pml9952

Diesel to have their merits - whether it be Lexus BMW Audi Merc etc.

And it is clear BMW have a much more refimed oil burner than Lexus (and the Audi's and the Merc's) - I traded my 2.0d Efficient Dynamics in recently and their is no question the Beemer is a better engine (much more refined).

But take etheir fuel consumption figure with a huge mountain of salt - The Beemer I had was listed as 58mpg combined - I averaged (mostly on A-roads and out of town) - 44mpg.

The Lexus (I believe) is between 46 and 48 combined and I achieve 42 mpg, doing the same run, so 2 mpg worse than the BMW - but shown in the figures as nearly 12mpg difference.

The BMW although not a poor car to drive by any standards, does not have the luxury of the Lexus (the run flats - which I believe are now being fitted to all models) are not a comfort (although you do become a skilled driver steering madly through the potholes) - and they are also more expensive (BMW do offer you insurance on them though)

I also heard problems regarding the particulate filters on cars that were being used on short journeys (sound familar)

The Lexus model is not far behind the Beemer and only needs a small amount of R&D on the engine to be matching the what is supposed to be 'top of the Engine class'

SO why shouldn't Lexus take note and put their efforts into both Hybrid and oil burners.

Have just exchanged my 06 plate 220d for a BM 320d touring which I initially considered simply because it offers a bit more luggage versatility. I had recently had a 2009 220d on loan and whilst it was a bit smoother than my old car I have to say not much, and I really felt Lexus have cheapened some of the interior trim on recent models. I did a back to back test with both the BM 4 cylinder 320d and the 6 cylinder 325d but frankly the 4 cylinder amazed me with its smooth refinement that I just couldn't see a significant difference between it and the 325d. Its much better than the Toyota unit. I'm sure the 330d is well worth having if you want to spend nearly 40 grand with options.

The BMW engine is much quieter, smoother and more flexible. I don't find the run flats unforgiving, on the contrary the car is more cushioned over poor town surfaces than the Lexus ever was, there's less road noise and no wind rustling around the door gaps like the Lexus. Yes the interior materials are a bit cheaper in places, the optons cost a fortune and unfortuantely the world and his wife have one, and yes I will miss Lexus sevice which has been superb, but a 320d touring gives you a bit more flexibility luggage wise and genuinely is a more enjoyable drive with sensible gear ratios to boot!

Yes that's right, it's been a year (exactly tomorrow). And so how has it been? Well for those of you interested, read on...

The Good, the Dad and Ugly part II - I've scored the car - where 100%=perfection

Refinement - 90% - other than the the dreaded Road Noise, which IMHO is still too much for this type of car. Anyone who drives a BMW320d, C Class or an A4 on 16" or 17" can immediately tell. Overall though, it cossets :)

Equipment levels - 100% - nothing else comes close in this price bracket. It still amazes me!!

Ride - firm and compliant - 99% - Better balanced than an A4, and not as "knobbly" as a 3 or 5 series, even on standard rims

Handling - 95% - I still maintain that this car is not quite as good as a 3 series, but it really is not that far off. I think more feel in the steering and it would be 99% there compared to the 3 series, but that's at the limits of adhesion generally

Comfort - 90% - very good overall, better seats than mainstream cars, but for me just not quite enough "germanic" or "swedish" support. It's pretty good though.

NVH - 95% - supreme and creamy for a diesel until you get beyond 3000rpm, then it clatters a tad too much. Not quiet enough to knock the 320d, but better than anything else overall in this bracket of 4 pot oilers. Most of the time though it's very good and brilliant if you drive leisurely

Driveability - 80% - for a diesel, it's a bit lame. It's very quick once you're moving and you use the torque, but would never try and race another car from the lights. It's just not designed like that. Especially the SE. There is little point in rushing the car - relax and it's great - hurry it and it feels a little "disengaged" though the ECU remap does improve things slightly

Living with the car - 70% - a few small annoyances and one or 2 big annoyances:

>The A post is very wide and you end up peering around the pillars when pulling out at junctions.

>Heavy clutch, detracts from an otherwide easy to drive car.

>Space - it really is not designed for families. Especially kids. The boot is small, legroom is actually so tight in the back that even my 12 year old son can almost get his feet trapped under the front seats when he is in the back and I lower the front seat height.

