Admitted Fault 220d?

[Matus]

I had consumption decrease till app 20kkm (12k miles)

I think it has to do mainly with possibility of using low revs. When my car was new, I just couldn't go below 1800rpm, now 1500rpm is OK.

[nate73]

Rang my supplying dealer last week (Lexus Bolton) to make them aware of the atrociously low mpg, to see if they could tender some advise...

"Ah yes, we're getting reports that they perform much better, in to the 40's, at and after approx 10k miles..."

Ok, so I'm supposed to subsidise the fuel consumption until then...I don't recall reading that anywhere in the sales brochure, that the 220d returns (or stands a chance of getting anywhere near returning) the manufacturer's claimed mpg after a running in period of ten thousand miles...!

10k for many (particularly) private motorists can be 12 months ownership.

I'm gonna call Lexus GB on Tuesday...

They're taking the p**s! If you are driving no more than 60mph, then yes low 40's is acheivable. Soon as you hit motorway speeds then it drops. I've had 5th injector, egr and new cat fitted. Still can't manage more than 36mpg. Mine has 22k on the clock.

I had a 220d base model (No heavy seats, smaller wheels etc) as a courtesy car, took it on a run (60mph constant) and got 42mpg. I've only ever seen 40mpg from mine on the computer twice in 2500 miles.

[FinLex]

I see this thread becoming the next "Are they really that bad" type of war zone. I hope I'm wrong.

My car returned about 46 MPG for the first 20000 kilometres (12k miles). Since then the fuel economy improved a bit, a typical tank avg was 48-49 MPG and by 25000 (15.5k miles) the overall mileage was up to 47.1. Since I got the 5th injector changed two weeks ago, the first tank returned 47.9 MPG and the second is showing tank avg of 48.7. So for me there was a (barely) noticeable improvement after 12k, but the 5th injector mod didn't really do anything, it seems.

[nate73]

I see this thread becoming the next "Are they really that bad" type of war zone. I hope I'm wrong.

My car returned about 46 MPG for the first 20000 kilometres (12k miles). Since then the fuel economy improved a bit, a typical tank avg was 48-49 MPG and by 25000 (15.5k miles) the overall mileage was up to 47.1. Since I got the 5th injector changed two weeks ago, the first tank returned 47.9 MPG and the second is showing tank avg of 48.7. So for me there was a (barely) noticeable improvement after 12k, but the 5th injector mod didn't really do anything, it seems.

Not a war zone yet! I think the sport model you have is more useable in day to day driving because of the different rear axle ratio, hence your better returns. I've had all the mods done and as I've just said on an earlier post, tried a base model which returned a maximum of 42mpg! (All extra urban) and thats with skinny tyres and no heavy electric seats etc. Interstingly, Lexus Liverpool service department insist 35mpg is normal (Still changed all the bits tho ) , I pointed out that the offical 6ft mpg poster next to his head disagreed as it showed a combined return of 44mpg!

Ho hum, no point in going on - still trying to swallow the £3k pill to get me into an A4. Not going down too well with the other half! So might be stuck with it a little while longer!

[dgman]

I see this thread becoming the next "Are they really that bad" type of war zone. I hope I'm wrong.

My car returned about 46 MPG for the first 20000 kilometres (12k miles). Since then the fuel economy improved a bit, a typical tank avg was 48-49 MPG and by 25000 (15.5k miles) the overall mileage was up to 47.1. Since I got the 5th injector changed two weeks ago, the first tank returned 47.9 MPG and the second is showing tank avg of 48.7. So for me there was a (barely) noticeable improvement after 12k, but the 5th injector mod didn't really do anything, it seems.

Not a war zone yet! I think the sport model you have is more useable in day to day driving because of the different rear axle ratio, hence your better returns. I've had all the mods done and as I've just said on an earlier post, tried a base model which returned a maximum of 42mpg! (All extra urban) and thats with skinny tyres and no heavy electric seats etc. Interstingly, Lexus Liverpool service department insist 35mpg is normal (Still changed all the bits tho ) , I pointed out that the offical 6ft mpg poster next to his head disagreed as it showed a combined return of 44mpg!

Ho hum, no point in going on - still trying to swallow the £3k pill to get me into an A4. Not going down too well with the other half! So might be stuck with it a little while longer!

you can buy a lot of diesel for 3k and nail it all day long and it will stil be cheaper than swapping.

