Do Not Sell My Personal Information Jump to content


Recommended Posts

Sorry to start a new topic on an old one ,so to speak but the relevant threads are in the IS 200 part of the site.

As some of you will know I have had a bee in my bonnet about my sat/nav since I got it. I bought the car in May last year ( ten months ago). In Ireland it is a disaster, almost no coverage in some areas and no traffic avoidance at all ( and this is in the Dublin area, who knows what it is like in the sticks). Its like buying a computer that you are told has windows xp and when you turn it on find it working on windows 3.1. (It works, kind of).

I have been mentioning this problem in conversations with people from Lexus and Kinsella Lexus who are the people from whom I bought the car and must say I have had little positive feedback.

So decided to take the bull by the horns yesterday when I put the car in for a service and asked straight up if they would replace the disc while they had her in for the day and they said no, they would put in the update and charge me €250, did I want it? what do you think. So I have decided to get a bit bolshie about this as to my mind the thing does not do what it says on the tin and if I had known it was going to be so crappy I would not have bought the MM as this was the main reason for getting it. Also the DVD does not work for the passengers when you are moving so thats at bit of a joke as well. If I can sit in a warm house and watch them I am hardly going to sit in a cold car to do it, so that's another bit of slightly skewed advertising.

So I have written a nice letter to the MD of Kinsella Lexus asking them to replace the disc under warranty, as someone else said they don't seem to have any problem spending money on horse racing days and golf days etc so what about spending some on customer satisfaction. Nicnac got his replaced through his dealer so it looks like I,ll have to ask him who he bought the car from for the next time ( if there is a next time).

If they don't respond positively I have decided to take this as far as I have to. €5400 plus interest on the loan is a lot of money.

For posterity's sake 15000 km service - done. Replace leaking Battery under warranty- done. Repair paint that is coming off between the boot and bumper under warranty -to be done. Repair rattle in left front of car- to be done, ( they want her for a couple of days) total cost €266 inc vat.

Rant over.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


In Ireland it is a disaster, almost no coverage in some areas and no traffic avoidance at all

I once had a long argument with Tom Tom based upon their advertised claims for coverage and in the end they admitted that their advertising was misleading. They offered compensation, but it didn't change the product and didn't solve my problem (lack of coverage in an area I was planning to visit).

decided to take the bull by the horns yesterday when I put the car in for a service and asked straight up if they would replace the disc . . . . . . . . to my mind the thing does not do what it says on the tin and if I had known it was going to be so crappy I would not have bought the MM as this was the main reason for getting it.

I think you need to be clear what you are asking for. If you limit your claim to a replacement disc and the new disc still does not provide the coverage that you seek, what will you have achieved? If your beef is genuinely about coverage and you have evidence that you were misled about it then stick to your guns and ask for coverage or your money back. They might at least offer compensation .

Also the DVD does not work for the passengers when you are moving

Are you referring to the screen on the front console? If so, it is against the law (in the UK and several other countries in which I have driven) to have a TV type display that is visible to the driver when in motion, so you cannot blame Lexus for that. If you have passenger screens in the rear, then they ought to work while the car is in motion and you should press to have them fixed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Barry - feel it for you. Speak to someone at LGB - that's your best bet. If the Satnav has less then 70% of data then it's a pain, as one in 3 routes won't work, that is far too many! Sounds if it's worse than that...

If there is a better version of the disc, then surely they've got to see sense in helping?

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Sorry to start a new topic on an old one ,so to speak but the relevant threads are in the IS 200 part of the site.

As some of you will know I have had a bee in my bonnet about my sat/nav since I got it. I bought the car in May last year ( ten months ago). In Ireland it is a disaster, almost no coverage in some areas and no traffic avoidance at all ( and this is in the Dublin area, who knows what it is like in the sticks). Its like buying a computer that you are told has windows xp and when you turn it on find it working on windows 3.1. (It works, kind of).

I have been mentioning this problem in conversations with people from Lexus and Kinsella Lexus who are the people from whom I bought the car and must say I have had little positive feedback.

So decided to take the bull by the horns yesterday when I put the car in for a service and asked straight up if they would replace the disc while they had her in for the day and they said no, they would put in the update and charge me €250, did I want it? what do you think. So I have decided to get a bit bolshie about this as to my mind the thing does not do what it says on the tin and if I had known it was going to be so crappy I would not have bought the MM as this was the main reason for getting it. Also the DVD does not work for the passengers when you are moving so thats at bit of a joke as well. If I can sit in a warm house and watch them I am hardly going to sit in a cold car to do it, so that's another bit of slightly skewed advertising.

