

the TTE bars can be used with std bushes

Yes, fair enough, but if the old bushes are quite worn, then you might not get the best out of the new bars, surely ? I would have thought it would be worthwhile installing new bushes at the same time as the new bars ?

stiffer rear bars will induce oversteer, softer front bars will induce over steer aswell, harder fronts and softer rears will cause understeer,

Thanks, I was going to ask this question, presumably the way that some of the bar sets have much stiffer rears than fronts, or even stiffer fronts on some, is going to have quite a significant effect on handling at some point. Whether you'll ever reach this sort of limit on the road may be in question though ?

[Monster-Mat]

the TTE bars can be used with std bushes

Yes, fair enough, but if the old bushes are quite worn, then you might not get the best out of the new bars, surely ? I would have thought it would be worthwhile installing new bushes at the same time as the new bars ?

yup, of course, but you can use new std bushes

stiffer rear bars will induce oversteer, softer front bars will induce over steer aswell, harder fronts and softer rears will cause understeer,

Thanks, I was going to ask this question, presumably the way that some of the bar sets have much stiffer rears than fronts, or even stiffer fronts on some, is going to have quite a significant effect on handling at some point. Whether you'll ever reach this sort of limit on the road may be in question though ?

yep, i think if you look at any of the bars that have an equal increase front and rear, then the feel, will be the same as before, while running std arb.

like the c-one bars , tte bars and trd bars

however from experiance, upping the rear bar slightly will decrease the natural chances of the car to understeer, which is a trait the engineers designed into the handling, for normal joe blogs

[Steviewevie]

the TTE bars can be used with std bushes

Yes, fair enough, but if the old bushes are quite worn, then you might not get the best out of the new bars, surely ? I would have thought it would be worthwhile installing new bushes at the same time as the new bars ?

yup, of course, but you can use new std bushes

Indeed. I was just trying to say that when looking at prices, if the ARB doesn't come with new bushes (e.g. Cusco, TTE), then you might want to add the cost of some of those in when comparing.

yep, i think if you look at any of the bars that have an equal increase front and rear, then the feel, will be the same as before, while running std arb.

like the c-one bars , tte bars and trd bars

So do you think it would be fair to say that with the TTE/TRD/C-One bars then you're probably getting flatter cornering with similar handling characteristics to OEM, but the other bars (e.g. Cusco/Hotchkis) are a bit more "specialised" and as well as giving flatter cornering may also alter the handling (whether for better or worse will be a matter of preference/driving style/etc) ?

[Monster-Mat]

i can talk about the TTE, TRDYellow and Cusco as i have used these.

the TTE is the closest to standerd, in terms of feel, but can be adjusted to give more "oversteer" feel to the rear, as in you can dial out understeer, which is a trait of the is200.

The TRD yellows give a excellent feel, the front doesnt dip under cornering, and the rear feels lighter, more planted and controlable, no wallowing in corners, but neutral in characturistic

the cusco DR are heavily engineered to create oversteer, the front bar is very stiff, in comparison to the TTE and TRD, and is thicker in construction, however the rear bar, is very thick, as thick as the front bar almost, this coupled with the front bar, creates no dip in cornering, but keeps the rear live, meaning more attention is required on the rear suspension set up to give a refined neutral feedback, the Cusco DR bars i will be fitting, are designed as a track only bar

[Steviewevie]

the cusco DR are heavily engineered to create oversteer, the front bar is very stiff, in comparison to the TTE and TRD, and is thicker in construction, however the rear bar, is very thick, as thick as the front bar almost, this coupled with the front bar, creates no dip in cornering, but keeps the rear live, meaning more attention is required on the rear suspension set up to give a refined neutral feedback, the Cusco DR bars i will be fitting, are designed as a track only bar

Cusco DR ? Is there more than one type of Cusco bar ? Or is this just a fuller name for the Cusco bars

[Monster-Mat]

the road version of cusco bars are the normal ones, i picked up the race/track version (DR) from japan about 5 years ago....ive never seen them listed, so presume they were only manufactured for Race use only...??

ive only ever seen them on some of the older altezza Cup or Super Taikyu cars

there are still a few more manufacturers of Bars that i have not listed, becuse you simply cannot get them outside of Japan, maybe if you look on Yahoo auctions japan

Beatrush

Carbing

eL Sport

and

Largus

[Steviewevie]

Adding further info :

C-One Front 32mm hollow

C-One Rear 17mm solid

[Steviewevie]

Had my C-One ARBs fitted today, along with new drop links. Wow, they're amazing ! The car is much flatter around corners, so much so that I need to get used to it, it is so different from before.

Another great thing about the C-One ARBs is that they come with new brackets for the front, which are much thicker and are braced, compared to the flimsy-looking OEM brackets which are just an "open" piece of steel.

One factor to bear in mind, depending on the age of your car, is that you may well need new drop links too. They are very prone to rusting up and being difficult/impossible to remove without cutting them off. As well as the fact that they may be worn as well, so your existing drop links might not get the best out of new ARBs.

[edeath]

Thats great news Steve. Glad it's all fitted and working nicely :) Shame they are going to cost us both a lot more than we thought, but i think they're worth it. Getting mine fitted at WIM on Friday :) Did you fit all 4 droplinks in the end?

As a heads up to those thinking about getting their ARBs done all 4 droplinks cost me ~£180 with my 10% Gold Discount and 15% VAT from Lexus Park Lane. I think Steve called a couple of other Lexus dealers and they all quoted the same price. Lexus park lane said that they will take back unused parts up to 14 days after collection though.

Does anyone else agree that a cleaned up version of this should be made a sticky like the Exhaust one? Also the same with the ECU thread that was done recently?

Ed

[Steviewevie]

Thats great news Steve. Glad it's all fitted and working nicely :) Shame they are going to cost us both a lot more than we thought, but i think they're worth it. Getting mine fitted at WIM on Friday :) Did you fit all 4 droplinks in the end?

Yep, all four. The front two had to be replaced since they had to be cut off to detach the OEM ARB. The rear ones were replaced since I'd done the front ones anyway and were likely to be worn (and therefore not get the most out of the ARB, and to end up failing at some point in the not-too-distant future).