Formula 1 Ruined

[harrylime]

I just watched some of the Spanish Grand Prix, the first time I've watched F1 for ages. Where has all the noise gone? The cars are so much quieter, but for me the screaming high revving engines added a lot to the experience. Apparently, the new engines are a V6 hybrid. Sound familiar? They are apparently only 1.6 litres but produce a total of 760 horsepower. I think they use less fuel than before also. This is a phenomenal engineering achievement but a lot of the excitement has been lost. It also increases my belief that hybrids may be the way to go for my cars. I gave up on modern diesels because of the expensive and inevitable problems. You save on fuel costs but pay these are often promptly wiped out in repair bills

[Stuno1]

Ruined is a bit ott! It has shaken up the teams and also changes with less down force and power put more emphasis on the drivers ability.

Apparently they are looking to address the sound issue but for me it's not an issue at all.

Stu

[nelmo]

a lot of the excitement has been lost.

I gave up on modern diesels because of the expensive and inevitable problems. You save on fuel costs but pay these are often promptly wiped out in repair bills

How has the excitement been lost? Just because it's a bit quieter? Isn't the excitement caused by racers trying to overtake, crashing, spinning off etc, etc? F1 has never been hugely exciting IMO, especially compared to MotoGP (bikes) but it seems to be marginally more so this year (apart from Mercedes winning everything).

'Inevitable' problems with diesels? I had diesels for just 5 years and had one sticky EGR valve (whatever that is) in that time that the dealer sorted for free. Diesel engines are generally considered more reliable than petrol, I guess partly because they are simpler (no spark ignition system, for example) and the lower revs they run at.

[harrylime]

Completely disagree. The noise is part of the excitement, which is what racing should be all about. Noise plus the aspects you mention are not mutually exclusive, it is not as if you can't have one without the other and it is still a race. These are racing machines not refined cruisers. F1 is now soul -less and sterile. It is still largely about the cars and not the drivers, hence the top 2 having more than double the points of the next nearest, the drivers are not twice as good. In my opinion they should make F1 cars sound like the BRM v16 of the 1050s, then you would know what I'm talking about. Interest in F1 would soar. Watch this clip on Youtube, and imagine a dozen of these at full chat, you might see what I mean if you are open minded enough. The BRM V16 was not very reliable or successful but spectators loved them

.

As for diesels vs petrols, ask any Jag, BMW or Mercedes mechanic which are more reliable. I have spoken to a few, and they spend most of their repair time on DMFs, DPFs and so on. I had a brand new XF Portfolio 3.0 diesel and did not trust it to be reliable in the long term. I have a diesel Skoda now, as a workhorse, but I made sure it was a PD unit, pre DPF. Designing a diesel car that is unsuitable for short journeys (as most now are) is ludicrous. Having to replace dual mass flywheels with SMF at great expense is ludicrous.

[Keith_W]

Sorry Harry I have to disagree with you here. Whilst the noise can add to the F1 experience, it has to be about the racing coupled with the pinnacle of engineering. It surely cannot be soul-less on the basis of it being more about the car than driver when, quite frankly, this has always been the case; however, this year, with the cars having more power than grip, I feel that the ratio of driver ability Vs car quality has undoubtedly shifted more towards the driver.

Compare the driving ability required this year compared to previous years - watch the in-car footage of a quali lap and tell me this is less about driving ability than previous years. Watch the bahrain GP and tell me this is not as good as previous years.

I've seen every practice, quali and race programme this year and completely forgot about the noise now - furthermore, I've seen some of the older 'classic' races from the 80s and early 90s recently and funnily enough, I was reminded that the general theme was: the fastest cars won and races were largely processional.

[nelmo]

Completely disagree. The noise is part of the excitement, which is what racing should be all about. Noise plus the aspects you mention are not mutually exclusive, it is not as if you can't have one without the other and it is still a race. These are racing machines not refined cruisers. F1 is now soul -less and sterile. It is still largely about the cars and not the drivers, hence the top 2 having more than double the points of the next nearest, the drivers are not twice as good. In my opinion they should make F1 cars sound like the BRM v16 of the 1050s, then you would know what I'm talking about. Interest in F1 would soar.

