e-yes

I’d be giving my dealership a call soon as I need to decide whether I am going to return the car to them or not at the end of the term in July.

—C

ICYMI … the total system output is now 245 HP !!! 
However no change to the 0-60 time.

Seems like the website is work-in-progress. I was hoping for the 245HP but was also expecting better performance with higher output.

10 hours ago, Vatreni said:

I read the user guide cover to cover and couldn't find that. That really isn't that fast for the Autobahn - is this a Lexus "safety" feature?

IIRC both 0-62mph and top speed are to conform to some emissions standards.

However, the ES hybrid has been known to have been under advertised. Some reviewers on YouTube have measured 0-60mph times of close to 7.5s 

The boot space has been measured to be well over 500 litres.

No one I remember has claimed to have tested the top speed (I think Autogefuehl channel on YouTube tried an autobahn sprint)

Personally I know it goes from 70mph to a “certain” speed like no one expects this car to go. But being in U.K. I didn’t attempt to stick to that speed for too long… simply wanted to loose a Range Rover whose driver couldn’t relate to the fact that a car other than his was making rapid progress in the fast lane and decided to tail gate as that was the best thing he could react with.

Hopefully you may be able to report the correct top sustained speed which the ES can carry.

—E

9 hours ago, peniole said:

It's been a few years, drove ours on the autobahn. Does not crack 200kph. Can't remember exact top speed. It's electronically limited.

Limited to 112mph or about 180kph.

6 hours ago, ColinBarber said:

In the UK the ES 300h F Sport and Takumi grades have active noise cancelling. I assume this functionality is available as standard or an added extra on some of the grades offered in your country on the ES 350?

Typically the larger the diameter of the wheel the more noise is transferred to the cabin so consider grades will smaller wheels. Certainly worth test driving the options available if you can.

I think the Premium Pack also includes ANC ?

I had one installed from dealership and it is a Nextbase unit actually but due to its shape it looks like a Lexus OEM part.

It does what it says it is supposed to do. Connecting to it to do card maintenance is the worst aspect. I prefer to take the card out and format it on the laptop but that needs to be done with care as the card cover might fly off as it comes off. 

These thieves are getting even more creative... Just saw a post on Nextdoor network about a theft being attempted by drilling a hole into the door !

From the videos that the victim has shared, the car appears to be a BMW and they say that the alarm didn't go off.

They were not able to get into the car but they left behind a hefty damage.

1 hour ago, ColinBarber said:

There seems to be more talk about this in the US recently and has been a problem in other countries for as long as in the UK:

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/stolen-lexus-anti-theft-device-1.6994007

 

Those are still the numbers from Canada … and a single province ?

Did you post the wrong link perhaps?

26 minutes ago, andrew-amazing said:

Sure, but on a larger scale, recalls for security are more expensive and I’m sure we know about this security problem but the majority of Toyota or Lexus users don’t.

 

Starting such kind of recalls will make an impact on also all those who had no idea of these things and Toyota probably is worried of the media coverage it can result in 

The other hurdle is that U.K. is not the “significant” market for Toyota/Lexus compared to North America. Are the thefts occurring there as well in significant numbers.

On 1/29/2024 at 1:03 PM, mister_johnn said:

The only cars in the same category are Mercedes E Class, BMW 5 Series, Audi A6, Volvo S90, and maybe a few more. But none of them have a great hybrid system to bring them in line or close to Lexus in regards to fuel consumption or reliability. This is only for the PHEV cars, I didn't consider petrol, diesel, or Tesla Model S (as a fully electric option) because they stopped manufacturing it in the UK around 2020.

I will try to make a small summary of what are some main differences/advantages/disadvantages between these cars:

- all of them have a 2L petrol engine, so should have similar MPG. About 30 MPG in the city and 35 on the motorway with an empty battery. If you have a driveway then you can improve your MPG by charging the battery overnight, newer models have bigger batteries and you can drive pure electric up to 50 miles.

- performance is by far the best with the Volvo S90, the PHEV models have a turbocharger and supercharger.