So I have written a nice letter to the MD of Kinsella Lexus asking them to replace the disc under warranty, as someone else said they don't seem to have any problem spending money on horse racing days and golf days etc so what about spending some on customer satisfaction. Nicnac got his replaced through his dealer so it looks like I,ll have to ask him who he bought the car from for the next time ( if there is a next time).

If they don't respond positively I have decided to take this as far as I have to. €5400 plus interest on the loan is a lot of money.

For posterity's sake 15000 km service - done. Replace leaking battery under warranty- done. Repair paint that is coming off between the boot and bumper under warranty -to be done. Repair rattle in left front of car- to be done, ( they want her for a couple of days) total cost €266 inc vat.

Rant over.

Barry,

I think i have a similar problem, grit getting into the gap, and as you close or open the boot the gap is so small its scratching the paint off boot lid edge and bumper top. Going to have it looked at during the first service.

Infinity.....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Barry,

What version of the DVD sat nav disc do you have? (Instructions to find this are in your SATNAV manual).

Also what version are you hoping to update to? This is one thing that pisses me off about the official LEXUS site. It should have this information on there and ideally you should be able to download and burn your own DVD of the latest version. After all, this is the 21st Century!

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Sorry to start a new topic on an old one ,so to speak but the relevant threads are in the IS 200 part of the site.

As some of you will know I have had a bee in my bonnet about my sat/nav since I got it. I bought the car in May last year ( ten months ago). In Ireland it is a disaster, almost no coverage in some areas and no traffic avoidance at all ( and this is in the Dublin area, who knows what it is like in the sticks). Its like buying a computer that you are told has windows xp and when you turn it on find it working on windows 3.1. (It works, kind of).

I have been mentioning this problem in conversations with people from Lexus and Kinsella Lexus who are the people from whom I bought the car and must say I have had little positive feedback.

So decided to take the bull by the horns yesterday when I put the car in for a service and asked straight up if they would replace the disc while they had her in for the day and they said no, they would put in the update and charge me €250, did I want it? what do you think. So I have decided to get a bit bolshie about this as to my mind the thing does not do what it says on the tin and if I had known it was going to be so crappy I would not have bought the MM as this was the main reason for getting it. Also the DVD does not work for the passengers when you are moving so thats at bit of a joke as well. If I can sit in a warm house and watch them I am hardly going to sit in a cold car to do it, so that's another bit of slightly skewed advertising.

So I have written a nice letter to the MD of Kinsella Lexus asking them to replace the disc under warranty, as someone else said they don't seem to have any problem spending money on horse racing days and golf days etc so what about spending some on customer satisfaction. Nicnac got his replaced through his dealer so it looks like I,ll have to ask him who he bought the car from for the next time ( if there is a next time).

If they don't respond positively I have decided to take this as far as I have to. €5400 plus interest on the loan is a lot of money.

For posterity's sake 15000 km service - done. Replace leaking battery under warranty- done. Repair paint that is coming off between the boot and bumper under warranty -to be done. Repair rattle in left front of car- to be done, ( they want her for a couple of days) total cost €266 inc vat.

Rant over.

I believe an up to date Irish DVD does exsist - sure I have seen the details on the forum somewhere, up north all but the most minor roads seem to show up on the map - having said that cross the border into Louth and the new road building schemes have outwitted the system - not unreasonably as you would have to go some to keep up with the by-passes that are springing up all over the East of the country (*** Bless the EU)

Eddie

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Barry,

What version of the DVD sat nav disc do you have? (Instructions to find this are in your SATNAV manual).

Also what version are you hoping to update to? This is one thing that pisses me off about the official LEXUS site. It should have this information on there and ideally you should be able to download and burn your own DVD of the latest version. After all, this is the 21st Century!

Gentlemen,

Firstly may I appologise if any of the following does not come out as I know very little about computers and I had to enlist my daughter to help me.

Firstly I have ( according to the proprietor of Kinsella Lexus in Dublin) "The latest mapping software available to the motor trade" :D in May 2006. There is a new version out and thats the one I think I should be entitled to. Anyway I received a reply from him today telling me that.....