[dgman]

I see this thread becoming the next "Are they really that bad" type of war zone. I hope I'm wrong.

My car returned about 46 MPG for the first 20000 kilometres (12k miles). Since then the fuel economy improved a bit, a typical tank avg was 48-49 MPG and by 25000 (15.5k miles) the overall mileage was up to 47.1. Since I got the 5th injector changed two weeks ago, the first tank returned 47.9 MPG and the second is showing tank avg of 48.7. So for me there was a (barely) noticeable improvement after 12k, but the 5th injector mod didn't really do anything, it seems.

Not a war zone yet! I think the sport model you have is more useable in day to day driving because of the different rear axle ratio, hence your better returns. I've had all the mods done and as I've just said on an earlier post, tried a base model which returned a maximum of 42mpg! (All extra urban) and thats with skinny tyres and no heavy electric seats etc. Interstingly, Lexus Liverpool service department insist 35mpg is normal (Still changed all the bits tho ) , I pointed out that the offical 6ft mpg poster next to his head disagreed as it showed a combined return of 44mpg!

Ho hum, no point in going on - still trying to swallow the £3k pill to get me into an A4. Not going down too well with the other half! So might be stuck with it a little while longer!

you can buy a lot of diesel for 3k and nail it all day long and it will stil be cheaper than swapping.

[nate73]

I see this thread becoming the next "Are they really that bad" type of war zone. I hope I'm wrong.

My car returned about 46 MPG for the first 20000 kilometres (12k miles). Since then the fuel economy improved a bit, a typical tank avg was 48-49 MPG and by 25000 (15.5k miles) the overall mileage was up to 47.1. Since I got the 5th injector changed two weeks ago, the first tank returned 47.9 MPG and the second is showing tank avg of 48.7. So for me there was a (barely) noticeable improvement after 12k, but the 5th injector mod didn't really do anything, it seems.

Not a war zone yet! I think the sport model you have is more useable in day to day driving because of the different rear axle ratio, hence your better returns. I've had all the mods done and as I've just said on an earlier post, tried a base model which returned a maximum of 42mpg! (All extra urban) and thats with skinny tyres and no heavy electric seats etc. Interstingly, Lexus Liverpool service department insist 35mpg is normal (Still changed all the bits tho ) , I pointed out that the offical 6ft mpg poster next to his head disagreed as it showed a combined return of 44mpg!

Ho hum, no point in going on - still trying to swallow the £3k pill to get me into an A4. Not going down too well with the other half! So might be stuck with it a little while longer!

you can buy a lot of diesel for 3k and nail it all day long and it will stil be cheaper than swapping.

Yeah, I know, that's my view with my sensible head on! But.... as with all things, when you're not happy you're not happy and things start to irk, to the point where they irrationally become bigger than they actually are. Mirror shake - dealer says no fix for auto dimm. Squeaks and cracks from dash. Odd gearing plus a 6th gear being there but not being able to use it until at licence losing speeds.

If I was just getting into the car, driving as I always have done and getting 40 ish mpg, then these things probably wouldn't annoy me half as much.

I dont want to be totally negative - v cold this morning so used the bum warmer for the first time - very nice.

See, I can do it - a nice balanced post good 'n' bad!

[Matus]

Not a war zone yet! I think the sport model you have is more useable in day to day driving because of the different rear axle ratio, hence your better returns.

I think this is true specially for GB.

Have you asked in service if it is possible to change it to sport version? Basically the difference is in the differential and perhaps the ecu software.

[philthy]

Without intending to get into the same old debate, I've driven mine "carefully" for a good few weeks now. Around town I can manage 34mpg but no better. This is acceptable when you compare it to the official figures. On a 20 odd mile motorway trip it didn't get any better even when using the 6th gear overdrive. I at least expected it to nudge 40mpg with constant speeds. I suppose when you take in to consideration that the car is heavy and still has a claimed 177BHP with 400nm of torque, performance isn't bad. It's just irksome when Lexus put out claimed mpg that some of us can't attain no matter how we drive the car.

