A 160 Year Old Oil

[The Transporter]

as the old saying goes you cannot and i mean cannot shift as quickly no matter how the human tries as smooth, as fast ,as accurate, and as consistent as a good automatic transmission. each man for thier own at the end of the day drove manual cars and wanted something different but transmission is not the main topic of this thread its do with with Motul. so i guess i'll be the first on this forum to try it on my next service and update you guys. am also shocked at people who cannot write computer programs these days :zee: . common sense should tell you not eveyone is a mechanic same as not everyone is a computer programmer.

So what old saying is this?

Admittedly the DSG is a very quick changing gearbox but the service costs on a clutch pack will have the main agent bending the customer over the bonnet... Just what you need on a diesel Skoda.

I too am stunned at the inabillity of people to understand exactly how their computer works and how to write software.... The country is becomming a nation of lazy, stupid people..

Changing brake pads is hardly being a mechanic, it is basic DIY... It is scary too how many people have no idea how to check their cars fluids before they go on a trip

[noby76]

as the old saying goes you cannot and i mean cannot shift as quickly no matter how the human tries as smooth, as fast ,as accurate, and as consistent as a good automatic transmission. each man for thier own at the end of the day drove manual cars and wanted something different but transmission is not the main topic of this thread its do with with Motul. so i guess i'll be the first on this forum to try it on my next service and update you guys. am also shocked at people who cannot write computer programs these days :zee: . common sense should tell you not eveyone is a mechanic same as not everyone is a computer programmer.

So what old saying is this?

Its an old saying from Lexus performance engineers (ISF, LFA), fastest ever factory Lexus's to date

from Nissan NISMO performance engineers (GTR) fastest ever factory GTR to date

from BMW M performance engineers (M5 F10), fastest ever factory BMW to date

from Mercedes AMG engineers (C63, E63) fastest ever factory AMG's to date

from Audi RS engineers (RS6, R8) fastest ever factory audi's to date

and what do they all have? automatically controlled transmissions now I dont know your background but you cannot tell me you are clever than the 100 plus expensive engineers employed by these companies to work out the best transmission to put in thier most expensive fastest cars?

http://www.lexus.com/models/ISF/features/performance/Transmission_Story.pdf

dont miss the very final paragraph in the link. why have one if you can have two in one? says all of the above companies

[The Transporter]

Yawn...... It would seem that you do not know any of these engineers. My background is in engineering and as such tend to look at things from the viewpoint of an engineer..... Good engineering is to keep it as simple as possible, to make it easy and cheap to repair, especially in the field. I am very critical of new cars and their many shiney baubles and trinkets that make guys like you a marketing mans wet dream. Although I dislike automatics with torque converters they are in the main tough and give a effortless floatiness to large cars.... Modern autos are *****, pure and simple.... Sure they feel nice and crisp but they are of very poor quality, not easy to repair with expensive parts and because of this many otherwise servicable cars will be scrapped before their time.... I fear for people buying these vehicles second hand.

Virtually everything you post appears to be based on stuff that you have found on the internet and not based on your own knowlage and reasoning, you simply repeat what you are told as long as it matches with what you want to believe.... Most of it is marketing from the car manufacturers.

Lets go back to your original post, inane as it was. I have used the oil that you asked about, it was free from a rep and it was exactly the same as the oil that I use regularly..... No magical properties, it looked like oil, it smelt like oil. Would I use it again? Not unless it was cheaper than my regular oil because it didn't do anything differently, the container that it came in was pretty though

[noby76]

of course i do not know any of them and not related to any either but please bring me a human who can shift a manual transmission in 0.1 of a second both up shift and down shifts to put this into an 'engineer language' which you can understand, by the time you have clutched down to grab a gear in a manual, the automatic as shifted up two gears before you have clutched up from that gear. looks like you will be driving that IS200 for a very very long time since you mentioned of being critical about new cars. would be nice to log onto this forum in 2040 and still see you with the IS200 because you scared of newer cars .your mileage would definately beat my 110million miles... and even Lexus will be impressed with your achievements.

And yes everthing i post comes off from the internet why because we are in the Information Technology age which in 'engineer language' meaning In order for me to get what I want, I don't have to write to companies for information or go to my local library for information because its readily available a click away. we are in 2012 man catch up.

geez took us a while to steer you back to my original post... though not helpful but thanks for the effort though!

No hard feelings

[The Transporter]

Hmm Modern cars don't really frighten me but I refuse to be raped by the manufacturer... A recent example was a current shaped Range Rover Sport that one of my customers he had on one of his ramps... The electrically controlled parking brake motor had decided to lock itself on although no warnings were given on the dash. The driver had driven for some time not realising that anything was wrong... By the time it was at the garage, the motor linkages, discs and pads all needed replacing, bill was over a grand... Point is the park brake didn't need to be so complicated or so expensive.... Just like your super fast changing gearbox, who needs it? Perhaps if your name is Schumacher then yes but to drive up and down the B455.. get real! More important is for the system to be reliable and affordable.... You may still be young and dumb enough to be impressed by gizmology and slick marketing, I am far too old and grumpy for all that.