- included tech is more with Volvo. You get remote access in case you forget your keys you can use your phone, remote pre-conditioning like cooling/heating cabin/seats, defrost windscreen, with the rest you have to pay for the most basic things like reversing camera, blind spot monitor, adaptive cruise control, automatic tailgate or other.

- booth space 360L Audi A6, 370L Mercedes E Class, 410L BMW 5 Series, 460L Volvo S90, 430L Lexus ES

- I haven't found any report or news regarding the theft of a Volvo with a reg plate over 2020, searched on social media, news, and any place possible on the internet. If you know one, please let me know.

- when purchasing a new Volvo you get the option to buy a service plan up to 5 years or 90.000 miles  (serviced every 18.000 miles) for around £1.150 or £699 for 2 years or 36.000 miles for a pre-approved used. BMW is £1.080 for 2 years or 36.000 miles, Mercedes is £1.152 for 2 years or 20.000 miles, Audi is £520 for 2 years or 20.000 miles. Lexus is £885 for 2 years or 20.000 miles. All are pre-approved, I'm sure most of them have a deal for new cars, but I am looking for a pre-approved one.

- Volvo has most of the controls on the central tablet which can be distracting while driving.

The rest like design, ride quality, and other things are debatable as we all like different things.

I miss my ES, but I want to sleep relax and not think about being stolen or damaged, and so far Volvo ticks the most important boxes for me... for you might be different.

 

Thanks Mister John for the detailed response.

I don't see Volvo selling the saloons any more and really would avoid an SUV style if I can. Also trying to avoid a plugin hybrid... I am not convinced about them. For the most part, the plugin hybrids in my opinion are a an effective tax-avoidance instrument if the car is purchased/operated under business expense. Can't see myself having to plug-in AND fill up with petrol, should be one or the other.

I considered the same cars you have enumerated above and the ES came out the most pragmatic choice at the time. I tried the V90 and it had a very nice ride (a dead steering as well) but the petrol engine made some racket under load... the ES I was expecting would be even louder but surprisingly was the quietest of all.

So far, the Tesla Model 3 is making sense as a pure EV but definitely not a long term keeper... and the way it is setup on the inside, it is like operating a computer or a tablet, something I am really trying to avoid as I do that too much as a part of my day job already. Don't want to operate a computer I don't like or cannot setup the way I want to... it doesn't even have CarPlay and apple Music streaming will require a subscription from Tesla after first month of ownership.

If I must get into an SUV type car then so far the new Honda CRV is coming up as a sensible option. I haven't test driven it as yet but going by the reviews (Savagegeese, Tom Volke, Ryan Douthit all are generally very positive but not super excited about it)... and being a Honda I think it might well be a keeper, if a tad boring and far less luxurious than the ES. Test drive may change my opinion about the luxury aspect but I am sure it won't be like a Lexus NX (and won't cost as much as the NX as well)

--E

12 hours ago, ColinBarber said:

Almost impossible even without P2D enabled. I believe they recently updated the phone app to stop the 'key' working if the phone hasn't been moved for a period of time, similar to the sleeping you get with physical key fobs. The refreshed M3 just launched also implements UWB, not that relay attacks are that practical with bluetooth anyway.

Obviously a vulnerability might be discovered in the future, as with any car, but given the programmable nature of the vehicle its more likely that Tesla could fix an issue in software via an over the air update than Lexus could with the ES.

 

Not sure all the security features are recognised by Thatcham, and no locking wheel nuts, means even the RWD model is in the highest insurance group.

No locking wheel nuts is a very odd omission !

Is it simply cost control or is it due to the electric drive train ? 

22 minutes ago, Tonyw said:

Thought of another option today, whilst scrolling Autotrader 

The car itself has great reviews but the 2.5l engine and auto gearbox are hated by journalists (where have I read that before)

I had one as a company car at launch in 2013, the 2.2 diesel and loved it

Mazda 6 GT sport is the ES Takumi equivalent in spec, few years old low mileage cars are often under £20k from main dealer. I only do 6k miles a year so the fact it is not a hybrid and will use a bit more fuel doesn’t really bother me (work gives me 25p per mile back anyway)

I had a Mazda 6 from new in the highest trim but in manual petrol guise.