I'm probably in the same boat in that I'm totally ****** at my dealership. Not only do they lie to me and on more than one occassion, but they blatantly try and rip me off and have succeeded. Only my follow up has identified this. This almost certainly taints my view of Lexus and any fault no matter how trivial is going to bug me. The fuel issue isn't really a big deal to me as I'm getting better returns than the previous car I owned and thus saving money. My old car would give me around 300 mile to the tank at 15 imp gals. In the IS220d I can manage 430 miles to the tank. It may be more expensive to fill but even my poor mathematics can work out that I'm spending less on fuel. It's just bitter that it doesn't do what it says in the brochure and the dealer treats you badly.

If I were shopping again, I still wouldn't consider a BMW 3 or 5 series as I refuse to pay a premium for a badge. (Besides they are sold by the same franchise as Lexus so I'd probably get shafted again!) I wouldn't touch a Merc as they're ugly and you pay a premium for the extras. Audi don't interest me simply because the dealership appeared to have absolutely no idea about their cars. A car manufacturer that can afford to have it's own satellite channel must be ripping customers off somewhere too. That would leave me with a choice of Volvo or Lexus. I wouldn't buy another car from my Lexus dealership as long as I could draw breath. I still think the Lexus is the best looking car in the catagory and offers the most value for money, but I think after my experiences I'll be going back to Volvo. I'll just have to stump up the extra to get some luxuries included.

[Matus]

Without intending to get into the same old debate, I've driven mine "carefully" for a good few weeks now. Around town I can manage 34mpg but no better. This is acceptable when you compare it to the official figures. On a 20 odd mile motorway trip it didn't get any better even when using the 6th gear overdrive. I at least expected it to nudge 40mpg with constant speeds. I suppose when you take in to consideration that the car is heavy and still has a claimed 177BHP with 400nm of torque, performance isn't bad. It's just irksome when Lexus put out claimed mpg that some of us can't attain no matter how we drive the car.

34mpg in the town is OK, but not OK extra urban. Depends also how you measure it. If you drive 200 miles in city and then 20miles outside, ofcourse 10 extra mpg won't show on average gauge.

When I am doing the measurements and I want to know how much the car consumpts in certain situation, I always reset the AVG. I trust to this measurement because TANK average is always very precise.

So try to measure it this way.

Now a different thing: I've noticed the same as Finlex - sometimes my car consumpts about a 1 litre more on same road and same conditions. It looks like the D-CAT system is not cleaning itself all the time but only on certain periods and never in the city. I read somewhere that the "dirting" of the d-cat system is highest during the city driving. (low flow of the exhaust gasses, not ideal burning when idling etc)

So because you drive a lot in urban and only occasionally extra urban - the system takes this time to clean itself.

These are just my thoughts. Avensis 2,2 D4D 180k has the same engine and when it is cleaning, a controll light on the dashboard lights up - the dealer told me that when it is on, you should be hard on the accelerator and the system cleans better. There is no such a light on IS but I remember when I last time drove 50kms by 180kph and week after I had very low consumption - however I did not repeat this procedure yet so I don't know if it wasn't only accidentally.

I know it won't help you, this is maybe just to clear up things.

[nate73]

If I were shopping again, I still wouldn't consider a BMW 3 or 5 series as I refuse to pay a premium for a badge. (Besides they are sold by the same franchise as Lexus so I'd probably get shafted again!) I wouldn't touch a Merc as they're ugly and you pay a premium for the extras. Audi don't interest me simply because the dealership appeared to have absolutely no idea about their cars. A car manufacturer that can afford to have it's own satellite channel must be ripping customers off somewhere too. That would leave me with a choice of Volvo or Lexus. I wouldn't buy another car from my Lexus dealership as long as I could draw breath. I still think the Lexus is the best looking car in the catagory and offers the most value for money, but I think after my experiences I'll be going back to Volvo. I'll just have to stump up the extra to get some luxuries included.

Know what you mean, I came from a S60 D5, lovely car just a bit dated - was looking at a newer one, but knew that the new shape S60 comes out later in the year. The missus has given me so much grief about changing now I'm going to wait until the warranty is about to expire (14 months). Even tho I'll have lost even more money by then

[SiWhite]

I've given up trying to drive my 220 carefully. Blatted up the MI / A1M to Newcastle the other day didn't use 6th at all (well, hardly at all) achieved 38mpg and had fun.

By the way, 38 is actually an improvement on the figures I normally get.

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

Matus - all this stuff about DCAT cleaning itself...where did you read that? The dealer has never ever explained this to me, and I hope it wasn't on the Toyota forum or other Lexus or car forum.

