Are you happy with your ES ?

[Linas.P]

8 minutes ago, beyond the blue said:

The only similarity l can see in those steering wheels is they are both circular, in my opinion.

At least we all agree they are circular, otherwise it may be a little awkward 😄 

[Cs150]

4 hours ago, Linas.P said:

My time is my business. 

As well there is no reason to get pi... about it - just recognise different opinion exists, this is not some sort of religious cult where only positive things can be said about the brand and all negative things are no allowed, regardless if they justified, objective or even subjective. This is public forum, people will have different opinions about things, even if unpopular. I am sure you want to have your cake and eat it too, but sadly when I hear ES mentioned and see people self-congratulating on the amazing decision they have made I want into that action too 😄

So you had your little party here congratulating each other and justifying - "why buy it" and I think it is ok for me to come and provide little bit of balancing to say what I think about the car after trying it (and it's it's identical twins), what I liked about it and what I didn't... and why in the end I decided I would not buy it (cannot say never, because for the right price any car could become appealing). I am sure that from 100 customers walking into Lexus dealership there is some proportion who decide - yes it is for me, and there is certain proportion who decide - no it isn't... I just represent that second group.

Lexus Avalon... sorry that is Toyota ES

It is for sure unusual for someone that does not own an ES to spend significant time researching the vehicle and then significant time posting how poor it is. Almost the sign of an unbalanced person you could argue. Maybe focus on researching and posting about superior vehicles... 

[Linas.P]

1 hour ago, Cs150 said:

It is for sure unusual for someone that does not own an ES to spend significant time researching the vehicle and then significant time posting how poor it is. Almost the sign of an unbalanced person you could argue. Maybe focus on researching and posting about superior vehicles... 

Ohhh Carl... we been over this "does now own, so should not comment" statement quite a few times already around here, it is ridiculous to suggest that somebody has to own something to have opinion on it. You don't need to own gold to know how gold looks like... If anything me not owning something makes my opinion less likely to be biased, whereas you owning ES makes you more biased. Bias is natural, nothing wrong with that - as long as we identify it and recognise it for what it is. I am generally interested in all things motoring, all things cars and as owner of 6 Lexus cars over the years I happen to be quite familiar with the brand. The only thing that is for sure unusual here is that you are worrying where somebody else spends their time and what they research - that is certainly not something you should be worried about...

As well - I am very far from focusing on ES, honestly one of my least favourite subjects... if you have a look I am sure you will find that from over 7000 comments I made the ES sub-forum has the lowest share.

To summarise - I have tried ES and I didn't like it (no surprise really considering what I value in cars), I have already mentioned what I didn't like and there is no point repeating it. That said those who been around this forum for longer time will know that there was extensive discussion about FWD and RWD and how FWD isn't an issue (or is it?!), yet what I found interesting and main reason why I decided to comment (which usually I don't do on ES topics) is that a lot of feedback was linked to wrong wheel drive, despite owners religiously claiming it is not an issue. Let's just recognise there are drawbacks in FWD and move on... 

[Cs150]

34 minutes ago, Linas.P said:

As well - I am very far from focusing on ES, honestly one of my least favourite subjects...

Ok fair point, bye bye then...

[Dippo]

I've owned a 5 series for 3 years (520D), an E Class for 3.5 years (E220D), and I'm now in an ES. I would say they are definitely competitors. If you move to the larger engined models then clearly the ES does not compete - but there is a significant price premium for those variants. The main advantage the German makes had over Lexus in the past was that you could personalise the cars a lot more from the option list; since the advent of the WLTP fuel economy reporting requirement, the Germans have also moved towards packs rather than individual option choice.

[Linas.P]

1 hour ago, Dippo said:

I've owned a 5 series for 3 years (520D), an E Class for 3.5 years (E220D), and I'm now in an ES.

Yes that is true actually... I guess my perspective is little bit flawed as if I would have gone for BWM/MB I would have never considered the entry level models and when it comes to 530/E300 the ES looks bad by comparison. I kind of said it compares quite well to lower end Audi A6 (both being FWD), but it is kind of true that there isn't much benefit in RWD in cars like 520/E220... that said E220 handles quite well, pulls strong and yet gets 55MPG with ease. I probably would still take E220 over ES300h, but at that level I see them being not far apart really. 

That said when looking at used cars, the price difference just isn't there despite BMW costing nearly £60k when new e.g. cheapest ES300 F-Sport vs. comparable BMW 530e:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202301243547399

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202212152548351

Sure - it could be argued that is for a reason... as 30k miles ES will be more or less as new... that said I doubt there would be much wrong with 24k miles BMW either. 

[Hadrian]

On 2/6/2023 at 1:32 PM, royoftherovers said:

Neither would i Ed.

As i previously said, the wrong choice of words  

[royoftherovers]

50 minutes ago, Hadrian said:

As i previously said, the wrong choice of words  

In which case Ed, I suppose I must reserve the right to disagree with your correect choice of words !🤣🤣