Tailpipe

Picture of new LS460 in Auto Express is a severe photoshop job and hardly does the new car justice. New LS460 looks similar to new IS. Overall concept and shape is almost identical but with shades of GS in the front bumper and lower sills. There will be an an a more powerful V-8 and an LS600h version. The first time Lexus' Hybrid drive system has been mated to a V-8. Best news of all is starting price of under £50,000. This car is going to look gorgeous. Stylish, futuristic and sleek. It is really going to show Mercedes-Benz and Audi the way home. Forget hype and hope, we won't have long to wait until we see it in the flesh. It will be released at the Tokyo Motorshow in a matter of days.

Not quite the whole shooting match. I ordered everything except the Pre-Crash Safety System, which I thought was expensive and un-necessary. This will be my first Lexus ever. Quietly confident that I won't be disappointed. Traded-in my BMW M3 for the IS. I had planned to get the new Audi RS4, but it's so bloody late that I cancelled my order. Thought I'd give Lexus a try. Of course, the IS250 won't be nearly as powerful or handle as well. Instead, I'm hoping it'll have a few qualities you don't find with German cars like: the electrics will work, the engine won't blow-up (twice), the interior headlining won't fall off after just 18 months of ownership and hopefully other drivers won't cut me up just because I'm driving a Lexus. And, yes, Saracen, November 19th just can't come soon enough. Expect driving impressions to be posted here soon after.

Have you heard anything about the IS350 coming to the UK? Apparently it is, but no one knows when. In the meantime, I've ordered an IS250 S-EL automatic in Canterbury Blue with beige leather, SatNav, Sunroof and 18" wheels. Arrives November 19th too. Can't wait. :D

I've been mightily impressed with the new Lexus GS series, but I've only had a limited test-drive. I'd be very interested to hear how members who've now owned the GS430 (and GS300 S-EL) for more than 6 months rate the car. What is it like to drive in town versus country? (I know MPG is around 18-19 mpg, but then so was my previous BMW with a 6-cylinder engine.) Is it a good on long journeys? Is it as reliable as Lexus would have us believe? Thanks, in anticipation.

I've been told by my dealer that my car will arrive on 16th November and be one of the first batch to arrive on these shores. Be sure that I will write a full report that details my first impressions. As I have owned several BMWs, a Mercedes-Benz and a few Audis, I will be sure to provide a thoughtful comparison to these cars - an owner/ driver's view not the "it's rubbish if not good on a racetrack" approach of most motoring hacks. According to Lexus UK, the Bluetooth system in the IS250 automatically detects a bluetooth phone. I think that effective use all depends on having a phone that is compatible with the on-board system. I imagine that most of the latest batch of Nokia, Motorola and Sony Ericsson phones will work.

I have no experiences of Lexuses until my new IS250 arrives. Can anyone tell me what their automatic gearboxes are like.

I called Lexus UK to ask them if the IS350 would come to the UK and they said that the response to it had been so positive that they had been forced to re-evaluate their plans to sell it in Europe. They said it now looks like it will come, but probably not until late 2006/ early 2007. The demand for a manual gearbox has been amazing too. It wouldn't surprise me if Lexus developed one for the IS350. Whatever, I still want that IS500 with a V-8.

I had heard that Lexus was launching a restyled SC430 at Frankfurt. I know that it will have adaptive headlights, new SATNAV and other gizmos featured on newer cars, but haven't seen it yet. I doubt whether the changes will be substantial. IMHO, as nice as this car is in terms of engineering and build quality, it looks awful and, even with the suspension mods, it just ain't a driver's car. They cannot replace it soon enough. Roll on the LF-A.

I think you're mad to even think about buying a Jaguar X-Type. It's blatant rehash of a Ford Mondeo, that doesn't handle as well. Build quality is awful. Driving expereince is even worse. It feels cheap. There's no rear leg-room. But most important, it's a generation behind the IS. :mat: Compare the IS to a C-Class or a 3-Series, but purleeeasse not to a :tsktsk: Jag! It's blatant mis-use of the site!

