spwolfx

Thing is the IS350 isnt even that bad on fuel, petrol engines have come a long way but people just wont bite the bullet and see.

i guess hybrids are evolution of petrols anyway :-).

My GS350 AWD got 12-15 mpg (US MPG) in city driving (normal, not "eco") in European cities... actual highway steady driving was quite good - 25-28 mpg for 80-100 mph highway... but of course, as soon as you are off the highway, your average drops right away since you are constantly slowing down and accelerating and that ruins averages quickly.

For instance GS350 averaged around 15 MPG (US) for me, while much more boring IS220d averages 24 MPG over same routes.

From my past experience, I think i will get around 30 MPG in IS300h, easily... and >35 MPG (US) if I pamper it... those are pretty good numbers considering my wife's 1.4 Nissan Note gets 25 mpg (same routes).

1. I forget which one it was but I'm sure one of the reviews states that the IS300h has the best in gear performance than any of its rivals

in terms of effortless driving it probably wins where you have the instant torque from the electric motor. But it really isn't fair to compare directly against a normal transmission vehicle which is held in-gear, the IS will rev up the engine so I don't feel it is technically being 'held' in-gear

best times for manuals are quoted usually in best gear, for instance 3rd for 80-120kmh, not in 6th..

What i find interesting is that some review mention good instant acceleration and some that acceleration cant be felt at all... I bet acceleration under 100 mpg is pretty strong, as the car has a lot more hp than CT200h - 63%.

one motor is just a generator and starter. The real electric motor is rated at 142hp, it is basically the same one as in the US ES300h. The IC engine is also out of the US ES300h but has been reworked and gained an extra 20hp.

The combined system output is around 223hp, this is because the IC engine and the motor outputs are never at maximum at the same time.

The 42hp comes from the motoring press who don't know what they are talking about. They see the engine has an output of 181hp and a total system output of 223hp and therefore assume the motor is 42hp.

The data is all now available on the Lexus EU website:

http://www.lexus.eu/car-models/is/is-300h/index.tmex#/PricesAndSpecifications

there is no need to argue with another Lexus fan - i worked for Toyota for years, and had Prius for 3... What you are saying is correct with added note of maximum Battery output being 42hp... it is limited by Battery and not by motor... they use stronger motor so they can recover more energy, faster.

For instance, prius plugin has exactly the same motors but uses almost double the hp, since its Battery can handle it. Battery technology and size matters when it comes to maximum output. Of course, even if 100hp was possible, problem would be to recover that much energy between you using it, so it is somewhat of happy medium.

Of course, 42hp is not little - this is why I expect IS300h to be a lot peppier when you press gas at 40 mph than IS250, you simply get 42hp right away, instead of "building up to it" with classic engine. It is like electric turbo.

spwolfx I hear you, and luckily the electric motor is around 140hp not 42hp. :)

The problem is the motoring press are treating the vehicle as an out and out sports saloon which it isn't, mainly due to the CVT. This perception isn't helped by the fact that Lexus put in a rather pointless paddle shift system to simulation a more traditional gearbox and the completely pointless simulated engine sound through the stereo.

I would rather Lexus just let the vehicle be what it is, not something it isn't, remove the 'simulation' equipment, save a bit of weight and lower the price with the money saved.

Battery output is max 42hp, there are 2 motors, combined over 200hp, but they help out with 42hp at the end.

All that simulated stuff is useful - for instance if you want to hold "gears" in the corner, thats why it is there... it is all software, no extra weight at all.

US media, usually a lot more conservative have no issues with understanding hybrids while European media think it is Satan coming to steal their precious diesels away.

no, there are UK IS300h reviews everywhere, and they say 300h is terrible and goes beserk and wants to explode when you touch the pedal :-)

the last couple of reviews I've seen haven't been too bad. The earlier ones from the normal motoring press, paid for by the European car industry, haven't been too impressed - it is mainly the CVT gearbox that is the issue.

big over-reaction... I had Prius, which is much less hp, which actual shows the "problem" much more but so what... its part of the experience. Just like diesel tick-tack and loss of power over 4500-5000 rpm. It is also not classic CVT, whoever drove real CVT cars knows its much worse, here you get 42hp electric motor giving you instant kick, so it is actually very different.

It is crazy that american media can accept it for what it is, despite their love of BMW for instance, and still rate IS350 better, while you have UK media telling us things like BMW having classier cabin and better steering - what? did they drive it? classier cabin than what? Toyota? Questionable... Lexus certainly not. First thing that was really dissapointing in F30 was quality of interior which was not up to class standards at all. Riding in the back of 320d, I could have been in Avensis.

So much difference in opinion is saddening.

What a shame the IS350 isnt available, its just the perfect balance imo

I agree with you completely. I have never driven the IS 350, and would probably prefer a hypothetical IS 450h, but if the IS 350 was available in Europe I would find it very hard to resist. As I explained above, I really like the new 300h, but an IS 350 would win my heart, since I want the most powerful engine!

I had GS350 AWD (imported to Europe)... wonderful engine, very fast, very smooth. However... city fuel consumption 15l-20l/100km....

let me quote here from whatcar 3/5:

If you're looking for the best all-rounder, the 3 Series remains the car to choose; it has a stronger engine, superior driving manners and a classier, more practical cabin. However, the IS's tiny running costs mean it is worth considering as an alternative to the A4 and C-Class.

one word i have to say to this: HA HA HA.

no, there are UK IS300h reviews everywhere, and they say 300h is terrible and goes beserk and wants to explode when you touch the pedal :-)

awesome... tell us more about how did IS300h feel when driving? I have driven plenty of Prii, and found them fine... UK reviewers seem to hate the notion of CVT, although PSD acts differently since there is 42hp motor helping at all time.

As to the color combo... red interior for sure!

Well considering that the new GS is almost as new, Lexus didn't do anything much to the 2.5v6, leaving it thirsty and not competitive enough with anything else in the price/class (in terms of co2 etc). If lexus had aspirations of selling loads of GS's then it was a huge error. For me it's great. Rarity value!

Rumour has it that he ES300h drivetrain is destined for the GS soon, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if the new IS has that 2.5 litre 4 cylinder engine in it and hybrid only. It would make sense- else they won't sell many in the UK at least!

I doubt that there will be a non-hybrid v6 for the new IS. It just will not be competitive enough. I believe it will be dropped for the GS when the hybrid is launched, but I might be wrong.

There will be new IS250 V6 in Europe, with updated transmission...

But main seller is IS300h, it used 4cly AR engine with Direct injection... it might have up to 240hp and new transmission to make it sportier.

Thats definitely what I am looking at.

As to the CVT, thats grossly overplayed by media.. it doesnt use CVT but PSD, which is similar in operation... what makes big difference is electric motors built into the PSD, they give you instant 40-50hp when you press gas so thats big difference. You can check with people who drive GS450h, it is just effortless speed anytime you press gas.

300h is coming in 2013 Lexus IS... it should have between 210 and 240hp, as well as direct injection and get same mpg as Prius v.

GS is getting same engine in Europe, we just dont know when, quite possibly 2013.

p.s did you find anything new on the subject? i am about to do the same thing as you... thanks!

there is really nothing Lexus service center could do - they dont have some kind of kit from Lexus to isolate your car way you wanted...

IS, RX400h and GS4540h...

of course, doubling the sales is very relative term... Lexus will have to do a lot of doubling before they reach their goals...

... but also keep in mind that in many countries in europe, you cant buy Lexus...

this is how it works - Lexus sends dealers an TSB, so dealers can check it out and find solution to common issues (TSB is not an recall). It can be anything from how to paint new bumper, how to program new keys, updated schematics or engine issue.

Everything is very frank and exact on TSB. If there is an injector TSB for early cars, there are exact VIN numbers of cars that might have the issue. There might be few things for service to check before determening the problem and not all cars might have the problem either.

So whoever got injectors changed, can call up their service advisor and ask them for TSB number, if it exists, and for applicable VIN numbers. If it does, then everyone can check it out with their local dealer.

Or at very least, someone can leave contact info for service rep that has helped before so people can call him up.

