New Rx400H Owner

[DferBfer]

Hello folks !

I've just acquired a 2009-plate ELE and I'd be grateful for views on a couple of issues.

1. The car has some smart Aluminium interior trim: is there any polish or protective 'coating' that can be applied to help keep this in good condition and anything that can be done to restore such surfaces that do get worn/scratched ?

2. I understand the 12v Battery can fail to start the car after a couple of weeks without it being driven. How can one minimise the problem if the car cannot be driven for a while and what to do (i.e. how to re-charge the Battery and with what type of charger) should the problem nonetheless occur (I've seen references on Honest John's site to the need to be careful with Hybrids in connection with Battery charging).

Thanks to Steve for his welcoming e-mail & message.

[stevet]

Not sure about the trim but the Battery issues don't effect all cars. I've left mine over three weeks on a few occasions and its started without any problems.

[steve2006]

Hello and welcome to the LOC.

You can buy specialist polish for aluminium but I would just wipe it over and buff it dry occasionally.

Some members have purchased a solar panel trickle charger and had the cigar lighter socket modified to a permanant live feed to enable the car to charge when stood for extended periods.

[royoftherovers]

I have successfully attached an AA Solar Powered Charger via the OBD11 Port and left the GS450H car for 6 weeks.

It started instaneously.

Good luck.

Regards

John

[DferBfer]

Thanks for the prompt responses, Chaps. If the Battery problem doesn't affect all Lexus Hybrids they do seem to affect some from what Steve & John say. Do we know what the cause of the problem is when it does occur ?

[ColinBarber]

the 12v Battery capacity is quite small on the 400h, and on most hybrids because it isn't needed to start the engine, therefore it doesn't take much to drain it and if you have an old Battery which has lost some of its usable capacity then the situation is worse.

If the Battery has been deep-cycled, which is easy to do due to its small capacity, then that will accelerate its ageing - which ends up being a self-defeating cycle as with less capacity it is even easier to deep-cycle it.

Lexus advise the Battery to be disconnected on all their hybrid vehicles if leaving for 4 week or more and the latest manuals for the IS300h etc have many warning about not using electrical systems without being in 'Ready' state to avoid deep-cycling.

If your Battery is over 5 years old then it might be time to replace it, and replace it with the Bosch equivalent as that has slightly more capacity than the OEM Battery.

[royoftherovers]

Digby,

I have never had a Battery problem.

I merely attach the Solar Powered Charger to ensure that my Battery does not go flat.

Regards

John

[DferBfer]

Thanks for the further comments.

Colin: I have coincidentally in the meantime become aware of Deep Cycle Batteries and am wondering whether investing in one, although more expensive than the usual 12v car Battery, would be worthwhile for the peace of mind. However, disconnection as you suggest, is cleary a cheaper option: where do I find the little b-----d & in what order should one perform the disconnection & reconnection ?

[ColinBarber]

the Battery is located in the engine bay, near the washer filler. You just need to disconnect the black -ve Battery connection.

If you will leave your vehicle for weeks at a time more than once or twice a year then a deep cycle Battery may be a good idea - optima do one of their yellowtop batteries in the correct size.

[DferBfer]

Thanks again, Colin.

Good to know about the Solar Charger option, folks, but in my case the car will likely be in our garage so.........

[ColinBarber]

do you have power in the garage? If you do then a trickle charger may be a good option.

[DferBfer]

Thanks, Colin. Yes we have 16 double sockets - the previous owner ran his engraving business from the garage !. I had heard about trickle chargers via the Toyota Auris Owners Club Forum - my wife's car is a T4 Hybrid - but don't know what sort would be suitable. However, your earlier suggestion of disconnection seems less worrying to me !

Incidentally, I've been pondering Stevet's response (the 1st in this thread) about not all Lexus hybrids being affected: presumably the reason batteries do drain is because of the demand from things such as the Alarm system so presumably if one knows what all the 'culprits' are and turns them off there should not be a problem at all .

[ColinBarber]

I think it just comes down to health of the Battery and usage. Parasitic power draw should be consistent, I don't believe multiple cars are all suffering from an issue.

One thing I did find on my OEM Battery was that dirt easily collected on the top of the Battery, and within a groove running along the top, which combined with water spillage when filling up the washer reservoir. This created a circuit between +ve and -ve which increases the parasitic draw.

[DferBfer]

I have realised that I'd dived in to the forum with my 'newbie' questions without researching other threads that cover the same or similar issues. ( My excuse is that having taken the plunge & gone for the car this issue suddenly loomed much larger as it's clearly a very practical and potentially annoying one especially for someone like me who has been spoiled by having cars - at least in the last few years - which basically just work without me having to do or think about anything ! Colin's last posting is a case in point - I need to stop being lazy & pay a bit more attention to the car !) Having belatedly checked through the other threads I've found a few issues in particular which I think worth highlighting (see http://www.lexusownersclub.co.uk/forum/topic/43199-battery-failure which dates from 2007):

1. The rxh_driving_performance_guide at http://www.lexus.com...mance_guide.pdf contains the following guidance: " ....to help

keep your vehicle’s 12-volt Battery fully charged: Drive vehicle at least weekly. Operate accessories with vehicle in “READY” mode.
When parking, make sure all doors are closed and lights are turned off."

Long-term parking.

If the vehicle has been parked for two weeks or longer, do not operate the power rear door until you have turned the key to “START” and

the “READY” light stays on. If the vehicle has been parked for a long time, the 12-volt and the hybrid Battery will discharge gradually. For parking longer than about 30 days, charging of the 12-volt Battery may be required. See your dealership for details. To keep the hybrid Battery in good condition, drive the vehicle at least once every several months for at least 30 minutes or ten miles."

2. The same doc says "If the hybrid Battery becomes fully discharged and the vehicle will not start, even with a jump start to the 12-volt Battery,, contact your Lexus dealership". However, the Honest John website review of the 400h says "11-5-2011: DO NOT JUMP START. Hybrids should be trickled charged, not jump started (bulletin from Toyota how to do it correctly). If a recovery agent connects jump leads directly to either hybrid Battery and than to his Battery the sudden charge can damage circuits with in the hybrid system (not necessarily the ECU). It seems that not all recovery companies are familiar with the correct jump start process . Damage can be caused which will not be apparent at the time."

Am I correct in thinking that the latter statement does not mean that the former is wrong as they are talking about the traction and 12v auxilliary batteries respectively - so a solution to the flat 12v Battery problem is to seek a jump start from another (any other ?) car. But if this is OK and bearing in mind the small amount of current required to be able to start the 400h, is such a jump start better done without the donor car's engine running to minimise the risk of any voltage spikes ?

Another solution suggested is to carry a small 'spare' 12v Battery that can be connected across the original one if that is flat just long enough to start the car (although other posts suggest that you have to keep the revs going in the 400h for about 20 mins until the regular 12v Battery has been recharged). There's also an interesting calculation in the referenced thread which seems to explain why batteries go flat after around 10 days.

[ColinBarber]

if your hybrid / traction Battery goes flat then I would get Lexus out, or tow it to them to recharge. This is unlikely, you would probably have to leave your vehicle for 6+ months for this to happen.

if the 12v aux Battery goes flat then a quick charge will be all that is needed to power up the vehicle, or connect jump leads to another vehicle. As you state, there isn't a requirement for high current as the engine isn't started via the 12v Battery.

Make sure you don't have your lights on 'auto' which may try and come on when you turn on the ignition.