Desmond

So pleased I'm not the only one!

Mind you this no key business can be a pain if you just want to open or close the garage door or grab something you've forgotten without switching off.

I'm not criticising folks on here for their opinions on the Lexus but I do think technique matters more than the model of car.

Precisely, being confident about ones ability to drive does not make one ignorant. If winter tyres help one's confidence then so be it. If they were necessary in the UK they would have been the law. End of story. :)

I agree. Some of us were lucky to have learnt to drive in days when instructors taught you about the relationship between the engine speed and the road speed in adverse conditions. As I understand it, learners these days are simply told to use the brakes to slow down and miss gears on the change down as the car comes to a halt. There is no way that a driver can be in full control on snow with that method but you will see younger drivers getting into trouble with it every day while this bad weather is on. I'm far from a brilliant driver, just fortunate enough to have be taught properly.

Ahh... Something I can happily relate to. I mean I couldn't count the number of times I have got myself out of a mess just because of gearing down to assist in decelerating rather than jamming the brakes. It's true but sad how little they teach drivers these days about technique.

Something else to relate to - for years those old cars were on narrow cross-ply tyres. On snow and slush those tyres with their more rigid side walls would cut their own track and not follow the ruts so you could keep the front & rear wheels better aligned and reduced skid risk. Radials are better on sheer ice but not much, even soft winter tyres won't help a lot on that. The low profiles on my 250 have decent tread and grip well but I'm always conscious that they are going over the snow rather than through it. The bloke down the road has a lot more bother with his BMW than I do with the Lexus but that is more down to his heavy right clog than the car or the tyres!

I'm not criticising folks on here for their opinions on the Lexus but I do think technique matters more than the model of car.

Precisely, being confident about ones ability to drive does not make one ignorant. If winter tyres help one's confidence then so be it. If they were necessary in the UK they would have been the law. End of story. :)

I agree. Some of us were lucky to have learnt to drive in days when instructors taught you about the relationship between the engine speed and the road speed in adverse conditions. As I understand it, learners these days are simply told to use the brakes to slow down and miss gears on the change down as the car comes to a halt. There is no way that a driver can be in full control on snow with that method but you will see younger drivers getting into trouble with it every day while this bad weather is on. I'm far from a brilliant driver, just fortunate enough to have be taught properly.

OK, I live in a fairly flat area but I haven't had much bother with either the 220d manual or the 250 auto in the snow. No snow tyres either. Perhaps it's because I was brought up on rear wheel drive cars and learnt to drive when they were the norm. For a year in the late 60s I had to commute from Huddersfield to Harrogate in a Wolseley 1500 going up past Yeadon in all weathers including snow a lot thicker than this few inches. Very rarely were people stuck even in some really ancient machines like Ford 100Es and limited road gritting. Why? Because drivers learnt how to control the throttle, how to avoid braking and keep the wheels rolling and how to keep the wheels in line.

In the 80s for my sins we had a Marina Coupe which was a pig of a car but even that never got stuck. A good weight in the boot and it was good as gold, better than my Maxi that used to snowplough if there was more than 6 inches of the white stuff. The old Viva estate was the same. Many a trip over the Humber Bridge in a blizzard in that old thing. The best car of the lot for snow was the Hillman Imp. A sack of sand in the front boot and it would go anywhere.

I'm not criticising folks on here for their opinions on the Lexus but I do think technique matters more than the model of car.

Cheers Gary & Carl. I guessed it must be something I'd missed. The 220SEL was a used car so someone must have set that up before me and I assumed the Advance would be the same. The day/night option isn't there in the daytime but last night in the pale moonlight I saw it - there it was. All sorted thanks.

The 220 SEL had a night mode option for the navigation/climate/audio display. Is this not available on my 250 Advance or am I just being thick and can't find it?

The normal brightness setting is way too strong from night driving and that can be reduced via the DISPLAY button but I'd prefer a proper night mode ...... if there is one.

The diesels did not mate with the rest of the car. They were simply transplanted from the Avensis range for which they were designed. Lexus should have sought a 3 litre diesel from wag or BMW......imagine the is Lexus IS 335 I, a global car. BMW reliability I,proved by association with Lexus, and the cars assembled and badger as the Lexus is350 td

The Avensis has suffered too because of the engine. The problem isn't because it was a Toyota engine, all Lexus vehicles are Toyotas. I was surprised when Toyota announced the 180 engine, not sure why they didn't do a deal with BMW, they are teaming up quite often these days such as with the Mini One diesel engine and co-sharing hybrid research and technology.

Fleet sales of the IS have really dried up this year, down over 50%. Partly due to the CT but I'm sure it is also to do with the fact that poor reliability has driven sales away.

