Sky+ Hd

[whiteman]

well as it say's I have picture problems with my Sky HD...

I have a 37 inch LG tv..... when veiwing HD channels the picture is as it should be but when you watch non HD channels the picture is slightly fuzzy... and sorta pixalating not crisp clear as it should be..... I have tried 3 HD leads and still the same, I can plug a scart lead in and veiw it that way and the picture is perfect but you don't need to do this if you have a HD conection an is a pain in the rear to keep switching from HD to scart....

I have a laptop with blu ray and the picture is perfect so my question is why is it now perfect with the sky+ box

1 sky have come out twice and replaced the box and still the same..

2 sky say it is the TV

3 sky say get a tv engineer out...BOLLOX!!! the tv works perfect with blu ray

I know there are some tech guys out there who know what they are talking about nott like the sky geezers who come out so come on guys solve my problem otherwise sky can have there HD box back...... oh I have a normal sky + box and the picture is perfect...

I am going to try the box on my mates tv to make sure it is not my tv but if it was the blu ray would be the same as I use the same HD port...

[Parthiban]

If the picture's fine via scart then how can they blame the TV? Was it fine before and now doing this, or have you just got it and it's been like this from day one?

[el_gencer]

Is your tv full hd ? Sometimes it helps to set the box to the same output as the tv's native resolution. For example if your tv is 720p set the box to 720p etc.

Also SD channels can be pap depending on which channel you are looking at. BBC1 has a decent amount of bandwidth allocated to it so it tends to look good.

Changing the HDMI cable wont do too much as the signal is 0's and 1's, so dont believe the hype that a £60 cable will give better results, the picture is either there or it isn't (unless it's shielded to prevent the breakup of the signal). Also how close are you sat to the tv ? SD pictures can and will look pixelated and this only gets worse the closer you sit. Most probably the issue is going to be with the box, who makes the box (pace, thompson, amstrad, samsung) ? Whilst the boxes are all supposed to be the same, they aren't. They'll have different ways of processing the image, unfortunately Sky are cheapskates and you can't pick and chose the box. Also if you call them to replace the box you'll get a refurbed one !!!! (thats partly why i cancelled, no end of issues with the box and Sky being useless).

Hope some of this helps.

[whiteman]

I have only had the box for about a month and it has done it from day one and the box has been replaced and still the same.

the dish is about 7metres awayfrom the box. and it is an amstrad...

[el_gencer]

do you know anyone with a different brand of box you could try on your tv ?

[whiteman]

do you know anyone with a different brand of box you could try on your tv ?

No don't know anyone with a HD box around here, they have only the sky+box

I may have to take it round there and try it on there tv and see what the quality is like.

and yes you are right about sky customer service it is rubbish...get your money and run so to speak

[kev dood]

firstly - expensive HDMI cables will make some difference on things like the PS3 running 1080p modes as the data rates are much higher than 720p/1080i. Branded HDMI 1.3 cables are best (similar to branded USB cables) they have been compliance tested to the spec - cheap ones unbranded with USB logo or HDMI logo won't have been.

Anyway - to the question. Sounds like a dodgy Sky box to me. Don't worry about TV mode, you don't say what TV you have but I presume its a 720p panel resolution (i.e. 1366x768) and not 1080 (1920x1080). The panel is a fixed res so will upscale anything that comes in that doesn match it.

Sky HD I think I am right in saying, is mainly (if not all) 1080i in which case the TV should show it ok. When on SD channels the will output standard 576i SD (same as normal Sky box) but via HDMI (which you say you use). If the box outputs the SD on the SCART ok (which should be set to RGB for best picture (component)) then probably the box.

But, try a different TV just incase. Could be a problem with the TV when in SD modes via HDMI input.

Sorry, just re read your post. If they have tried different boxes then points to you TV at fault. Call LG and see what they say - sounds like HDMI modes are not switching properly. Could be getting resolution wrong then upscaling it wrongly?

Blu-ray from a laptop - umm I though that the video output from a blu-ray laptop was downscaled to SD only due to copyright issues - you sure its in HD?

Also, Blu-ray is HD, so if you are checking HDMI path with that on the TV then won't help you too much.

May even be a compatibility issue with the Sky HD boxes and LG sets (it has been known before for other makes). Could be then due to LG support of HDMI - is it 1.3?