"I can understand your frustration with what you see has been a negative response to your request for a free software upgrade and as this issue has only come to light with myself and PS ( the rep that flogged me the "state of the art" system) now I will endeavour to answer your criticisms of the Multimedia System you purchased as an optional extra on your car

When you collected your car last May it was installed with the latest mapping software available to the motor trade. Lexus like all car retailers in Ireland had to wait until late 2006 for the upgraded mapping software to become available which had improved coverage for Ireland. Up to late 2006 your car had the latest software available.

The RDS-TMC set up is not and never has been available in Ireland this isn't a Lexus issue. The system in your car is built for use across Europe where this function is in operation.

Upgraded software is available to purchase at a cost of €250 including VAT and installation. Please note that installation can be done while you wait and will take approx thirty minutes. This can be organised etc

Unfortunately we cannot offer you a free software upgrade, but I do hope this letter explains our position in relation to the issue."

To give you some idea of what we are talking about I went for a drive today to a place called Edenderry a town about 40 miles from Dublin. On this trip I used motorways and regional roads. I stopped here and there to take photos of what the SAT/NAV was showing and then followed with photos of what I could see through the windscreen. You can be certain that this is a normal occurrance in hundreds of places all over Southern Ireland on this SAT/NAV.

These are probably huge because I cant work out how to reduce them, sorry about that. They are just a couple of many I took.

What do you think of the nice letter I got.

I TOOK THE PHOTOS OUT AS THEY ARE TOO BIG/ CAN ANYONE ADVISE HOW TO REDUCE THEM?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sorry I can't read it. I think those enormous pictures you have put in have stretched the forum frame so that it impossible to see your message without scrolling backwards and forwards

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pictures aren't important bArry - this is a specific problem and it's the principle of the thing which I'm sure is getting your goat.

I agree it's a shame - a system is sold to you as an optional extra, and yet again dealers (on purpose or otherwise) do not mention anything about the limitations of the product. You end up finding out yourself after you've chucked in a bucket load of cash. Lack of product knowledge, toghether with "target driven" sales tactics, make every sale and purchase a nightmare.

I think the trade descriptions act should be clearer on this - if you're sold something, it should perform that function. The comment about it workking alsewhere in Europe is shameful - had they told you this in the first place, you would have probably not bought the system, or you would have got it in writing (as part of the deal) that you would get the next release FOC. There is an argument here about whether the system can perform the function it was sold to you for - try Citizens Advice Bureau!

It's like this everywhere mate! Sales are all about making as much money as poss, selling you the pro's, and washing over the con's.

It may be cheaper to go to an independant garage for the disc - some after market installers can get these discs cheaper through the trade and pass on much of that discount to you.

As far as "downloading" is concerned, they would never do it. Not at the moment - premium brand manufactureres forget that we all have finite amounts of cash, and whilst E250 ain't a lot compared to the price of the car, it still ain't cheap! It should be like OS on computers - you buy a licence for the product and they give you free updates to versions within the realms of the functionality.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pictures aren't important bArry - this is a specific problem and it's the principle of the thing which I'm sure is getting your goat.

I agree it's a shame - a system is sold to you as an optional extra, and yet again dealers (on purpose or otherwise) do not mention anything about the limitations of the product. You end up finding out yourself after you've chucked in a bucket load of cash. Lack of product knowledge, toghether with "target driven" sales tactics, make every sale and purchase a nightmare.

I think the trade descriptions act should be clearer on this - if you're sold something, it should perform that function. The comment about it workking alsewhere in Europe is shameful - had they told you this in the first place, you would have probably not bought the system, or you would have got it in writing (as part of the deal) that you would get the next release FOC. There is an argument here about whether the system can perform the function it was sold to you for - try Citizens Advice Bureau!

It's like this everywhere mate! Sales are all about making as much money as poss, selling you the pro's, and washing over the con's.

It may be cheaper to go to an independant garage for the disc - some after market installers can get these discs cheaper through the trade and pass on much of that discount to you.

As far as "downloading" is concerned, they would never do it. Not at the moment - premium brand manufactureres forget that we all have finite amounts of cash, and whilst E250 ain't a lot compared to the price of the car, it still ain't cheap! It should be like OS on computers - you buy a licence for the product and they give you free updates to versions within the realms of the functionality.