On long runs I could get 50mpg out of it.

Mind blowing suspension tuning for a front wheel drive setup.

But when we switched from being two car household to single car, part exchanged our BMW 3 Touring and the Mazda 6 … and went with that horrendous A6 Audi f*%#ing crap. Wife doesn’t drive manuals and the BMW had started showing its age… needed a suspension rebuild which I didn’t want to delve into. 
 

TLDR; Mazda 6 for me was very good. Not quite as premium as the ES but then also not anywhere near as pricey as Lexus and at that point of time Mazda were also doing the 0% finance thingy as well. The seats experience on the Mazda 6 was that they were fine for drives up to 2 hours at a stretch but then a break was needed if driving any further. On the ES I think I can drive 4/5 hours straight without getting fatigued.

How about a GS ? Are they vulnerable as well ?

11 hours ago, Tonyw said:

I have started to keep an eye on different 3yr old PHEVs, ranging from the Kia Optima through to the 5 series. Other completely different car on my watchlist is the 3.3 Kia Stinger

That’s interesting, are the 5 series PHEVs good ? And will they have batteries with some life left in them after three years ?

8 hours ago, Ken R said:

Lexus NX350h is the best option.

I did a test drive and sadly the comfort levels are a step below ES.

I am thinking of trying the lower spec NX with 18 inch wheels and see how that goes… but again sadly those cannot be had with memory seats so that will be a negative. On the plus side, won’t have to deal with those high tech touchy-feely-looky buttons on the steering.

If I have to take a step down from comfort then might as well also consider the Tesla 3 and bring the overall costs down.

Or, keep the ES and see how big YoY hit I take on insurance, it is quite possible that the 3x increase is about as much as the actuaries think is sufficient for a long enough period of time.

Buying a new car is tbh bothersome… I know what I have now with my ES is as good as it gets… but for the lack of peace of mind due to the scumbag thieves.

1 hour ago, Tickedon said:

DriveTheDeal.com will get you not far away from 20% off an Audi A4 depending on exact trim…

I moved from an A4 to an NX - I’d never go back and the only thing I miss is the extending seat support! 

I would also avoid the previous gen RX as regardless of what you do, you’ll be paying the higher insurance rate due to theft risk. 

Those MLB platform models (A4 onwards) should be sold with a warning... the engines are longitudinal but still drive the front wheels which in RHD variants ends up stealing space from the driver. For me pretty much impossible to sit comfortably.

Also, yes the RX will continue to be plagued by insurance costs.

11 minutes ago, Dippo said:

There just seems to be a shortage of decent sized family saloons that will run on petrol, and are not plug in hybrids. I don't need an SUV, but manufacturers seem to be forcing us down that road.

Well, there is BMW 3 and 5 , Mercedes E class, Audi A4/5/6 .. A7 is too big, Jaguar XF.

But I am not looking into those brands for various reasons. BMW specifically are on a mission to produce ducking fugly products of late.

The Japanese are low volume sellers in UK/Europe thus are forced into offering "flavour of the month" that is in demand and those are SUVs sadly.

1 hour ago, Spock66 said:

I had a couple of Nissan Primeras 20+ years ago and they were very solid and reliable cars, I think Nissan have gone down hill as a manufacturer since the tie up with Renault.  The X-Trail in particular scores very poorly on reliability.

Even the very new one ?

Hi,

Considering what with all the thefts and insurance issues, I have taken the following steps so far

• Disklok steering lock
• Bollard
• Maybe add a wheel clamp if going out of country for a few days and deflate the rear tyres to lowest tolerable level which won't damage the TPWS sensors.
• Was considering Ghost but as per other topics in the forum it appears Ghost is having issues and personally I would not want to futz around with the complicated electronics and run the risk of voiding warranty.

With all (bar one) of the above, I think I will likely prevent a theft. However, the other longer term risk is insurance cost. My insurance went from under £400 to just about £1200... which is a 3x increase but in the grand scheme of things still tolerable. But what if it keeps increasing year on year ? Anything over £2000 and it stops making financial sense keeping the car for the full 10 year period I had hoped to keep it for.

I am considering the following...

Lexus NX350h

All good however not as comfortable or luxurious as the ES even in Takumi trim.

Lexus RX previous gen

Can try and negotiate the selling dealership to work out that CANBUS mitigation into the deal. But pretty sure insurance not getting any cheaper on this route as well.

(Not considering the new generation RX because in my view it is not a good value at all)

Subaru Outback

Haven't checked how the insurance is but seems like a good value. I had the chance to be a passenger in one of these as a taxi in Iceland ! Very plush and comfortable... quite a bit more than the new NX.

Downsides I see are is that it is a bit sluggish and not as economical as the ES

Nissan X-Trail

The new one seems to be a good value and comfortable.

Didn't think I would consider this... but Tesla Model 3

Purely because it is surprisingly coming in at very affordable levels all things considered.

Also in the play but probably will never make it... Audi A4 Estate Petrol 2.0 TSI

Well... a highly specced one of these is coming in cheaper than a new ES Takumi and having had some experience with VAG dealerships, I think it may still be possible to track down that one dealer who is willing to knock of up to 20% from the RRP. However... had bad experience with this so called "luxury" brand so... probably will never go this way.

Thoughts... ?

--E

It is kind of odd that now the motoring press is impressed with the gearbox 🤔

The very same gearbox which was widely deemed whiny/droney and not befitting of a car which is competing with the likes of the haloed Germans.

I really want to keep mine for as long as possible, I went in and out of three brand new cars to find the one that I love.

Getting bollard installed as well to protect it.

However, if the thefts continue and insurance continues to rise to unreasonable level then I will have to hand it back to Lexus and let it be their problem at the end of the PCP term 😕 

--E

If at all there is a smoking gun, Lexus themselves charged me £1184.68 for insuring my ES this time whereas last time I was with a different insurer and the premium was about £400 and that insurer simply sent an email saying they are not going to insure my ES. Every other quote this time was around the same as Lexus so I decided to insure with them.

—E

I have also went ahead and ordered installation from the same company. They recommended for my “setup” a single bollard will be sufficient to box the car in.

The one thing I was thinking though if bollard will give way if sufficient torque is applied eg trying to take the bollard down by “running it over” with the car itself ?

However, going by how these thieves operate it appears that they are interested if it can be done within a few minutes, that way a bollard will add several minutes to the task and might be an effective deterrent.

Cops in U.K. should be driving ESes… they don’t appear to be prepared to get anywhere or get anything done… might as well chill out in the car while (not) doing their jobs. 

10 hours ago, Gary H said:

A shame you didn't like the NX350h Takumi @e-yes - as that's exactly what I have! I'm pleasantly surprised they had one available to test drive as my dealer was unable to get any NX350h for majority of the 16 months I had to wait for mine... They did have an NX450h - but it was literally always out in use... So basically, the first time I'd experienced one out on the road was my own car... 

I've never experienced the ES unfortunately but it's very much a car my eye was on if my circumstances were different. 

Personally, I do like what I have but of course, it's each to their own. I've only had it four months but has already proven itself to be an excellent motorway cruiser. Well equipped and I personally find it comfortable (although I do see your point over the thigh support). Certainly more so than the UX250h it replaced...and that was decent for what it was.

The loan NX was a 73 reg, pretty much "fresh off the boat" unit as it had a mere 340 miles on the odometer ! My guess would be that I am probably amongst the first few who are getting to test drive that specific one.

It is certainly a lovely Lexus... other than the two things that glitched for me personally, I don't see why it won't sell well if Lexus could ship enough of them to UK. I would end up replacing the tyres to non RFTs after some time... that's all. 

I have had the UX300e Takumi and UX250h F-Sport as loan cars and the 300e was quite plush (and heavy !) but certainly not better than the NX Takumi.

--E