BTW - I work for Sony TV group designing LCD tv's so know a tad - though often make mistakes!! :)

I would say though that after watching HD for a bit, SD will look poor. Could it be that? Broadcast quality SD is not as good as DVD remember. Also try to check using say BBC1 during peak viewing (say 9pm) as bit rates will be higher. Especially during high profile programmes like Robin Hood or Hotel babylon which are filmed in HD.

[whiteman]

WOW!!! my head hurts!! :duh:

My bluray device is a sony Vaio.... so therefore it is defo HD (full 108O) your point of use to watching in HD then SD will look poor, well when I plug a normal sky+ box in the picture is perfect.... HD box is fuzzy and slightly picsalating (I'm tired so my spelling is not so good) I have a video sender to send to a normal tv and the picture is perfect via the HD box.. HD box via scart is also perfect..

I have not yet tried it on anoher HD tv but should be having a go soon to see if it is the TV..

[el_gencer]

to me it sounds like the box is just crap at handling SD via the hdmi, but unless they can provide another box of samsung/pace/thompson and all is well then i could well be talking cr*p (which is not unheard of). i can definitely say that my humax freesat hd box handles SD better than my SKY HD box ever did. have you tried the box round a mates house on a different tv to compare the hdmi output of SD. different tv's have different processors so give different results, it's worth checking. if it looks prefect on the other tv, then it could be your tv and how it interprets SD via hdmi.

@kev dod

you are correct about a hdmi 1.3 lead, the main difference being bandwidth increase to support extra features. however i have yet to notice any difference in pic and audio quality between say a certified £15 cable and a £100 certified cable.

[whiteman]

Been onto sky this evening and told them that the picture quality is garbage an dwant a bog standard sky+box and told I can't downgrade until an engineer has come out to see the problem....on ehas been out 3 times and still not fixed.....

anyway going to take it to my mates house and see on his hitachi tv

will let you know the outcome

not immpressed with sky saying it is my HD lead and then saying it could bethe TV....but why should a blueray play play perfect????

[Parthiban]

What is the panel resolution? Have you tried switching the output of the Sky box to see if it makes a difference? Sometimes different levels of upscaling matched to different screen resolutions can cause a problem.

[whiteman]

What is the panel resolution? Have you tried switching the output of the Sky box to see if it makes a difference? Sometimes different levels of upscaling matched to different screen resolutions can cause a problem.

Have switched the output on the skybox still the same.....

almost certain it is the box....got an engineer coming out with a new box but if it is the same I have told them I want a sky+ box only as I have had enough of watching poor quality pictures on the HD box when it is perfect via the scart....

The guy at sky last night to me to view it through the scart so it defeats the object of HD then.....I just laughed at him....

Is there any other boxes out there other than using sky's box??

[kev dood]

Yeah I agree, we have yet to see a certified cable of any low price be beaten by an expensive one! -- sorry, in orig post, meant to say "without the logo"!! :)

BTW - a Vaio will not generally output HD to an external video output port (unless its HDMI or possibly DVI) due to content protection. What video output are you using from the Vaio to the TV?

Blu-ray will generally look good as its all rendered in HD and is of a much higher bit rate. Its also not compressed "live" and for transmission, so they will optimise the encoder passes better than a single live stream would be.

There is no point paying for Sky HD then watching in from SCART as it will only be SD - Sky are useless. Tell them if they don't fix it then you are cancelling your whole sky subs.

Apart from the Sky HD box, you can either go for cable (Virgin) or buy a Humax DVB-S2 EuroHD satellite box which will decode the free-to-air HD channels on Sky (basically BBC HD!). Although Channel4 HD etc are effectively free to air, then are scrambled using sky's encryption so you cannot pick them up on a non sky (with sky card) box.

Its been a while since I have played with a Sky HD box, but a couple of things:-

1. What is the resolution of you HD Ready TV?

2. Can you set the HD output type of your Sky HD box to say 720p or 1080i? Set it to match your panel if you can. That will help. Mind you, that will not explain the poor SD quality.

My guess is, either the sky boxes you have been trying (are they all the same make) do not handle SD on HDMI correctly, or, you LG TV doesn't handle it properly in conjunction with the Sky HD box (this type of issue has been known before)!

It would be worth a call to LG to see what they say. They may have seen it before and have a software update you can do. At least you can say to Sky, "LG said they have no known issues so it must be your Sky box!"

Hope you get it fixed soon. BTW what it the model number of your LG TV?

[kev dood]

BTW - freesat bit rates are different to Sky SD ones, so expect the picture to look different. Similarly with normal Sky and Freeview.