Thanks for taking out the pictures. I am in the UK and know nothing about the law in Ireland. If I had been sold a sat/nav system which had severly limited functionality in the location at which I bought it, I believe UK law would entitle me to return it for a refund or have it brought to a functional condition at the expense of the supplier. My basis for this belief is that UK law entitles me to expect that goods that I buy will be "fit for their intended purpose".

The only let out for the retailer as far as I can see would be if he specifically indicated to you at the time of purchase that the device did not include maps for Ireland or that the Irish maps included were not comprehensive.

Was the system demonstrated to you? Did that demonstration show the inherent map limitations that existed at the time? If it did and you accepted it having seen that demonstration, then your position is greatly weakened.

If the retailer had given no warning of limited functionality and refused to refund or take action to bring the system up to a proper functional state, my next UK recourse would be to the local Trading Standards Office. I would also want to bring Lexus corporate into the picture, though my contract is with the retailer, because they are in a position to support and influence the retailer.

I would not seek to purchase additional software elsewhere since that could be seen as a tacit admission that I had accepted the limited functionality of the device as sold.

If you have an equivalent of our local Trading Standards Office, I would pay them a visit and seek their advice.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Barry - a separate answer to your question about sizing images.

You need to tell us what program you are using to manipulate images. There will probably be someone here who knows that program and can advise.

Generally, when you open a picture in an image manipulation program there will be a menu item (perhaps with the heading "image") which will open a sub-men including an item with a heading something like "image size".

The sub menu will let you specify the image dimensions that you want. About 600 pixels for the longer side will give a reasonable display on most screens, then save the a COPY of the image as a jpeg file. DO NOT re-save the original image in the new size or you may not be able to recover the picture in its original detail.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pictures aren't important bArry - this is a specific problem and it's the principle of the thing which I'm sure is getting your goat.

I agree it's a shame - a system is sold to you as an optional extra, and yet again dealers (on purpose or otherwise) do not mention anything about the limitations of the product. You end up finding out yourself after you've chucked in a bucket load of cash. Lack of product knowledge, toghether with "target driven" sales tactics, make every sale and purchase a nightmare.

I think the trade descriptions act should be clearer on this - if you're sold something, it should perform that function. The comment about it workking alsewhere in Europe is shameful - had they told you this in the first place, you would have probably not bought the system, or you would have got it in writing (as part of the deal) that you would get the next release FOC. There is an argument here about whether the system can perform the function it was sold to you for - try Citizens Advice Bureau!

It's like this everywhere mate! Sales are all about making as much money as poss, selling you the pro's, and washing over the con's.

It may be cheaper to go to an independant garage for the disc - some after market installers can get these discs cheaper through the trade and pass on much of that discount to you.

As far as "downloading" is concerned, they would never do it. Not at the moment - premium brand manufactureres forget that we all have finite amounts of cash, and whilst E250 ain't a lot compared to the price of the car, it still ain't cheap! It should be like OS on computers - you buy a licence for the product and they give you free updates to versions within the realms of the functionality.

Thanks for taking out the pictures. I am in the UK and know nothing about the law in Ireland. If I had been sold a sat/nav system which had severly limited functionality in the location at which I bought it, I believe UK law would entitle me to return it for a refund or have it brought to a functional condition at the expense of the supplier. My basis for this belief is that UK law entitles me to expect that goods that I buy will be "fit for their intended purpose".

The only let out for the retailer as far as I can see would be if he specifically indicated to you at the time of purchase that the device did not include maps for Ireland or that the Irish maps included were not comprehensive.

Was the system demonstrated to you? Did that demonstration show the inherent map limitations that existed at the time? If it did and you accepted it having seen that demonstration, then your position is greatly weakened.

If the retailer had given no warning of limited functionality and refused to refund or take action to bring the system up to a proper functional state, my next UK recourse would be to the local Trading Standards Office. I would also want to bring Lexus corporate into the picture, though my contract is with the retailer, because they are in a position to support and influence the retailer.

I would not seek to purchase additional software elsewhere since that could be seen as a tacit admission that I had accepted the limited functionality of the device as sold.

If you have an equivalent of our local Trading Standards Office, I would pay them a visit and seek their advice.

Gentlemen

Thank you for your time and advice.