As a guy who is into computers, then you should know that what you call Information Technology is actually Misinformation Technology... the bulk of the internet is based on adverts and marketing, fuelled by suckers who swallow what the internet tells them... That is scary.... You need to wise up

Yep, I shall keep my little IS until the wheels fall off and I will be very pleased if it gets to 2040.... What does a modern car do that the IS200 doesn't?... With the exception of the engine management there is nothing on the car that I cannot fix.....My buddy still runs round in a 1964 Humber Imperial with leather seats that you just sink into, air conditioning, ride adjustable shocks (There is a switch with 3 settings on the dash) and separate heating in the rear and blower to demist the rear window and an engine that is even smoother and quieter than the Lexus I6 Owning a car that can be repaired is something worth bearing in mind as Western Europe teeters on the brink of becoming the new third world.

See you when your super sonic hover car has to be scrapped when replacing the headlamp bulb is too costly to replace...

[noby76]

do like the idea of being called young but dumb am far from. dont get me wrong am not knocking older technology one bit as i beleive older technology in terms of cars was more reliable and the best. take a Toyota 2JZ and Nissans RB26 for example this engine blocks were designed in the late 80's using older technology i.e cast iron and a turbo and highly tuned, they do deliver power figures and beat the 8 litre 16 cylinder Bugatti Veyron labelled the worlds fastest car over a quater mile.

As an engineer you should know the race between car manufactures to deliver good economy, responsive, powerful, good co2 emissions, efficient gearboxes all in one car, they have to push technological boundaries i.e. using complex ecu's, high powered injectors, dpf's, over complex transmissions etc which could sometimes result in unreliability in mordern cars. I mean take older deisel cars as an example tho they do not deliver the same mpg figures as a same capacity mordern TDI they were reliable and could be driven to the ground. take the new BMW M5 F10 since when does a 4.4 twin turbo engine deliver 28mpg? my 3.0 only gets 26mpg and this is without a turbo. so this should tell you there is a race going on to deliver and this leads to pushing boundaries. couple of years ago a car was either fuel efficient and slow or was fast and gave 15mpg but today they are cramming both in one.

we could go on and on from oil. to engines to gearboxes to tyres but each man to his own and yes there is nothing a modern car does that an IS cant thats why i drive one my self ..

[bilmac]

Automatic transmissions are for fat Yanks, the disabled and the terminally baffled.... A decent driver can drive a manual as smoothly as an automatic and the gear change will be precisely when the driver wants it... And none of the losses of the slushy torque converter

A very general statement. and wrong you are entitled to your opinion but it is without any basis in fact

Really? Which bit?

All of it. including your signature. you were never like me.

[bilmac]

Hmm Modern cars don't really frighten me but I refuse to be raped by the manufacturer... A recent example was a current shaped Range Rover Sport that one of my customers he had on one of his ramps... The electrically controlled parking brake motor had decided to lock itself on although no warnings were given on the dash. The driver had driven for some time not realising that anything was wrong... By the time it was at the garage, the motor linkages, discs and pads all needed replacing, bill was over a grand... Point is the park brake didn't need to be so complicated or so expensive.... Just like your super fast changing gearbox, who needs it? Perhaps if your name is Schumacher then yes but to drive up and down the B455.. get real! More important is for the system to be reliable and affordable.... You may still be young and dumb enough to be impressed by gizmology and slick marketing, I am far too old and grumpy for all that.

As a guy who is into computers, then you should know that what you call Information Technology is actually Misinformation Technology... the bulk of the internet is based on adverts and marketing, fuelled by suckers who swallow what the internet tells them... That is scary.... You need to wise up

Yep, I shall keep my little IS until the wheels fall off and I will be very pleased if it gets to 2040.... What does a modern car do that the IS200 doesn't?... With the exception of the engine management there is nothing on the car that I cannot fix.....My buddy still runs round in a 1964 Humber Imperial with leather seats that you just sink into, air conditioning, ride adjustable shocks (There is a switch with 3 settings on the dash) and separate heating in the rear and blower to demist the rear window and an engine that is even smoother and quieter than the Lexus I6 Owning a car that can be repaired is something worth bearing in mind as Western Europe teeters on the brink of becoming the new third world.

See you when your super sonic hover car has to be scrapped when replacing the headlamp bulb is too costly to replace...

You do talk a lot of bull.

[The Transporter]

You do talk a lot of bull.

Feel free to qualify your assertion.