>Poor build on the early cars, mine has rattled like the Calcutta express for a long time, and all the remedial work has been a tad bodged, but it's 95% rattle free, though in my view totally unacceptable for a car with a list price of over £28k in my spoc.

>Satnav is OK, but the nanny's are annoying, and the Traffic congestion/route avoidance stuff is only accurate 1-10 times. Be brave and try ignoring it a few times - you'll see what I mean (unless there is something wrong with mine)! On the plus side the stereo is amazing and the Bluetooth is faultless, though I wish you could easily play DVD's with MP3's...

>Paintwork is bad. So soft it's shocking, and the rationale of "environmentally friendly" doesn't wash at all. Our Nissan Note, costing nearly a third of what the Lex cost has paintwork which is much, much better. In fact it's in a different league! The Lex scratches so easily, and again this is unacceptable.

On the plus side, the car still turns heads...

Running costs - 50% - IMHO this is expensive to run privately. Especially of you do highish miles - the first service including LOC discount cost £157, that's in 12 months/10,000 miles. Most of competition allow variable servicing, averaging at 15-22000 miles or up to 2 years for most drivers, and they tend to cost around the £195 - £300 mark. A direct comparison is with my old A4 - 46500 miles, 2 services, costing £460 - the Lexus will probably cost me something approching £800ish!

The bigger problem with the diesel of course is the fuel economy - 'nuff said, Euro 5 or not!

Best Journey - 95% - :winky: touring Cumbria and Scotland last year - the car impressed, it was a wonderful companion and very memorable

Worst journey - 10% - the day it started to rattle for the first time last April. Boy that was hard work! The stress it caused, and the remedial activity took several months!

So overall, my opinion is a mixed one and I give it 75%, largely down to it being slightly un-easy to live with and the questionable build. I've said many times before that I have no loyalty to any particular brand, and I'm one of those buyers that can be easily swayed. In a market dominated by the germans, I believe Lexus need to offer more choice in the UK. Just chucking loads of kit into a car doesn't make it appealing, especially if the experience once you have one is a bit shallow The other thing is the limited essentials - specially if you want an Auto diesel for saving your left leg whilst stuck in the UK's jams or an estate, or being able to choose cloth seats but not having Lumbar adjustment etc etc.

These are my views only, based on 12 months of some troubled times!!!!

I thought this was a great post. My 220d is 12 months old and have done 12,000. The car looks great and the build and equipment is fantastic, but fuel economy, rear leg room, rattles and still the weird manual gearing are a real let down. I really really really wanted to be soooo impressed that my next car would be a Lexus without question, but Im not convinced. The biggest bug for me is the rattles - just not good enough I'm afraid, and you're forever worrying about whats going to rattle next.

Hi all

My IS250 Sport is due for its first service in a few weeks - I have the usual rattle issues - ie from the speaker cover and the creaks from the centre of the dash.

I don't want my dealer at Newcastle dismantling the dash unless there is an official "fix" that will rid me of these problems because they could make things worse.

Anyone out there had theirs fixed and, more importantly, know how their dealer achieved it?

Thanks for any help

can you tell me how you got on with Newcastle? Like you I have been reluctant to leave my car for any fixes without knowing for sure that the dealer knew what they were doing. When I last asked about 4 months ago they said they hadn't heard of any problems!!!!! My IS220d is just over a year old, but may have been a late 05 early 06 build, and after 12,000 miles has just started to creak around the front screen and the centre speaker when the car is cold.

mine was a 1st March delivery but I have a suspicion that it was at the dealership at least a month before that. Does anyone have any idea what VIN numbers we might be talking about for the injectors? Ive done just over 7,000 miles and averaged 38mpg, but only ever break through the 40 mpg barrier if I do A roads at 50 to 60 mph in 4th and 5th gear, when I can get about 45 over a 50 to 60 mile run.

My recent 150 mile motorway journey at midnight in 6th at 80mph on cruise returned 38 mpg. I almost always use Morrisons fuel which gets delivered in a Texaco truck!!

Theres less mirror vibraton than when car was new, and it will run in 6th at around 75ish, but I always drop into 5th below that.

any observations anyone ?