We have a consumer goods council here which gives guidance under the consumer goods act . I have spoken to them today and like yourselves they see no merit in the garages argument and suggest that I take legal action against them to have things put right. It is going to be interesting what the judge says about the RDS/TMC set up as you can be sure that neither I nor anyone else was informed of the limitations of this system when we bought it. The sat/nav can be put right with a new disc but are they going to put a satelite in space for when I want to avoid traffic :winky:

I think basically this garage have got the Merc bug and think that one customer here or there doesn't matter, what he seems to be saying is if you bought a car from us with MM in May we'll give you a crappy sat/nav and if you bought it from us in December for the same money we'll give you a good sat/nav but we wont give you RDS/TMC anyway because it only exists on page 93 of the Navigation system handbook. Stupid innit :lol:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

post-12519-1175766676.jpgpost-12519-1175766665.jpgpost-12519-1175766649.jpgpost-12519-1175766634.jpgpost-12519-1175766620.jpgpost-12519-1175766606.jpg

Pictures aren't important bArry - this is a specific problem and it's the principle of the thing which I'm sure is getting your goat.

I agree it's a shame - a system is sold to you as an optional extra, and yet again dealers (on purpose or otherwise) do not mention anything about the limitations of the product. You end up finding out yourself after you've chucked in a bucket load of cash. Lack of product knowledge, toghether with "target driven" sales tactics, make every sale and purchase a nightmare.

I think the trade descriptions act should be clearer on this - if you're sold something, it should perform that function. The comment about it workking alsewhere in Europe is shameful - had they told you this in the first place, you would have probably not bought the system, or you would have got it in writing (as part of the deal) that you would get the next release FOC. There is an argument here about whether the system can perform the function it was sold to you for - try Citizens Advice Bureau!

It's like this everywhere mate! Sales are all about making as much money as poss, selling you the pro's, and washing over the con's.

It may be cheaper to go to an independant garage for the disc - some after market installers can get these discs cheaper through the trade and pass on much of that discount to you.

As far as "downloading" is concerned, they would never do it. Not at the moment - premium brand manufactureres forget that we all have finite amounts of cash, and whilst E250 ain't a lot compared to the price of the car, it still ain't cheap! It should be like OS on computers - you buy a licence for the product and they give you free updates to versions within the realms of the functionality.

Thanks for taking out the pictures. I am in the UK and know nothing about the law in Ireland. If I had been sold a sat/nav system which had severly limited functionality in the location at which I bought it, I believe UK law would entitle me to return it for a refund or have it brought to a functional condition at the expense of the supplier. My basis for this belief is that UK law entitles me to expect that goods that I buy will be "fit for their intended purpose".

The only let out for the retailer as far as I can see would be if he specifically indicated to you at the time of purchase that the device did not include maps for Ireland or that the Irish maps included were not comprehensive.

Was the system demonstrated to you? Did that demonstration show the inherent map limitations that existed at the time? If it did and you accepted it having seen that demonstration, then your position is greatly weakened.

If the retailer had given no warning of limited functionality and refused to refund or take action to bring the system up to a proper functional state, my next UK recourse would be to the local Trading Standards Office. I would also want to bring Lexus corporate into the picture, though my contract is with the retailer, because they are in a position to support and influence the retailer.

I would not seek to purchase additional software elsewhere since that could be seen as a tacit admission that I had accepted the limited functionality of the device as sold.

If you have an equivalent of our local Trading Standards Office, I would pay them a visit and seek their advice.

Gentlemen

Thank you for your time and advice.

We have a consumer goods council here which gives guidance under the consumer goods act . I have spoken to them today and like yourselves they see no merit in the garages argument and suggest that I take legal action against them to have things put right. It is going to be interesting what the judge says about the RDS/TMC set up as you can be sure that neither I nor anyone else was informed of the limitations of this system when we bought it. The sat/nav can be put right with a new disc but are they going to put a satelite in space for when I want to avoid traffic :winky:

I think basically this garage have got the Merc bug and think that one customer here or there doesn't matter, what he seems to be saying is if you bought a car from us with MM in May we'll give you a crappy sat/nav and if you bought it from us in December for the same money we'll give you a good sat/nav but we wont give you RDS/TMC anyway because it only exists on page 93 of the Navigation system handbook. Stupid innit :lol:

photos eventually

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...




Forums


News


Membership