---------

On the other note, these engines do need few thousand miles before they can show everything they can do.... My Rav4 after 3,000 miles gets around 10%-15% better mpg than at start and it is a lot smoother and faster - previously at first gear, it really felt like you had to change it right away, now it spins to 4,000 rpm like an petrol engine :-).

Jamboo, I am glad you like the car more and more :-)

yeah, i dont doubt both lexus and a lot of lexus dealers often go through forums... hey, i am here, right (even if not from UK)? ;-).

also, dealers cant see what other dealers send to lexus as reports, until Lexus writes an TSB. They can call up though and ask techs there if they know of any similar issues reported...

If Lexus as a manufacturer (not just individual dealers) read AND RESPONDED to this forum, the forums would be over-run with questions, complaints, digging for info etc. It would ruin the forums. May be nice for individual dealers to show their presence but not to become active forums members.

The track day example given above is a very clear reason why independance is needed. Also if Lexus and all dealer were on here, it may stifle honest opinion.

My previous car had a lot of dealers using the forums, which was generally positive, but was in the sense that salesfolk used the forums as enthusiasts, modified their cars through them, bought and sold parts (their own) and attended meets and track days. I can't see many Lexus sales people doing the same.

Brian :)

yeah, i agree. Aditionally - Lexus relies on their dealers to send problem reports and warranty issues. That way they get complete info on what exactly is wrong, as supposed to forum post which really means nothing if they dont have an vehicle in their hands.

Thats why I always say that with whatever issue you have, you gotta go to the dealer right away.

And I reccomend that to my own customers as well - we tell them to come right away with any issue they have since longer they put it off, more annoyed they will be...

i posted that previously - it needs few more miles on it.

I read your comment on another thread about Avensis T180 - yes, its funny too, isnt it? In Autobild, Avensis's 2.2D4D engine, same as in IS220d, gets rated better than 320d, its the best engine on the market and it beats competition left/right in every test... yet when IS220d fights 320d, it is a lot worse engine... its just funny :-). Most of it has to do with the fact that Avensis is not an true competition to 320d...

I would not suggest black boxing it yet. Wait for the oficial TTE kit. If Toyota decides to warranty it themselves, it would mean it passed all of the hard tests with flying colors...

Keep in mind that diesel engines these days are all aluminium and very powerful already...

To be honest a couple of the lads who used to be active members on here are moving across to Mercedes now, in fact John, the lucky bugger, has a CLS350 on the way I think it is, and that is a stunning motor, IMHO blows all the new Lexus' L-Finesse designs out of the water!

Looking forward to seeing what she's like when he picks her up :D

I'd quite happily have a Merc :)

While Mercedes have improved their quality by miles recently, its still not up to scratch with Lexus at all. We've got a CLS, and to be honest, when we had a new IS as a courtesy car, my whole family agreed, despite the £30k price difference, the IS was the better built car. It also had better seats and had less wind noise (although that could be down to the CLS having pillarless doors).

Now I will agree the CLS is a gorgeous car - imho the best looking saloon car you can buy, and also poss puts a few coupe's to shame

this is probably the most interesting article here - IS better built than CLS, which costs twice as much.

A lot of people are simply expecting too much from Lexus, and hence end up feeling bad BUT at the end, when you compare the stats, Lexus is still better than other companies, by considerable margin.

And while 20-30k is a lot of hard earned money, in reality, all of these cars are mass produced vehicles. There are Toyota's these days more expensive than IS.

From being in business, although not in the UK, I can assure you that there is no other company that values theirs customers as much as Toyota, and that is only multiplied in Lexus. All day, all I hear is how customer is the king and from whatever they do, it is customer mentioned at #1 spot.

At the end, nothing is perfect and we are only but humans. All cars have its faults, there are crooked dealers, inexperienced mechanics, bad washers, but throughout the world Lexus seems to edge out everyone else. Its pursuit of perfection, not perfection itself.

what happens when you use auto up feature by giving an one click up for auto closing? Does the window close properly, or is it one inch left?

It might be combination of two:

- Auto windows are not programmed after Battery was out - simply roll down and then hold up and keep holding up for 10 seconds each window for auto up to be programmed.

- make sure you are not pressing the unlock/lock button by accident...

you expect someone from Lexus answering on forums? interesting.