Something like this?

Expensive option

Another option...

personally I'd go for the spinning ones, I'm not keen on the possible consequences of some heavy handed thief forcing the ones which have the grub screws to lock them on.

if you hold te unlock button on the remote the windows will roll down at the same time all 4.vice virsa for the lock

See this thread - http://www.lexusownersclub.co.uk/forum/ind...&hl=windows

It's happened to me too. Fortunately it was dry. I've been more careful with the key (don't sit down with it in your back pocket!) and it's not happened again. Maybe the wireless key reciever in the car is just v.sensitve and picks up the signal even when the key's in the house!

Thanks guys, it's the key. don't know how I did it but on my car the front windows go down and up first before therears start to follow, hence fronts were only open a few inches.

2 weeks into my new lexus, and still loving it...as McDonalds would say...But I have a proble...has anyone else heard of this...

Locked up the car and tucked her (Lexus) in for bed.....came down in the morning and found the two front windows had opened by an inch both sides...thought Sh*t and did not close the windows, and kick myself..

3 days later.....came down and all four windows has automatically opened...this time by the same amount, and of course it had rained too, so wet leather...weird I thought. Must be me, must have pressed something....

I made a point of making sure the window lock had been depressed for a few days, no problem...

This weekend..forgot to press the window lock button......same thing happened again, all four windows have opened again...and yes rained again..

Is it me,,,am i doing something, or has my baby got a fault...

Reported to my friendly Lexus Dealer, awaiting for them to get back to me.......any one else with a similar issue...or do I have a ghost....

Bigplanet....

2 weeks into my new lexus, and still loving it...as McDonalds would say...But I have a proble...has anyone else heard of this...

Locked up the car and tucked her (Lexus) in for bed.....came down in the morning and found the two front windows had opened by an inch both sides...thought Sh*t and did not close the windows, and kick myself..

3 days later.....came down and all four windows has automatically opened...this time by the same amount, and of course it had rained too, so wet leather...weird I thought. Must be me, must have pressed something....

I made a point of making sure the window lock had been depressed for a few days, no problem...

This weekend..forgot to press the window lock button......same thing happened again, all four windows have opened again...and yes rained again..

Is it me,,,am i doing something, or has my baby got a fault...

Reported to my friendly Lexus Dealer, awaiting for them to get back to me.......any one else with a similar issue...or do I have a ghost....

Bigplanet....

Did you get an answer to this from your dealer? Tonight I locked the car on the door button and when I looked out a couple of hours later both front windows had opened by about 4 inches.

anyone know why we still don't know how it scores?

interestingly had no letter but took it in for the flat Battery problem and was told they had recalled for seat belts! which was a surprise - belts replaced but charging/discharging checked normal so not sure what Battery problem was .

As a bi-product I noticed that the loan car was on Bridgestones and mines on Dunlops - in my opinion and assuming they were fully inflated, the Bridgestones ride better over uneven surrfaces particularly at speed. Any other views on this? (also got champers but tank was full anyway so no fuel). However, I have to say that after my experiences with Saab, Rover and VW dealers getting a loan car with more than a thimble full of fuel was a real bonus (my VW dealer once loaned me a Perodua Nippa when I left a top spec Passat for service - I didn't even know such a thing existed!).

This is the response I got from my dealer:

"All owners cars that are affected have had a letter to invite them for the recall. If you haven't had any correspondence, then all will be okay."

Well after posting this ony 4 days ago I got a message on the answerphone today from Lexus Chester. Called them back and mine is subject to a recall. Asked them to forward me the notice so I can take it somewhere local and they don't have one as it's dealt with at Head Office.

Not impressed.

Just by way of an update, the car is booked into the dealer in about a week. Having eliminated all other possibilities I can only think the drain on the battery (which was so dead that I lost all radio programmed stations and the average consumption data etc on my trip computer) was down to the security system or other functions that continue when the car is left locked.

My dealer sort of confirms this, saying that although experience with the 220D is still limited, their experience is that the battery will go flat after between 14 and 28 days. So watch out fellow 220d owners.

Anyone got any ideas about possible solutions?