[The Transporter]

do like the idea of being called young but dumb am far from. dont get me wrong am not knocking older technology one bit as i beleive older technology in terms of cars was more reliable and the best. take a Toyota 2JZ and Nissans RB26 for example this engine blocks were designed in the late 80's using older technology i.e cast iron and a turbo and highly tuned, they do deliver power figures and beat the 8 litre 16 cylinder Bugatti Veyron labelled the worlds fastest car over a quater mile.

As an engineer you should know the race between car manufactures to deliver good economy, responsive, powerful, good co2 emissions, efficient gearboxes all in one car, they have to push technological boundaries i.e. using complex ecu's, high powered injectors, dpf's, over complex transmissions etc which could sometimes result in unreliability in mordern cars. I mean take older deisel cars as an example tho they do not deliver the same mpg figures as a same capacity mordern TDI they were reliable and could be driven to the ground. take the new BMW M5 F10 since when does a 4.4 twin turbo engine deliver 28mpg? my 3.0 only gets 26mpg and this is without a turbo. so this should tell you there is a race going on to deliver and this leads to pushing boundaries. couple of years ago a car was either fuel efficient and slow or was fast and gave 15mpg but today they are cramming both in one.

we could go on and on from oil. to engines to gearboxes to tyres but each man to his own and yes there is nothing a modern car does that an IS cant thats why i drive one my self ..

Although when a new car is designed, engineers do have some input but sadly accountants have the greater say..

As an IT guy you should know that the processing speed of the average ECU isn't that fast.... It doesn't need to be. The process of fueling and firing a cylinder and then monitoring crank acceleration or deceleration although to us is pretty rapid, to the average laptop would be seen as pretty slow.... Again the marketing men trying to convince us that the electronics on a car are sophisticated and powerful when the electronics are cheap and built down to a price... I ask you which engineer in his right mind would design a vehicle with aluminium alloy pipes secured with steel clips? or would feed a diesel engine with it's own exhaust fumes? come to think of it, when Catalytic converters were first introduced to Europe, the engine management systems of the day were perfectly capable of controling the combustion and achieving the required emissions without a cat, I suspect that this is still the case but a large European catalytic converter manufacturer pressed cats as the only solution to the problem (A nice little earner for them and the parts suppliers).... As for Carbon Dioxide reductions (Part of my work is in the renewable energy industry and most of it is total hogwash but it makes me lots of lovely money) If they were really interested in CO2 reductions then why are the car designers not far more bold in their approach? Hybrids are greenwash as are electic cars.

When you look at an engine, why do we need a cylinder head? why do we need a camshaft, why do we not make an engine run at a fixed speed and vary the speed of the vehicle using an infinately variable speed transmission, no gear changes required.... Operating intake and exhaust valves electrically (No it cannot be done using 12 volts) The ultimate variable valve timing would give us an engine that would give us lots of power or incredible economy from small engines with very low emissions....

What we see now is not high tech, it is overcomplication for the sake of overcompication with very small gains and massive losses. 28mpg from a 4.4 turbo aint bad if you only look at mpg but if you are constantly shelling out for new parts on a car that achieves this then you will find it an expensive car to run. As you are aware, the IS is not a frugal vehicle but in the seven years that I have owned my little 200 the only parts needed over and above service components (timing belt and components, oils, coolants and other fluids) was a water pump so it is looking like the thirsty IS can start to appear to be a frugal car to run......

[mikeyv]

I think Transporter has some good points, in fairness.

Modern cars are unnecessarily complicated imo.

Things I could happily live without

Rain sensing wipers - I'd rather make my own judgement thanks, and they seem to often go wrong anyway.

Lights that turn themselves on at dusk - see previous point.

Self dipping mirrors.

Built in sat nav that costs a bomb at manufacturers prices, and will need updating at a higher cost than a new complete up to date system from tom tom etc.

Anything that takes control of braking or steering from the driver - the potential for disaster in the case of electrical failure is surely obvious to all.

I'm thinking in particular of bread and butter cars, the type bought by ordinary motorists, as opposed to luxury cars.

The point about fuel consumption is a good one too, we pay thousands in the cost of the latest fuel saving ideas, plus thousands more to change to latest models in depreciation, just to save hundreds on fuel.

Lastly, from a green point of view, perfectly good cars will be scrapped, purely because of complicated systems being uneconomical to repair, especially where your only option is a main dealer.

[bilmac]

You do talk a lot of bull.

Feel free to qualify your assertion.

Not necessary, you do it for me each time you post. Best to ignore you

[The Transporter]

You do talk a lot of bull.

Feel free to qualify your assertion.

Not necessary, you do it for me each time you post. Best to ignore you

It's a shame that you didn't then..... Six posts and four of them on little old me. Feel free to add something useful if you're not too hard of thinking