Well said, Leeds Lad, I violent agree with all of your comments. I just don't want a blue propeller on my drive either. As a soon-to-be-former BMW driver - the exact customer Lexus wants - I would have ordered an automatic IS350 without hesitation had one been available. But I still want that IS500 with V8 very much.

"What I think people want to see is a 400bhp IS500 or similar - an M3 rival. Problem is though, this sort of car is getting too far away from what Lexus is about." Mole, Absolutely right that people want a 400 bhp IS500. Absolutely wrong that this sort of car is getting away from what Lexus is about. Handling and performance have become an important part of the equation in the luxury car category. BMW, Audi and Mercedes-Benz certainly recognise this truth and Lexus must too if it is to achieve its growth aspirations. If you don't give the customer what he wants, he goes elsewhere. Audis used to be just like Lexuses, but they realised where the market was going and adapted. The RS models have a halo effect that lends real flair and appeal to the rest of the range. While Lexus is clearly about effortless progression, almost like wafting along in a 1930s Rolls-Royce, the brand does seem to be extending its appeal by embracing dynamic purity and more sporty performance. Early US reports seem to indicate that the new IS is much more focused, much more precise and more able to hurled into corners without losing its composure. And it seems to provide improved handling without sacrificing refinement. There's even a sports version of the new IS. The question is to what extent can a luxury car also be a sports car? Jaguar markets itself as the luxury sports car, and fails miserably in my estimation, but Mercedes-Benz has moved away from being a luxury barge that wallows through bends into something that can really hustle through the corners when called to do so. What's truly great about both the lowly C-Class and the uber-S-Class is the way in which they combine a serene, cocooned environment with hard-edged performance. The secret is that they both have excellent suspensions. They prove that you can provide a decent turn of speed through the twisty bits without having a bone-jarring ride. Of course, neither car is as focused as a BMW M3, but they still provide thrills aplenty. I'm not sure I want Lexus to build an M5 or RS4. But I would like a V-8 in the IS with 400 bhp, so that, when I need to get from one side of Switzerland to the other without using motoways, I can do so effortlessly. And when I get to wherever I'm going I don't want to feel like I've been pummelled by the hardness of the suspension. ( I hope this post livens up the thread. I've got my flame suit on!)

Yes, it has become a bit boring. So come on Mole, give us the low down on high performance versions of the new IS. Any truth in the rumours that IS350 is coming to these shores after all, and sooner than expected? And what about the the IS460/ 500? You may not know the answer, but surely the need for such models must have been debated internally?

djanderso, We just hope they add the IS350 to this soon. I notice that your old IS200 was the best car you ever owned, does this mean you'll be buying the new one?

The IS350 has been spotted in France where it is being featured in a new TV commercial. The car apparently had a European spec, i.e. speedometer in kilometres. Given America's less than universal respect for the French following Jacques Chirac's failure to support it, Britain, Italy and other allies in the fight against terrorism, I can't see a Lexus TV commercial being shot in Europe for the US market. So, perhaps the IS350 will be here sooner than we think. Hopefully, with the added option of a manual transmission. Add the further rumour of an IS460/ 500 lapping the Nuremburg Ring and Lexus desire to play catch-up with the Germans may be a reality sooner than we think. Let's hope so. :D

Mole, Please check your facts. Lexus actually had its best year for the IS in 2001 when it sold 10,823 cars. In 2004, it sold 7,092. My figures, from Automotive News Europe, reflect sales data for the whole of Europe. I assume yours do too, because there is no way that Lexus sold 6,000 IS models in the UK alone. I make this point not to beat you up - your inside view is much appreciated - but to make the important point that the current Lexus IS model was only ever a niche product. It never had a wide enough appeal to capture significant share from BMW, Audi and Honda, the leaders in Europe by quite a margin. With BMW selling almost 265,000 cars in 2004 of the old 3-Series in Europe, Lexus has a long way to go to catch up. So, it is absolutely appropriate that the new IS is a radical departure from the existing model. It offers so much more to make it a better car, that anyone who has owned a competitive brand can clealry see why they needed to charge more. I am disappointed but the new IS is more expensive than the outgoing model, but I still think it is very much worth the extra cost. I've done the sums, the new IS is still cheaper than an equivalent spec of Audi, BMW or Mercedes-Benz. Everything hinges on how well it drives. It only needs to out-handle the A4 and Lexus will have a winner on their hands. I am itching to drive the thing.