My SE-L is regulary left for 26-30 days while I'm away and I haven't had any problems at all. Starts first time. This has been ongoing since I received the car in December last year, which is why it's only got 2800 miles on it after just over 6 months (and probably why I don't have any rattles either).

Just by way of an update, the car is booked into the dealer in about a week. Having eliminated all other possibilities I can only think the drain on the Battery (which was so dead that I lost all radio programmed stations and the average consumption data etc on my trip computer) was down to the security system or other functions that continue when the car is left locked.

My dealer sort of confirms this, saying that although experience with the 220D is still limited, their experience is that the Battery will go flat after between 14 and 28 days. So watch out fellow 220d owners.

Anyone got any ideas about possible solutions?

Just got back from 2 weeks hol. and got to the airport to find Battery on my 4 month old IS 220DSE was completely dead. RAC chap said he didn't think it would even start on his rechargeable Battery pack. Checked that no interior/trunk lights in on position, which they weren't, and cannot believe that I would have not double checked that the car was locked, so that seems to rule out leaving the ignition button in either of the "non-off" postions. Check on discharge after initial charging didn't show up anything either.

Will run it to dealers for check over but wondered if anyone else has experienced similar problem?

Picked up my IS220 D last week. Great car. Build quality far far better than the Saab I had Previously. No rattles but the rear veiw mirror bounces like crazy at motorway speeds. I'm not sure if this is down to the mirror or the screen vibrating cos theres too much bass on the stereo!! has anyone else come across this ? Overall i'm impressed, still not sure about gear ratios though.

Yes, my rear view mirror is useless on the motorway, but really only bad if I put it in 6th at 80mph plus.

don't know about whether you are the first, but I noticed that I only got about 30mpg readung cuurent consumption on the onboard computer when running on the motorway yesterday in 6th gear at 2000 rpm, i.e. about 90 mph. I would have though that 2000 rpm in 6th would have given me a lot more than that. I'll try drving some distance at around 70 mph in 5th and see what that does, but I really cannot see the consumption getting up much from my current 35 mpg even when fully run in.

What sort of speed and gears were you running in? and how many miles has your car done?

Since taking delivery of a 220d SE I have done about 500 miles. Gearing IS strange, chiefly because below about 1500 rpm theres no pick up at all, at least at the moment, so in urban areas you spend a lot of time shifting into second, which is very sticky, and therefore not a pleasant driving experience.

The other thing which is very odd is that the engine is so noisy cold and so quiet hot, but it takes ages to get warm in the kind of weather we have had this week, so its noisy quite a lot of the time on short journeys. Ive never known such a difference with a diesel.

Fuel economy - too early to tell, but around 35 mpg in mixed driving.

Ride quality strange too, very low speed bumps are smoothed out, but rough surfaces you feel it all, and on one stretch of dual carriageway near me, on the inside lane I got about a mile of a curious bobbing sensation, the car never settled and my passenger began to feel quite sick. This is on 17 inch wheels with dunlops if anything slightly underinflated when I checked to see if they were too hard!

when dealers start resorting to son of a gun, WD40 etc etc, I start to worry. This doesn't sound much like the Lexus I had in mind.

simple question, but are these made in Japan or at the US plant?

I only do 12K a year but over 4 yrs I got £380 a month on a 220d Se with rear park assist dealer fitted from Lombard on my company deal, and that includes maintenance, but not vat. with Lombard Thats better than any BMW quote I got.

can any of you with the problem tell me if this only so far seems to affect cars with multi media, or only auto's , or do any of you have the problem on manuals and/or non MM? (smae questions too but for diesel)??

As a propsective customer new to lexus having seen all the JD Power stuff I am naturally curious to see what all the fuss is about. Sorry to say so far not much.

In the North East I am roughly half way between two dealerships. I have test driven the IS 250 at both. Both know that on the 1st March I WILL change my car, and both know that the IS220d is one of only two that I will consider. So far neither have made contact to invite me for a test drive. Not looking good.

On top of that I called both to ask the price of fitting rear park assist to an IS220d SE. One dealer quoted a price which they subsequently said was incorrect (£340 initially, and then £480), the other has failed to phone back twice, despite a second call, and that now more than two weeks ago.