I'm confused - don't you think the new F1 cars sound closer to the BRM? Much less high-pitched wail and a little bit of growl? It's not like F1 cars are now silent - it's still damn noisy.

As Keith said, F1 championships have often been one-horse races - this is a quote about the 1950s championship:

'Given the supremacy of their all-powerful Tipo 158 cars the first world driving title was bound to go to one of the Alfa Romeo trio, known collectively as 'the three F's'

Then the 1952-3 seasons, Alberto Ascari:

'In 1952 he drove his Ferrari 500 to victory in six of the seven championship races. In 1953 he again overpowered the opposition, winning five times and cruising to a second successive driving title'

In the 1960 championship, jack Brabham won 5 of the 8 races...

Sound familiar? Were they soulless then as well?

BTW, I can assure you that my wife would not be more interested in F1 if the engines were louder

[harrylime]

Keep your hair on chaps, just my opinion. I think the new engines are much quieter and have lost something. I posted the BRM to show what the noise levels were like back in the 50s. There were other cars, such as the auto union which were similarly impressive. Quite a few people have posted these on YouTube because for some of us car nuts, they make the hairs on our neck stand up, almost like listening to a Spitfire fly over. If you don't get it, that's fine. I don't see that happening to the new F1 engines years down the line. I thought they might be of interest to those who have not heard them. We will have to agree to disagree I think, and life would be pretty boring if we all agreed on everything

[Stuno1]

Not looking for arguement fella. Just saying what I think.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion and the fact they are devolving new exit pipes shows a lot of people share yours.

[harrylime]

It's all good

[nelmo]

some of us car nuts

If you don't get it, that's fine.

Harry, stop with the condescending - you're not the only one who knows something about F1 history or cars in general... :arrrggg-matey:

I've been to Goodwood numerous times and I've heard all those cars running and watched them race at the Revival, so I 'get it' - they do sound great, no argument there.

But they haven't sounded like that for at least 40 years and F1 is still around and very well supported, so it obviously doesn't bother most people...

[harrylime]

Nothing condescending about it. My last post acknowledged that will have to agree to disagree, and that different opinions are good. Now for feck's sake let it go . It's the last time I venture an opinion on here. I will stick to technical issues and the giving and receiving of advice/experiences. Jesus.

[Stuno1]

Nothing condescending about it. My last post acknowledged that will have to agree to disagree, and that different opinions are good. Now for feck's sake let it go . It's the last time I venture an opinion on here. I will stick to technical issues and the giving and receiving of advice/experiences. Jesus.

Lol. Love forums... Keep doing it mate. Good to have a bit of a disagreement now and then.

[Aristhrottle]

I maintain that any racing formula which has to include regulations and technologies that help cars to overtake is seriously struggling.

DRS ... Pleeeeeeeze take this away.

How about making everyone use the same front and rear spoilers all year?

But, chassis, body and engine design were all free.

As for sound ... anything that makes viewers go "woo" instead of "zzzzzz" gets my vote, that's the sound that matters.

It would be nice to hear a mix of thumping V8s and screaming V12s mixing it up together though :)

[Bluesman]

I like A but cant stand B

B likes A but doesn't like C

C likes B but doesn't like A

That is the way of the world chaps and that's what makes the world such an exciting place to live our 3 score years and 10.

I am not a lover of turning the noise down on F1 cars and that is just my point of view I wouldn't want to upset someone else who doesn't mind the noise being turned down.

We are all here because we love one thing and that's our LS's so please don't take offence at someone else's point of view which they are perfectly entitled to.

We have just lost one member over a similar difference of opinion and we don't want to lose anymore.

Remember this is a forum which discusses a myriad of subjects as well as our beloved Lexus Ls's Mike