We should expect to see the new LS460/ 500 revealed very soon. My understanding is that it will follow the bold styling direction of the new IS as well as incorporating the latest technology, VDIM, direct injection enlarged V-8, and so on. I don't know whether we'll see it first at Frankfurt this year, although I can imagine that Lexus would like to upstage the Germans (specifically Mercedes-Benz and its new S-Class) on their home turf! My guess is that we'll see it either at Detroit in January or Geneva in March. If someone can tell me how to upload a JPEG, i will happily provde a rendering of the it.

I have to agree that the pricing of the new IS is much higher than expected. I don't think the brand yet has the kudos of the Germans so needs to be careful what it charges. Charging too much too soon could could dampen the loyalty of its exising user base before new buyers fully accept it as a true alternative to the likes of BMW and Audi. That said, I've seen this car in the flesh and at the time I thought it was a notch above the GS. And the GS is pretty special... :zee: :zee:

It seems as if Lexus is quite deliberately targeting a different kind of customer with the new IS. As a current BMW 3-Series owner migrating to Lexus, I believe Lexus is doing all the right things to attract people like me. In particular, the greatest appeal of the new car is its styling, which is so much more distinctive than Chris Bangle's efforts. (I’ve heard a rumour that gifted Italian stylist Leonardo Fioravanti is the designer behind Lexus’ new L-Finesse design language. It may be just a co-incidence that L and F are Leonardo Fioravanti’s initials.) Whatever, I thought the design of the E90 3-Series really was the last straw; BMW just didn’t listen to its customers. The volume seller for BMW is the 320 diesel with a manual transmission. The IS 220d will be extremely competitive with this model from launch. Add Lexus' reputation for build quality, reliability and dealer service and you have the ingredients of a true competitor. I have no doubt that more options that widen its appeal will be offered on the new IS as it grows in popularity. In fact, I'm pretty confident that a more focused high-performance model will also make an appearance too. As Top Gear magazine says, the IS will be the car that really does it for Lexus. You might ask why current 3-Series owners like me rejected the Lexus IS first time round. The answer is that instead of being distinctive in its own right, it seemed too much like a blatant rip-off of the 3-Series. Much of the interior detailing was too fussy and the ergonomics didn't appeal as much. There were also a variety of other features that polarised opinion, like the dashboard gauges. Some people loved them. I thought they were kitsch in the extreme lacking the subtlety of classic German design. Consequently, the old IS may have had too narrow an appeal; (it seems to be driven almost exclusively by pilots and IT personnel - which probably tells you something, although I don’t know what)! Because the new model is such a departure in so many areas, many existing IS owners seem to feel alienated by the new model. Maybe they'll come round to it when the market roundly applauds its quality and dynamics. Actually, I think the real loser with the new IS is not BMW, even though the new IS is bound to steal sales from the 3-Series. No, it is Audi that will lose out the most. I had initially considered an A4 instead of the 3-Series. But the face-lifted B8 version of the A4 released last year isn't much of an improvement in my book; it only corrects deficiencies that should never have existed in the first place. Moreover, Audi's are essentially built on a front-wheel drive chassis with dynamics compromised by poor weight distribution, ponderous nose-heavy under-steer and poor steering feel. The biggest problem is still Audi's traditional Achilles heel: electronics. As I think I've said elsewhere, the Germans are all going for volume. As they do so they do not appear to be able to maintain quality levels. In this category of car, you really do have to get the basics right: handling, build quality, reliability, comfort and so on. The Germans are increasingly failing to do this. So in one sense, people are considering Lexus for the first time, not only because it has improved product quality; but because the Germans have dropped the ball. For me the final nail in the coffin of German ownership is sales volume. There are just way too many BMW’s on the road. They have lost the cachet they once had. Lexus' ambitious targets are a drop in the ocean compared to the German brands’ sales figures. Smaller volumes don’t only mean greater exclusivity; they mean less chance of building it wrong.