I fully understand the frustrations from people like Michael and others who have had problems with their cars but some of the things that are the subject of complaints are just comical and unreasonable. Of course I would prefer an MP3 connection in my Lex but I knew it did not have one when I ordered the car, so I do not see the need to complain about it now. Had it been such an important item at the time, I could have ordered another car - the BMW 1 series had one ! But that is not the point is it? Let us blame Lexus for genuine problems; attributing our own failures of judgement in car selection to Lexus does not make sense to me. If other manufacturers have better cars and they are cheaper then by all means change the thing. For me, the 400h is ideal, seat belt beeps and all !

agreed. this is one of the most amazing threads I have read in my whole life.

For example, it is Lexus's fault that Vaistech's hack of the system does not work, and they have read about the hack from the forums so they expected it to work.

The fact that they have managed to meet with Lexus Europe officials about these "issues" is amazing as well.

Lexus of course upgrades and modifies their cars, but unless there is an complete failure of the system, improvements are done through facelifts and new models. This is why in October there will be an mp3 support, new generation nav with new generation Bluetooth, etc, because it is an facelift time and RX is due for those upgrades.

However, Lexus is not small company. Some manager can not tell you/them that it will be fixed right away, because it wont. Unless there is an failure, Lexus has to keep to its contracts and buy exact part from the supplier for the contract lenght.

Obviously, Lexus has logged all complaints and addressed a lot of them during facelift, which is what they would have done anyway.

I am just really amazed that somone made such an fuss about things like mentioned above.

Less than a week old and I've used the sunroof for the second time. I press the button on the door handle to shut everything automatically and the sunroof stops half way and refuses to close automatically. After piddling about with the buttons I manage to get it into the shut position - the buttons now do pretty much their own thing just like the oldest sort of electric sunroof - no one-touch feature.

So I gives them a call and whips in - only a 40 minute drive mind you (which as you can imagine is terrible in one of these things :winky: ). The engineer pops out, says "We've had a few do this - must be the heat" and promptly gets it working in about 30 seconds. :duh:

The fix. Press and hold the Close button and keep holding it until it goes through a full cycle - then it all works lovely and one-touch is back. Apparently a similar thing works for the windows if they ever lose the plot. :P

Now I'm sure mine will be the only one to do that but the info is there if you need it. Shame I can't work out how to do any more of the tricky fixes like make it lock the doors automatically or use the phone keypad while moving (for the odd time the other end asks you to press "star" or whatever).

it is rather that the dealer did not do it during initial PDI... basically, for safety reasons sun roof needs to know where it ends. It resets itself every time Battery is out for a longer time, same as your auto up windows.

so there was really nothing wrong with it - they simply did not set it before delivering the car... if it was sun's fault, it would have to be because it got too hot for the mechanic to remeber what to do :-).

I dont get it - Lexus has an Bluetooth kit (which is pretty darn nice), and of course it is connected to the speakers? This is new Lexus system, works much better than old one.

What you are saying is that some aftermarket manufacturer doesnt have an kit to connect to Lexus yet.

Is your dealer completly sure about not having an holder and charger? I would check accessories for IS and make sure it doesnt. It does not come with Bluetooth kit, but you might be able to order it separatly. I know that Toyota's using same Bluetooth kit have an option of charger/holder (although when you get used to it, it is more convinient to keep it in your pocket /forget about it).

yep, it sure does have it as an addon to Bluetooth kit:

http://www.lexus.co.uk/lexus_cars/is_new/i...s_interior1.asp

(page two, check top right two options).

HI,

Newbie here!

I am so close to buying a 220d sport, but I wondered if any of you knowledgeable people are aware if there is the possibility to remap the ECU. I love the smooth and cosseted refinement of the Lexus, but just wished there was more low down torque. I have an Alfa 156 2.4 JTD currently which has serious grunt from 1400 RPM where as the lexus is closer to 2,200 realistically before it starts pulling swiftly.

Any thoughts, very gratefully recieved!

Thanks to all in advance. B)

How many miles did the test car have? Toyota's new D4D, all aluminium engines like at least 1,000 miles before they give you reasonable performance. My Rav4 didnt want to pull before some 1,000 miles, and now it is pretty nice.