So far then 5 out of 10 at best for the sushi, and overall no better than VW (with which my relationship ended in divorce) . Perhaps folk in other parts of the country fare better, but on the strength of my experience so far I'm far from convinced.

Might be the BM after all.

Sorry, mate, but is there a possibility that you have come across as a rather diffucult and demanding customer to deal with? Based on your post, I wouldn't touch you with a barge-pole if i was a dealer - you seem like you're more trouble than you're worth. Do you expect dealers to be mind readers? if you want a test drive in an IS220d, ask for one!

Have you any idea of the numbers of miscellaneous calls dealers get from time-wasters or semi-serious punters? Add to the fact that Lexus' latest line-up of cars means that they've got more people going into their dealerships than ever before and you can probably understand why it is difficult to be as proactive as they usually are.

Ultimately, you will spend more time in any car you buy than in the dealership of any brand you choose. So choose the brand wisely. Lexus isn't top for quality for nothing. by the same token BMW doesn't languish well below it because its cars are better. in my expereince, it is BMWs crown that has slipped - which is hardly surprising given how many more cars BMW sells than Lexus.

More than that, relationship building is a two-way process - sometimes you have to make people feel you're worth the effort.

sorry tailpipe no need to get so touchy, all Im saying is based on customer surveys I had a level of expectation that was clearly unrealistic, and so far I can't see the difference between the lexus experience and most of the rest.

As a propsective customer new to lexus having seen all the JD Power stuff I am naturally curious to see what all the fuss is about. Sorry to say so far not much.

In the North East I am roughly half way between two dealerships. I have test driven the IS 250 at both. Both know that on the 1st March I WILL change my car, and both know that the IS220d is one of only two that I will consider. So far neither have made contact to invite me for a test drive. Not looking good.

On top of that I called both to ask the price of fitting rear park assist to an IS220d SE. One dealer quoted a price which they subsequently said was incorrect (£340 initially, and then £480), the other has failed to phone back twice, despite a second call, and that now more than two weeks ago.

So far then 5 out of 10 at best for the sushi, and overall no better than VW (with which my relationship ended in divorce) . Perhaps folk in other parts of the country fare better, but on the strength of my experience so far I'm far from convinced.

Might be the BM after all.

I have the same colour car but with grey leather interior, and it came from the dealer with black foot mats.

I am happy with it. In fact even black dirty mats stand out due to the footwell lights.

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Interesting - what colour carpets does it have? are they black or grey, and if black can you specify grey? I didnt realise that there was an option and just assumed that grey leather would come with grey carpets and mats.

Ive ordered 220d SE too (Silver with Sussex) hopefully 1 March (lease cost £380 per month on 4 year 48,000 including maintenance, plus vat- cheaper than BM !! with less kit I reckon that's a great deal),

Basically decided that even if overall it wasnt as practical and fast as beemer 0-60 and top speed, that mid range will be fine and its unlikely to be worse than average. The interesting thing about the latest What Car? article is that they say the new IS is not as refined as the Honda or the Jag X Type engines. They don't mention the BM.

Some of the press comment is around the fact that it isn't what they would have expected from the exceptional standards of Lexus. For me then if its not significantly worse than the rest of the viable alternatives thats good enough - on top of which this is the car I want, the BM isn't.

Cannot run to the IS250 cost whilst still employed, so that's not an option.

When UK car magazines began to review the new Lexus IS, I was disappointed by their lack of objectiveness. in particular, having driven the car myself, criticisms of the ride and steering seemed completely unfounded. Also the diesel engine really is excellent. I haven't expereinced it in the IS yet, but in other Toyotas it really shines - and unlike BMWs, it gets better with use, rather than losing its refinement with age.

Anyway, now that most of the UK rags are doing their end of year reviews, we're seeing the IS get much better write-ups. In particular, Top Gear rated it above the 3-Series and Car was much more lavish in its praise than it had been before. Mole said something on this forum about motoring journalists not wishing to bite the hand that feeds them with advertising. At least they said the right thing in the end.

The proof is in the eating (or rather the buying) and Lexus sales in the USA show that it is doing very well indeed. According to My.IS Lexus has achieved its best ever month with the IS since the model began life in 1999. Well done Lexus.

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