If the DCAT system gets dirty in town and needs a "blast" on the motorway to clean it, then anyone wanting to use this car mainly in town has a major poblem...the car will choke up.

I have been told that the recent fixes on my car mean that it will not "dirty" up again - and no conditions or limitations were stipulated. This is a permanent fix - but no one from Lexus has yet told me what you have mentioned.

I have a call out to my dealer - when they return the call I will ask.

[NT_Lexus]

I've given up trying to drive my 220 carefully. Blatted up the MI / A1M to Newcastle the other day didn't use 6th at all (well, hardly at all) achieved 38mpg and had fun.

By the way, 38 is actually an improvement on the figures I normally get.

Have just been speaking to my local Service Manager and his (initial) advice is to forget 6th (unless you're doing high 90's / a ton +), oh, and not to use supermarket petrol but to buy the quality stuff.

So, I'm gonna try not using 6th for a couple of weeks and see if it works for me...

[egnot]

Don't bother, get them to reflash the ECU back to default settings to clear out all the self learning stuff and you will be back to as it was when new. Just proved that with the Bristol Service Manager. Its quick and easy and then the car can re-learn your driving style. There is no point trying to be careful when it has all the previous driving styles in memory.

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

OK -

spoke to my dealer. Basically, the system will "clean" itself regularly as Matus has stated, but not when you thrash it, take it on the motorway etc. It is ECU controlled and will do it regularly and/or when necessary regardless of where you are. It should be un-noticeable to the driver and there was no suggestion that will hammer the fuel, though I supose the mapping will b changed to burn diffrently which could go either way!!!

As far as Supermarket fuel is concerned - Dealers are great at telling you what you want to hear most of the time, that's how they make business!

It states no where that you shouldn't use it and I have found over 2 years of drivig this car that it actually makes not a jots difference what you put in. I even tried that super fuel stuff. It made me feel better for 4 fillups and then realised I was not getting any more MPG at all...

Despite all sorts of Bloggs and their comments on the winding worldly web, there is no evidence that it is of inferior quality - just anecdote.

The handbook states that you can use 6th from 75mph, not 90 or a ton! They tell you that so you don't complain when your teeth fall out at 70 in 6th gear!

PS - I've also been told that getting 38-42 is regarded as the upper levels of normal, though one or 2 are getting mid 40's. I used to...but not anymore...the last time I saw mid 40's, the car had 10000 or so miles on the odometer (from memory). I've agreed with my dealer that I will contact them regularly as ther are patchs, mods and upgrades constantly being developed. It seems that the dealers too must be getting sick of this...I know I would be if I was in their position...

I have been told that there is nothing else lft that they could do to mine. I've got to bear with it...

PPS - as far as the memory learning stuff is concernd, I can't believe it. I only have on driing style. It' the same one I was born with...and mine has gradually got worse, even with ECU flashing.The current situation is:

Town only = 29-32mpg

Mixed = 35=37.5

Motorway only (i.e. fillup within 0.5miles of the motorway, no traffic, stick to speed limits, no traffic holdups, includes SPEC's at 50mph for a while, and >200 miles) = 40.5mpg...

[Matus]

I got a call today from lexus to come for the 5th injector change plus ECU remap.

I am booked for 11th April.

Tommorrow I go skiing for one week, 560kms, 4 people and roofbox... will see the consumption.

[dgman]

I got a call today from lexus to come for the 5th injector change plus ECU remap.

I am booked for 11th April.

Tommorrow I go skiing for one week, 560kms, 4 people and roofbox... will see the consumption.

i enjoy skiing myself, where are you going and don't break a leg.

[Matus]

I got a call today from lexus to come for the 5th injector change plus ECU remap.

I am booked for 11th April.

Tommorrow I go skiing for one week, 560kms, 4 people and roofbox... will see the consumption.

i enjoy skiing myself, where are you going and don't break a leg.

thanks :)

I am in Hintertux, Austria.

Driving average according to BC was 124kph (77,5mph) - except app.60kms was everything on the highway, where I went most of the time 145kph on cruise controll (90mph) - 135kph (84mph) according to gps

Most of the time strong head wind :(

Average consumption according to BC was 7,8 (36mpg) - I did similar trip last year and had similar BC result, but according the real calculation the consumption was 7,5 (37,6mpg) - I will se when I fill the tank.