Although Freesat is satellite transmission, its not done by Sky so equipment is different.

[kev dood]

just another thought, you say you have a Sky+ box. Whats the SD picture like through HDMI on that (although I am not sure if they even have an HDMI output - early ones didn't)?

[whiteman]

all these questions

my LG tv model is a 37LC2R....the resolution is???? not 100% sure, I have to find the disc it cam e with to look at the specs...wll have a look for it

I have altered the HD output but it is still the same

the other sky+ box does not have a HDMI output..

I should be taking my box to my mates and try it on his tv has his looks perfect

The sky guy is calling tomorrow afternoon

will answer the other questions asap

[el_gencer]

how long have you had the box ? if its less than 2wks just quote them the sale of goods act.

it'll be interesting to know how it is on you're mates tv.

from what i can tell on the internet, your tv is an asia only model (which is of no consequence as it's multi-standard) and is effectively a 720p panel (native res 1366*768). this is all assuming that i found the correct tv.

[kev dood]

Sorry for all the questions!!

Yep, looks to be as el qencer says, 720p panel. If you can, set the Sky HD box to 720p output too. Though wont make much of a difference. Certainly not to SD output.

Ditch the TV and get a newer 1080p model and enjoy full HD instead :-)

Hope you can get it sorted soon. If you take box anywhere, use your card as they are paired.

[whiteman]

well I have the sky engineer out and no joy.......he said as it is an LG tv then it won't get a good picture on SD due to the software it uses to convert it via the HD lead/socket...

HD is perfect....oh you say it is from Asia well that could be true as I bought it in Cyprus when I was living there and it came back in the car with me....tis a good TV

It looks like I will have to purchase a full HD tv next year possibly 42+ inch.

thanks guys for your help ...

Have not tried it on my mates tv as I don't think it will help as it won't work properly on mine..

:winky:

[Parthiban]

Interesting, it's always mentioned that the reason to go for the top end of TVs is the image processing they use, but I've never come across such a dramatic difference - any chance you could get a pic of how bad the pixellation is?

It's not that it's not full hd that causes the problem, it's just that it appears the TV doesn't know what to do with an SD image that comes through an HD input. I'm still not convinced personally as the HD boxes tend to upscale the image themselves. Therefore if you set the box to 720p, it should be doing most of the work and providing a 720p image to the TV meaning it shouldn't really have to do too much to the image except display it..........

[el_gencer]

good o'l cyprus is there nothing you can't buy over there from other markets.

asia has had hdtv for ages, so personally i'd have a thought a tv from that region would be ahead of the game. maybe a software update is required on the tv assuming there is one ?

[whiteman]

Interesting, it's always mentioned that the reason to go for the top end of TVs is the image processing they use, but I've never come across such a dramatic difference - any chance you could get a pic of how bad the pixellation is?

It's not that it's not full hd that causes the problem, it's just that it appears the TV doesn't know what to do with an SD image that comes through an HD input. I'm still not convinced personally as the HD boxes tend to upscale the image themselves. Therefore if you set the box to 720p, it should be doing most of the work and providing a 720p image to the TV meaning it shouldn't really have to do too much to the image except display it..........

I would try and get a pic of it but it is not that noticeable on camera and the picture is slightly fuzzy on SD but on HD it is near perfect

I altered the box to 720p and no difference on SD

[whiteman]

good o'l cyprus is there nothing you can't buy over there from other markets.

asia has had hdtv for ages, so personally i'd have a thought a tv from that region would be ahead of the game. maybe a software update is required on the tv assuming there is one ?

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I will try and find out if I can get a software update

tis annoying that the sky+HD box won't display SD channels through the HDMI socket

[kev dood]

Can you force the Sky HD box to output all content at 720p, even if its SD? If so, then the problem can't be with the TV as it will see a 720P signal which was upscaled by the Sky HD box.

However, if you can't, then would appear to be the TV. In which case I would get onto LG as they must know about this issue.

I would presume that the Sky HD box can output SD content via HDMI, its just for some reason it doesn't look good. If you have tried several boxes, chances are you have had at least 2 from different manufacturers in which case the MPEG decoder chips in them etc would have been different, so I would say its the LG TV.

If its a fairly old TV then could just be that LG never really thought they would see much SD on the HDMI input. Also, if from Asia, although they have had MPEG2 HD for years, its 60Hz so for them to do proper 50Hz decode is fairly new. They are not so good at supporting EU content and needs (trust me!).