The diesel Avensis was a good car, at least from the revamped 2006 onwards. So quiet you could hardly tell it was a diesel and the gearbox was a cracker. I don't know what the latest one is like but I had 3 years excellent value out of mine.

When I became a 220d owner I found the difference amazingly disappointing. The engine was smelly and gave a constant vibro-massage. I thought it may improve as the engine ran in but it didn't. The gearbox was terrible for a car of this pedigree. Apart from the useless 6th gear, the change was agricultural compared to the Avensis.

I liked the car as a motorway cruiser though the mpg wasn't anything sparkling and the build quality was excellent. The torque was really good but you had to drive it quite hard. Unlike the Avensis 2.2d it would not pull at low revs or toddle around town in 4th gear. Maybe this was due to the weight or the gear ratios or the engine is simply more highly strung. I have to say the 250 makes the 220d feel like a tractor.

The 6th gear issue is not quite as simple as it being an overdrive. I went from an Avensis 2.2d to a Lexus 220d and was astounded at the difference. The Avensis gearing was sensible, 6th gear was still high but not so high as to be unusable at 60 mph. On a motorway there was no need to change down for inclines or even for most overtaking. In 2 years with the 220d I hardly ever used 6th gear because it was hopeless below 75 mph. The result was a poorer fuel consumption than the Avensis at all speeds.

To be honest I found the whole 220d gearbox a bit of an agricultural pain and it spoilt an otherwise smashing car. The torque is superb for overtaking and it is otherwise a pleasure to drive.

Hi All, just aquired the above from Lexus, is it normal to take over 10 mins / 5 miles to warm up? considering it appears the front grill is is not open to fresh air? ie no holes in the grill from what I can see.

Just concerned about optimum mpg not being reached by the end of my commute

Mine was pretty much up to temperature after about a mile driving at or under 2000 rpm. I find the same with the IS-F, after about a mile the temperature gauge is off the stop and continues until it holds at mid point on the gauge.

Likewise.

Thanks Colin. The wheels don't seem to have the same "snap" as the front vents but they do sort of click off. Air still leaks out though. It may be what you say - the foam seal. Anyway, for now I've made a temporary cover from thin black foam and a bit of blutak! :D

Just a little problem - does anyone know how to close the rear vents at the back of the centre console?

Noticed this with both my diesel & petrol cars that not every rear seat passenger wants air coming at them either up or down especially cold air. But I can't find a way to turn off the vents completely. Tried turning the wheel and flipping the direction lever up and down. Slows down the flow a bit but doesn't turn it off. Am I missing something obvious? Anybody know?

Hi Kenny,

Diesels will always save a bit of money compared to its petrol equivalent but there are other things to put into consideration. Diesel cars are more expensive to buy than their petrol equivalent, am guessing the IS220 will not be as refined as the IS250 in terms of cabin noise on day to day driving. IS220 only comes with manual and IS250 could have manual or tiptronic(manumatic). Deiseld are slightyly more expensive to service than petrol and if things like an injector fails on a diesels could cost around £500 to £1000 to replace which wipes out any savings made from fuel expense. Petrol powered cars tend to perfom better top end than their diesel equivalent.

Diesels tend to shine only on motorway driving so if 80 to 90% of your driving will be town driving then you might not save as much by driving a diesel as their heavier than petrol engines. Turbos have to be replaced on a diesel at some point which cost around £1000 to £1500 put will not have to be replaced on a naturally aspirated petrol(IS250) So there are other factors to consider when deciding to go petrol or diesel other than the stated combined MPG figures, like initial price of the car, servicing cost, refinement of the car, performance, repair cost etc …

I agree with this. Having owned both diesel & petrol versions of the Avensis and the IS the main benefit of the diesel is for people who do a high mileage that is mainly motorway. Both diesels were excellent Mway cruisers and both had nice torque if you hit the rev band just right. But for lower mileage, normal motoring the advantage is a lot less. Refinement, vibration and smell on my IS220, definitely play a part in the choice. Personally I found the Avensis 2.2d a better car to ride in than the Lexus and definitely a much better gearbox.

The IS250 may cost me marginally more to run than the 220d but it is worth it for the sheer ease and comfort with with it works. There was no premium on the cost of either the Avensis or Lexus diesels and in fact the 220d is a good bit cheaper to buy than the 250, nevertheless I swapped and haven't regretted it for a moment. But there again I don't do anything close to 20k a year so other people may have different priorities.

I swapped over from diesel to IS250 mainly because I got fed up of the gearbox. The ratios are odd and there is no point in having 6th gear at all. To drive the car was a pleasure in some ways - for a diesel it revs well. In fact you have to keep the revs up to get the performance because low down torque is poor. This rather ruins the point of having a diesel. It is reasonably quiet once you get up to cruising speed. On a motorway the economy can be good but fuel consumption is no better overall than a lot of petrol engines and round town it really isn't great. Mix that with the weird gearbox and this isn't a fantastic town car. Mine had an intermittent smell of diesel in the cabin but I could never pin down the cause. Plus there is a constant vibro massage from the motor, comes through the pedals and the seats.

The IS250 is a totally different beast. The economy isn't good but it's fair enough from a 2.5L 6 cylinder auto. If your mileage is below average, which mine is nowadays, this doesn't matter as much as you think it would, especially with the diesel/petrol price gap. Certainly it is a far easier and much quieter car to drive in all circumstances. The handling is just as good as the 220d but the whole experience feels more relaxed. Like any car there are issues that need to be considered when buying used but compared to the 220d the evidence in LOC members' posts points to it being more reliable.

In the end you pays yer money and makes yer choice. Diesels are cheaper so you can get more goodies for your cash. It just depends on what your priorities are.

That's helpful Don. What are they like for noise?

Hi all

I started this topic on Wheels & Tyres but no takers so I thought I'd try on here. Any thoughts welcome.

http://www.lexusowne...=0

As the weather is supposed to get warmer I thought it was time to think seriously about next winter. Last year I ran the 220d on ordinary tyres and it was no great problem as it's fairly flat here and we didn't get too much snow. This year it will be an is250 and I read a lot of talk about the lack of grip so I was thinking maybe of finding some all season 18" tyres.

My reasoning is that I have nowhere to store winter/summer tyres and in any case I'm reluctant to have tyres changed and wheels balanced and all that clatting about twice a year. In theory it would be better to have two sets of wheels but again storage is the big problem.

So, does anyone have experience of all season tyres especially on the is250? Are they any good? Are they much noisier? Are there any makes to go for or avoid?

Also posted here -

http://www.lexusownersclub.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=77460

didn't mean to bump an old thread, but I ran into an updated list for 2012, from MSN. Not sure how true it is, but here we go:

http://cars.uk.msn.c...-in-the-uk-2012

Almost certainly this is caused by disgruntled BMW owners who with they'd bought a decent car. :winky:

Depends how much you value stuff like electric sunshade, wood effect console auto-fold mirrors and one or two other bits. The satnav & stereo are the same this year as is the wheel size.

I think most of the specs can be compared on the Lexus website.

According to my dealer, the next generation IS will be available only as an IS 300 hybrid. The petrol engine will (unfortunately) be a four cylinder, and the combined output will be more than 250 hp.

I think this sounds awesome. Driving my wife's CT has made me feel like conventional petrol cars are old fashioned. I'm drooling over the new GS (the interior is fantastic in real life), but it's too big for me, and also a bit more than I am willing to spend.

I have no idea about the price, but a fully loaded IS 300h at EUR 55 k would be OK for me.

What do you think?

The theory is fine but I am not convinced that the hybrid route is going to be the long term replacement for straightforward petrol. Even if companies like Toyota continue with the idea they will be continually adjusting and altering the technology. That is fair enough for them but where does that leave us as customers? Unless we are willing to swap motors every 3 years at most we run the risk of being left with a car that will be very unattractive as a second hand buy. At the moment even quite elderly IS 200/250 models are quite well thought of in the market but can anyone say the same of a Mk1 Prius? Will the CT200 have any decent trade in value in 3 years unless to a Lexus dealer selling the latest version?

I realise the second hand market and devaluation have always been dodgy but with Toyota/Lexus preferring to go fairly exclusively down the hybrid road, owners could be stuck in the only marque that will give them a decent PX. However good the cars are, that isn't a great situation to be in. And ... there is no guarantee that hybrids will stay as the main engine, Toyota could just as easily abandon them in a decade's time.

There's a big difference between engine braking as a product of being in the right gear at the right time and changing gear solely with the sole intention of slowing down.

I was looking for an answer to this little matter and found this thread already going. Some fascinating reading but I think Baldchap has hit the nail on the head with this comment.

It always was taught that you should keep your engine speed at a level where it would be useful - that is, so you could pull away with no strain and slow down with reasonable revs. It wasn't really to save the brakes, it was to give you the best control over the car. This is why I think the current thinking about using brakes only to slow down is not only wrong, in some cases it can be downright dangerous. Coming down a hill or even up to a junction on the flat, you do not know what the road surface is like until you get there. In the winter you will see young drivers especially sliding up to junctions simply because they only used the brakes, have no grip, and the engine has been left to do its own thing.

As long as the IS250 does use engine braking then OK, but I do wonder if it uses it enough to maintain the right engine speed relative to the road speed. It seems to me to be engineered to coast a long way, maybe for fuel saving. So it might well be safest on steep hills and wintery roads to used manual control.

Fair review that one F.A. Having not long made the move from diesel to petrol I'd agree with all you say. The 250 is a totally different car. The diesel came into its own on a motorway, much smoother and much better than town performance with the weird gearing but it is really irritating to have a top gear that's virtually unusable. There isn't that much difference in fuel cost either.

Must admit I do miss that nice feeling you get in a manual when you drop a cog or two and give it a bit of wellie to get by a slow mover but overall I am more than pleased with the swap even if it meant losing one or two goodies.

Hi All,

My experience is about average I guess. Gearbox replaced after clutch thrust bearing repacement didn't quieten the rattly gearbox/clutch noise, all under warranty. All quiet now though. Rebulit engine (under warranty again) which failed in Italy on holiday :megaangry: last year, Lexus customer service was exemplary and the 220D SE Multi is now brilliant. I learnt fairly quickly that 6th is useless exept at above 75 when the engine vibes smooth out considerably which by all accounts is better than other 220D owners. Fuel consumption is up to about 50mpg on a run and only down to about 37/38 in town, I'd say thats good. I have just fiited a "black box" and noticed how much smoother and quieter the engine is at the kind of speeds/gears I use. I'm initially impressed. The "hole" in response up to 2000rpm has gone and it now picks up at about 1500/1600rpm which is much better. It's too early for mpg results but will keep you all posted. The new 200D's gearbox is better as I was given one as a courtesy car. I also had a 250 and prefer my 220D maybe as I was driving it like a diesel rather than chasing the revs around the clock. There still isn't anything like a Lexus for quality of finish and standard gadgets. Would I buy another one, yes the new 200d or even give it up for a C, the 200h doesnt quite do it for me . . . . . . . . . . . . yet.

That's interesting because the first thing I noticed on the IS250 was that I was using lower revs than I did on the diesel for the same performance. Admittedly I haven't fully explored the performance (yet!) but in "limo mode" it seems to be very happily and smoothly running about town and motorways and whatever and giving a respectable mpg around the 36 mark.

I agree with you about the CT, Lexus hasn't quite got it right yet, especially in the fittings and furnishings department.

Well I've gone and done it now - swapped the 220d for a 250. They are two totally different beasts. The ride quality in a 250 is quite different and the noise level quiet in comparison though in fairness the diesel is very quiet at motorway speeds. The biggest differences though are the gearbox and the vibration factor. To me in seems incomprehensible that a company like Lexus can produce a 6 gear car in which the 6th gear is unusable. Then there are the weird ratios. It was this that made me swap in the end - having to change gear so often to keep the torque and the lack of flexibility in the engine. Driving a diesel like a highly strung petrol engine is bound to bring a fuel penalty and it sure did. The vibro-massage is there at all speeds, passengers noticed it more than I did but it was just an irritant in a car of this quality.

In some ways I was sad to part with the car, The roadholding is excellent and it is a good A to B car but I expected more than that. The 250 is a much more versatile motor, not to mention much easier to drive and more comfortable. To be honest, it is the car I should have bought in the first place.

This is the year of the car, not when I was driving it! :D

1954 Ford Pop E39 - Dad's car

1960 Ford Pop 100e - new big ends anyone?

1962 Wolsley 1500 - college car, brilliant motor

1962 Viva HA - good car, rust bucket

1964 Mini pick up - wish I'd kept it, worth a fortune now

1967 Minivan - fun

1972 Mini 1000 - fun and brand new

1973 Imp - fun plus water pumps

1974 Imp Sport - even more fun plus water pumps and head gaskets

1974 Viva HC 1800 - gas guzzler

1976 Honda Civic - sewing machine on wheels

1978 Honda Civic 1500 - brilliant drive but another rust bucket

1978 Marina - no comment

1979 Maxi - grown up motor

1979 Alfasud - wonder car when it went

1979 Viva HC estate - good looking but rather damp

1981 Renault 14TS - gearbox uniquely crap

1983 Toyota Tercel - very reliable but slow

1985 Corolla 1300 - reliable but quicker

1987 Corolla 1300 - even slower than a Tercel

1988 Carina 1600 - mini limo, nice car

1991 Corolla GTi - jet ski

1993 Carina - boring

1994 Corolla Liftback GLi - cracking motor

1997 Carina E CDX - laid back, loved it

2003 Avensis 2.0 - rock hard ride & lumpy motor

2007 Avensis 2.2 diesel - excellent cruiser

2010 Lexus IS 220d - luxury spoilt by vibro-massage & strange ratios

2012 ?? could be IS 250

That's interesting. Do both seats have height adjustment and how do you do it? I never had time to really investigate so I'd be pleased to know.

The CT SE-L is manual for both front seats, the SE-L on the IS is electric full range adjustment as is the Advance. A bit naughty really.