Hello Mole, Thank you for your excellent post. I agree with everything you say. One of my reasons for deciding to purchase a Lexus was the treatment I received when I casually strolled into Lexus' Park Lane dealership in London. I walked in just before 6pm to get a brochure on the new IS. All the salesmen were busy but I only had to wait 20 seconds before a guy comes out of nowhere and starts asking if he can help. We actually have a conversation rather than my being treated as an ignorant punter. The guy couldn't have been less like a typical salesman. Anyway, I got the info I needed and he gives me his card. He was the dealer principal. When I left it was well after 6pm. Top marks for coming out of his office to serve a customer. If the head of the dealership is doing this, no wonder all the other guys are so good. So, I'm already a satisfied Lexus customer and I haven't even taken delivery even of my new IS250 yet. Mole, if you have any influence on model specs, then i would ask you to pass back three pieces of feedback: 1. Please make the 18" alloys STANDARD on the IS250 SE-L. 2. Please offer other colour options: you need a lighter, gunmetal grey, a dark green and mid-blue. 3. Please offer a high-performance version of the IS; either make the IS350 available in the UK with both manual and automatic transmissions or better still produce an IS460/ 500 with a V-8. You can have my deposit today. As a self-confessed car nut, it is quite apparent to me that the IS is totally over-engineered for the the class - just like Mercs used to be - long may Lexus models continue to be so. The IS is a mini-GS for people who want a more compact car around town. It packs so many goodies, it deserves to succeed for this reason alone. I, like others on the forum, have taken a punt and ordered the car without test-driving it. Am I mad with more money than sense? No. Everything I've heard about Lexus and articles I've read by certain key journalists whose opinions I trust convince me that this will be a sound financial decision and a great driving experience. :zee:

As someone new to this forum and to Lexus, I have decided to abandon more than 2 decades of purchasing German cars to buy a new IS250 S-EL. My last car was a BMW M3. I've also owned a variety of other BMW, Audi, Mercedes-Benz and Volkswagen models. I've seen a real decline in their quality and engineering integrity in recent years. As they struggle to achieve higher volumes, reliability seems no longer important. The latest 3-Series is a case in point. The primary brief to the design and engineering departments was simply take cost out of the car. To be honest, dynamically it is no better than the old E46 model. But it looks and feels really cheap inside. I can't say I'm a fan of Chris Bangle's styling efforts either. I will miss the power of the M3 and its marvellous dynamics. But what I won't miss is being stranded on an Italian Autostrada because the fuel guage has failed. Or three trips to the dealer to have major warranty issues sorted out. I saw the new IS at Geneva last March and thought it was the best looking car in the category bar none. It has a balance and harmony in its appearance that not even Audi can match. After owning such a full-on performance car, I am disappointed that the IS350 won't be coming to these shores. I hope that Lexus will see the error of their ways and ibring it on or otherwise produce the much rumoured IS460/ 500. Whatever, I have been simply stunned by the quality of engineering in Lexus' latest crop of models. While the SatNAv, sound system and so on, are all extremely impressive, its the quality of the dynamic bits beneath the skin, (which I've had a look at) which really impress. Lexus is definitely out to make the best cars. Period. Now that the styling and interior detailing are no longer vomit inducing, it's become a make of car that simply has to be taken seriously. Have read a lot of stuff about potential concerns with the new IS. I think this car will be sensational. The price is still highly competitive versus an equally well-loaded 3-Series or A-4. I shall be recording my impressions as soon as the car arrives in November. :yack: