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Grrrrrrr (car Salesmen)


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Why? Why do they think that by telling blatent lies they'll make the sale? I don't mean lies about things you're not likely to find out about for 3 months by which time it's too late; I mean things like the mileage?

Back story: Dad blew his Scooby engine up on Tuesday, he likes my Lexus a lot & decided to buy something similar. The price is good too.... I have a Mk2 with 185k on the clock, and it drives like an equivalent 60k mile Ford or Vauxhall. Only better.

So, when the dealer says the mileage (which wasn't on the ad) was 200k & backed by a FSH (mostly Lexus), I was quite happy to drive the 70 miles to go see it. Because LS400s are that good. And this was a Mk3, so in theory better than mine....

Well. The mileage was actually 235k (quite a lot over the 200k he quoted me). The "F"SH ended at 188k. The cam belt sticker said 133k (100k without a cambelt change?). Interior is wrecked - the leather is almost worn all the way through on seat & armrest/center storage. Brakes are wrecked. Bonnet latch jammed open, struts wouldn't hold. The boot was literally swimming with 3-4" of water, and it was mouldy. He claimed it had traction control (no TC button in evidence), power folding mirrors (nope), heated seats (all four were faulty), long mot (didn't look?) and tax (tax expired in October, car is SORN according to DVLA) The car needs £1000 of work just to make it worth £1000. He'd be better off breaking it for parts, frankly. And he has the nerve to be asking £1295 for it!

I'm annoyed enough to post here because he could easily have sold it to me for a reduced price if he'd been more honest & up front. I can't see anyone paying the £1295 sticker price unless they're barmy.

When I bought mine, I bought it sight unseen from eBay. I'm really beginning to appreciate just how lucky I was; I don't think I'll be doing that again!

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I'd be a bit p'd off too.

A few years back I was looking at buying a car from a dealer - trouble was the one I was looking at was at another branch a million miles away - the salesman told me it was top spec and 'like new' so I thought great, I had to give them a deposit of £500 to get the car brought to the local showroom to have a look at it ...... it turned up a few days later it was nothing like his description (was base model with dents & scratches all over it) so I simply told him he had lied to me & that I wanted my deposit cheque back so I could rip it up, only to be told that it had been banked as they were so sure I would be buying the car !!!!

Needless to say the air turned blue and I had a cheque from them in my hand the next day :whistling:

Trouble is most salesmen think that once they have got you there you are more likely to buy than turn around and say "on yer bike" ;)

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paid £600 for mine... in excellent condition minus some rotted brakes and calipers as it had been sitting on the blokes driveway for months. It has 93,000 miles on it.

There are good examples out there for pocket change... shop around some more and remember buying from a dealer adds NOTHING to the value of a car.

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We're going to see another one tomorrow... it's at an auction house, but they've already told us the reserve price & TBH unless it's a total ruin, it's worth buying at that price. I hope it's good, because it's 200 bl**dy miles away!

Still, an extra 400 miles in my LS will barely make it sweat :)

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As the saying goes "buyer beware"

it's not just the salesmen that are very economical with the truth, a regular contributor to this very forum was recently advertising a "beautiful" 96 LS400 for sale.

After agreeing a price subject to a satisfactory inspection of the car (there are no issues with this car other than a backlight on the radio out by the way), it was arranged for a particular day to carry out the inspection this was to involve me travelling a 340 mile round trip to view the car. however, prior to departure I paid a couple of quid for a HPI check, suprise! suprise! it turns out the car was a cat D write off in Jan 07 the advert "Ebay listing" even stated in bold letters "HPI clear".

when E/mailed and informed of my findings and the fact I was declining to view vendor replied "news to me" "oh well".

I will be viewing a LS400 this weekend, def HPI clear this time, a round trip of 290miles, the question now is, is it a good one or not?

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cat d write off?? I wouldn't panic about that.....is that just the insurance co. not wanting to pay out?...

Most old LS would be a write off anyway as they are only worth £1000 on average.

A little shunt would write it off as insurance only pays for 3/4 value of the motor, and the bumpers & lights would add up to more than that, never mind the labor, fitting 2 new doors would be over that too...do you see where im thinking...it probably wasnt that bad

What does cat d actually mean? i'd reckon cat A would be a bad smash beyond any type of repair, so cat D could just well be against the value....which in old cars is nowt...

If the accident was not his fault then the insurance should fix it back to pre-crash condition anyway, if it was 50-50 or his fault then he still has a right to get it repaired if he pushes them enough, but you have to tell them, they never want to pay out a penny do they?

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The Association of British Insurers classifies Categories of 'Write-Off' as:

Category A: Scrap only - this vehicle should have been crushed. It should never reappear on the road and there are no economically salvageable parts. It is of value only for scrap metal - e.g. a totally burnt-out vehicle.

Category B: The bodyshell should have been crushed. The vehicle should never reappear on the road, but it can be broken for spare parts plus any residual scrap metal.

Category C: Vehicle extensively damaged and insurer has decided not to repair. The vehicle should have an independent inspection before being allowed back onto the road.

Category D: Vehicle damaged and insurer has decided not to repair.

So category D is the least serious category of write-off. It is really just an economic decision; the insurer decides that giving you the value of the car will be cheaper than paying for the repair.

If the car has been properly repaired, then it is worth as much as a car that was not written off.

http://www.usedcarexpert.co.uk/reviews/Cat..._Write_Off_1139

Although I feel if there is any ever doubt just walk away...much better to find something you are truly happy with.

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Why? Why do they think that by telling blatent lies they'll make the sale? I don't mean lies about things you're not likely to find out about for 3 months by which time it's too late; I mean things like the mileage?

Back story: Dad blew his Scooby engine up on Tuesday, he likes my Lexus a lot & decided to buy something similar. The price is good too.... I have a Mk2 with 185k on the clock, and it drives like an equivalent 60k mile Ford or Vauxhall. Only better.

So, when the dealer says the mileage (which wasn't on the ad) was 200k & backed by a FSH (mostly Lexus), I was quite happy to drive the 70 miles to go see it. Because LS400s are that good. And this was a Mk3, so in theory better than mine....

Well. The mileage was actually 235k (quite a lot over the 200k he quoted me). The "F"SH ended at 188k. The cam belt sticker said 133k (100k without a cambelt change?). Interior is wrecked - the leather is almost worn all the way through on seat & armrest/center storage. Brakes are wrecked. Bonnet latch jammed open, struts wouldn't hold. The boot was literally swimming with 3-4" of water, and it was mouldy. He claimed it had traction control (no TC button in evidence), power folding mirrors (nope), heated seats (all four were faulty), long mot (didn't look?) and tax (tax expired in October, car is SORN according to DVLA) The car needs £1000 of work just to make it worth £1000. He'd be better off breaking it for parts, frankly. And he has the nerve to be asking £1295 for it!

I'm annoyed enough to post here because he could easily have sold it to me for a reduced price if he'd been more honest & up front. I can't see anyone paying the £1295 sticker price unless they're barmy.

When I bought mine, I bought it sight unseen from eBay. I'm really beginning to appreciate just how lucky I was; I don't think I'll be doing that again!

Boy, I thought this stuff only happened to me. I've had a look at certain cars in the past, owners telling me this and that about the condition only to end up disappointed when I see the car. So now I have one rule: I demand to see recent pictures taken of the vehicle coupled with a HPI check before I even think of leaving my house. The recent pictures must also include the current registration number to prevent them from posting archive pictures. Most of the cars I've seen since then have been true to the description given.

Good luck with your search at the auction house. I'm sure you 'll find a good example soon.

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Good luck with your search at the auction house. I'm sure you 'll find a good example soon.

Yep, got it today :D

1996 P-reg, 136k miles, basically pretty tidy. There's a touch of surface rust in a couple of places, and it's been very badly re-sprayed at some point (maybe hiding something? But all the panels look straight & the gaps are good) - but Dad's pretty handy with the spanners & the wire brush, so he'll probably fix the rust issues & have it sprayed back to the green-over-silver that it used to be. It's now a sort of black colour, although in my headlights on the way home, it looked green/silver again... very weird.

The price? 800 quid + 74 commission to the auction house. Bargain. And yes, it drove the 200ish miles back home perfectly.

Proper job!

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Good luck with your search at the auction house. I'm sure you 'll find a good example soon.