I am satisfied, it is reasonable number.

And the way back should be even better, it is a down hill a bit. (and hopefully no headwind)

[trevC]

I traded in my trusty IS200 Sport this weekend and collected a '56 plate IS220d SE-L MM (19.5k miles). Having read some articles on this forum about consumption and other problems I started to wonder about the decision I'd made!

Anyway, the car makes up for any shortcomings it has (so far!).

Only driven 100+ miles so far, got 32mpg average in very heavy town traffic on Saturday PM and then on a better run today got an average of 41mpg (mainly A roads and dual carriageway with some cruise control). I was driving with economy in mind, but at the same time wasn't driving like a coffin dodger.

From what I've read, I guess I shouldn't expect much more?

Question: To get the best, am I right in thinking its best to get up to speed as quickly as possible with gear changes around the 2000-2500 range? Oh, and forget 6th gear it seems!

Oh, I checked and the car has not had the 5th injector done but did have an ECU update at the last service.

[dgman]

I traded in my trusty IS200 Sport this weekend and collected a '56 plate IS220d SE-L MM (19.5k miles). Having read some articles on this forum about consumption and other problems I started to wonder about the decision I'd made!

Anyway, the car makes up for any shortcomings it has (so far!).

Only driven 100+ miles so far, got 32mpg average in very heavy town traffic on Saturday PM and then on a better run today got an average of 41mpg (mainly A roads and dual carriageway with some cruise control). I was driving with economy in mind, but at the same time wasn't driving like a coffin dodger.

From what I've read, I guess I shouldn't expect much more?

Question: To get the best, am I right in thinking its best to get up to speed as quickly as possible with gear changes around the 2000-2500 range? Oh, and forget 6th gear it seems!

Oh, I checked and the car has not had the 5th injector done but did have an ECU update at the last service.

change up by 2000rpm ,6th gear at 70 on motorway and buy some dps4 to add to the fuel don't bother with v power diesel, my combined avg is 40.

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

I traded in my trusty IS200 Sport this weekend and collected a '56 plate IS220d SE-L MM (19.5k miles). Having read some articles on this forum about consumption and other problems I started to wonder about the decision I'd made!

Anyway, the car makes up for any shortcomings it has (so far!).

Only driven 100+ miles so far, got 32mpg average in very heavy town traffic on Saturday PM and then on a better run today got an average of 41mpg (mainly A roads and dual carriageway with some cruise control). I was driving with economy in mind, but at the same time wasn't driving like a coffin dodger.

From what I've read, I guess I shouldn't expect much more?

Question: To get the best, am I right in thinking its best to get up to speed as quickly as possible with gear changes around the 2000-2500 range? Oh, and forget 6th gear it seems!

Oh, I checked and the car has not had the 5th injector done but did have an ECU update at the last service.

Welcome to this side...

Coming over from an IS200, you'll see some improvement in MPG. Normally, I too would recommend that you do get to the desired speed quickly and efficiently. This applies to the 220d as well, but due to the flat spot till 1600 RPM, you end up having to rev and slowly burn release the clutch to get going quickly and/or you end up taking it to 3000RPM before changing as 1800-3000 can come up very quickly...

Neither of these will necessarily help with economy...

The car doesn't like to be rushed, so my advice is forget all of that and just drive sensibly you really won't see much difference what you do, and with you coming from an IS200's MPG it'll feel like it's running on vapour anyway!

[dgman]

the dps4 will improve the low down flat spot.

[nate73]

the dps4 will improve the low down flat spot.

I agree, have switched to standard diesel and DPS4. Just had a return of 40.5mpg on my last tank. I would estimate an increase of 2-3mpg with DPS4 over the v-power I was using. I was getting 38ish mpg overall post egr and cat change. Hopefully this will be the norm from now on. Driving at 78 in 6th on cruise.

Now just have to get the rattles and shakes sorted!

[dgman]

the dps4 will improve the low down flat spot.

I agree, have switched to standard diesel and DPS4. Just had a return of 40.5mpg on my last tank. I would estimate an increase of 2-3mpg with DPS4 over the v-power I was using. I was getting 38ish mpg overall post egr and cat change. Hopefully this will be the norm from now on. Driving at 78 in 6th on cruise.

Now just have to get the rattles and shakes sorted!

have you purchased in 5ltr bottle and have you noticed smoother running.