Yep, got it today :D

1996 P-reg, 136k miles, basically pretty tidy. There's a touch of surface rust in a couple of places, and it's been very badly re-sprayed at some point (maybe hiding something? But all the panels look straight & the gaps are good) - but Dad's pretty handy with the spanners & the wire brush, so he'll probably fix the rust issues & have it sprayed back to the green-over-silver that it used to be. It's now a sort of black colour, although in my headlights on the way home, it looked green/silver again... very weird.

The price? 800 quid + 74 commission to the auction house. Bargain. And yes, it drove the 200ish miles back home perfectly.

Proper job!

Excellent result. I'm happy for your Dad. Hopefully he can have the luxury he deserves after all these years of Scooby hardness!! (I love the Subarus as well though).

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I agree with you guys about the most of the points made with regards to cat D write offs, however, I already knew this,

It takes very little damage to an ordinary car to rack up a bill of a few K let alone as you say to a LS400 so therefore the damage or reason for the cat D may have been relatively minor and the vehicle perfectly fine.

panic NO! pull out YES.

The vendor stated in the ad "HPI CLEAR" which is an untruth, the car was not clear in fact anything but clear and it was the first thing that was flagged up.

When informed of my findings the vendor replied "news to me", Well correct me if I'm wrong but cat D would be stamped on the log book and if indeed the seller had done a HPI check as stated he would have known this.

This to me is hardly the basis on which to start buying a car, what other things am I not being told about springs to mind.

A few years back my better half bent the Omega we owned round a lampost, the insurance company wrote the car off due to the cost of repairs, I could have repaired the car myself for a fraction of the cost, after enquiring, the insurance company were willing to sell me the car back for £400, however, the remainder of my policy (7 months) would be null and void, they would never insure the car again, any insurers in future may insist on a fresh engineers report before insuring the car, most insurers would only insure it 3rd party if at all (the industry wont pay twice for the same loss) I decided to let the car go.

so with regards to a cat D car being worth as much as a car with no issues, it's up to the individual I suppose

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When I bought mine, I bought it sight unseen from eBay. I\'m really beginning to appreciate just how lucky I was; I don\'t think I\'ll be doing that again!

I got mine off ebay £800, 210k none of those faults except the heated seats (they don\'t work on many to be fair). good luck on findign another, mk3\'s are good mk4\'s are better but twice as much think there was one on autotrader for £1750 but it had 300k recently.

Trouble is most salesmen think that once they have got you there you are more likely to buy than turn around and say \"on yer bike\"

Funny you say that a friend of mine just spent £4300 on a 54 reg Poxhall Signum diesel that had an engine management light on when we went to see it, he took me to give him advice which natrually consisted of \there\'s thousands of them that aren\'t broken" and "how much is it going to cost to find out the actual fault and fix it?" needless to say 3 months later it's fixed (supposedly) and cost him an extra £700 odd pound, I\'m still wondering why he took me along...

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I agree with you guys about the most of the points made with regards to cat D write offs, however, I already knew this,

It takes very little damage to an ordinary car to rack up a bill of a few K let alone as you say to a LS400 so therefore the damage or reason for the cat D may have been relatively minor and the vehicle perfectly fine.

panic NO! pull out YES.

The vendor stated in the ad "HPI CLEAR" which is an untruth, the car was not clear in fact anything but clear and it was the first thing that was flagged up.

When informed of my findings the vendor replied "news to me", Well correct me if I'm wrong but cat D would be stamped on the log book and if indeed the seller had done a HPI check as stated he would have known this.

This to me is hardly the basis on which to start buying a car, what other things am I not being told about springs to mind.

A few years back my better half bent the Omega we owned round a lampost, the insurance company wrote the car off due to the cost of repairs, I could have repaired the car myself for a fraction of the cost, after enquiring, the insurance company were willing to sell me the car back for £400, however, the remainder of my policy (7 months) would be null and void, they would never insure the car again, any insurers in future may insist on a fresh engineers report before insuring the car, most insurers would only insure it 3rd party if at all (the industry wont pay twice for the same loss) I decided to let the car go.

so with regards to a cat D car being worth as much as a car with no issues, it's up to the individual I suppose

Cat D doesn't get put on the logbook that Cat C wich need an SVA and re-registering before beign back ont he road.

I boguth a Cat D volvo estate deisel once, i put a new number plate on the front bought a tyre and it flew through it's MOT (had a front endaccident), boughta new bumper for £50 then sold it on ebay 8 months later for an extra £600 ove what i'd paid :)

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