460 Or 600 Which To Buy

[bilmac]

As the title says gents, I am in the happy position of getting a new (to me that is) car. I have only had my GS 450h a very short time and I love it, however I recently had a drive in a LS. Wow, I want one now, and since everyone tells me I can't take it with me I have decided to treat myself. I am thinking of 2007 or 2008 and will be trading my 2007 GS which confines me to dealing with Dealers but am still hoping to change for about 15,000 euro. I would like your thoughts on should I go for the 460 or the 600. and what are the best colours, trim, etc, anything that comes to mind.there are at present 10 cars on offer 4 x 600 and 6 x 460s. All suggestion or comments are welcome. thanks in advance . bilmac

[black400]

I would go with the newer 600 if were my money nicer looking better kit , i also like black or wine gold to trashy silver to merc.trim ?.

[scythe]

In answering this question, I'm a bit worried about offending people. However ...

If you're really keen on the idea of having a hybrid to play with, then, obviously, buy the 600. If you do this, then I'd suggest trying to find a short wheel base version. This won't have the seat in the back with the bit that sticks out, but it will have three seats instead of 2, which is often useful with grandchildren. Also, that extra 30cm of car is a nuisance. 5m long is fine, but 5.3 leaves you sticking out in carparks and things.

Otherwise, I'd suggest buying the 460 SE-L. Get the SE-L version because that has all the toys. Apart from fuel consumption around town, and not having the option of the couch and four seats, the 460, for me, wins on all counts.

It's 200kg lighter than the 600. It's quicker to 62 mph, and possibly quicker to stop as well. It requires 98 load tyres instead of 102, so they are a little cheaper.

The boot of a 460 basic model is an ok sort of size. The SE-L has enough luggage space for 2 people. The 600 is smaller still.

The extra cost of a 600 will be partly recouped by better around town mileage, but you'll have to go a long way to break even; even then a point will come when the Battery needs replacing, which may be around £5k. If you have the car still when its 10 years old, it might be you paying for it. If not, the next person may have to, and will be offering you a lot less for the car as a consequence.

In the UK, the slightly lower carbon dioxide figure of the 600 originally bought a considerable reduction in benefit in kind for company cars, and a lower VED (tax disk) as well, but the escalator on that has now removed that advantage. Both cars are

harshly treated under our tax laws.

Which? magazine recently did a comparison between noise inside a 460 and a 600 when cruising. The 460 was quieter.

As far as the box of toys goes, the 460 SE-L has one important one that only a few later 600s have, which is the lane keep assist. This does two things - bongs you if you go over lane markings, and gives the steering a bit of a nudge, just so you know. But it also helps steer. It's not perfect, but somehow, having a bit of assistance vastly extends how much I can drive before I start to feel at all weary.

There's some other minor stuff too.... cost of insurance, what happens when the car catches fire etc ... but for me it was an easy decision.

Lexus stopped bringing in the 460 when times became tough in 2009 (and have all but finished with the 600 as well). I dont think we'll see another car like it, so I'd say to grab one while they're still around!

[steve2006]

That is one of the best informative write ups I have ever seen :D

[bilmac]

I would go with the newer 600 if were my money nicer looking better kit , i also like black or wine gold to trashy silver to merc.trim ?.

Thanks for that. I think wine or gold ok but I would prefer not to have black or silver, but never say never. I don't understand the bit about merc trim?

[bilmac]

In answering this question, I'm a bit worried about offending people. However ...

If you're really keen on the idea of having a hybrid to play with, then, obviously, buy the 600. If you do this, then I'd suggest trying to find a short wheel base version. This won't have the seat in the back with the bit that sticks out, but it will have three seats instead of 2, which is often useful with grandchildren. Also, that extra 30cm of car is a nuisance. 5m long is fine, but 5.3 leaves you sticking out in carparks and things.

Otherwise, I'd suggest buying the 460 SE-L. Get the SE-L version because that has all the toys. Apart from fuel consumption around town, and not having the option of the couch and four seats, the 460, for me, wins on all counts.

It's 200kg lighter than the 600. It's quicker to 62 mph, and possibly quicker to stop as well. It requires 98 load tyres instead of 102, so they are a little cheaper.

The boot of a 460 basic model is an ok sort of size. The SE-L has enough luggage space for 2 people. The 600 is smaller still.

The extra cost of a 600 will be partly recouped by better around town mileage, but you'll have to go a long way to break even; even then a point will come when the battery needs replacing, which may be around £5k. If you have the car still when its 10 years old, it might be you paying for it. If not, the next person may have to, and will be offering you a lot less for the car as a consequence.

In the UK, the slightly lower carbon dioxide figure of the 600 originally bought a considerable reduction in benefit in kind for company cars, and a lower VED (tax disk) as well, but the escalator on that has now removed that advantage. Both cars are

harshly treated under our tax laws.

Which? magazine recently did a comparison between noise inside a 460 and a 600 when cruising. The 460 was quieter.

As far as the box of toys goes, the 460 SE-L has one important one that only a few later 600s have, which is the lane keep assist. This does two things - bongs you if you go over lane markings, and gives the steering a bit of a nudge, just so you know. But it also helps steer. It's not perfect, but somehow, having a bit of assistance vastly extends how much I can drive before I start to feel at all weary.

There's some other minor stuff too.... cost of insurance, what happens when the car catches fire etc ... but for me it was an easy decision.

Lexus stopped bringing in the 460 when times became tough in 2009 (and have all but finished with the 600 as well). I dont think we'll see another car like it, so I'd say to grab one while they're still around!

Thanks for taking the time to answer, and a very good answer indeed, I agree that the long wheelbase is not the best option for me, as I like to be in the drivers seat, and for all the other reasons you mentioned. So If I am to get the 600 it will not be that one.

In fact I think you have convinced me that the 460 is the better option. again for the reasons mentioned,

So thats decided then, a 460 S EL

As I have said in earlier post I would prefer a colour other than black, but I will not rule it out. at the moment I have been looking at a Brown ( well a kind of brown) one, with light trim, and am shortly going to see a dark red, again with tan trim. a difference in price of 17,000 euro with them, as the Brown one @ 21,000 euro has 98500miles, and very little service history, a finance repossession, but straight and clean, (to my eye anyway) and the Red one @ 38,000 euro having 59300mile ,full Lexus history mint condition. I actually prefer the Brown color, but I think I would worry about it to much. I think I will pay the extra and get the mint one as I believe that it will see me out as I intend to keep it forever. However it will depend on the dealer agreeing to take mine for its real value, Which I think is 16,000 euro. I am prepared to spend up to 22,000 euro to change for the right car. There is also a Black on offer @ 32,500 euro with some history. I feel better now that I have made up my mind, now all I need is to find the right one for me. I will try to to be in a hurry and enjoy looking for it, but I confess to been a sales mans dream, in that I sell the car to myself even before I arrive at the garage.

Thanks again for your help and I will be happy to lister to more if you have it.

[scythe]

For balance, I should say that the 600 has two things the 460 doesnt. One is that the 600 has LED headlights. I don't know how much better they are than the 460 ones, which I've always found more than adequate. The other thing the 600 has is all wheel drive. The 460 is not completely useless in the snow, but it really isn't very good. You will need snow shoes for the tyres if you're going out in proper snow.

Whichever car you buy, there's some stuff that should come with the car that they might not mention if they don't have. Obviously check for the spare and the toolkit, including the torch! The torch is a bit rubbish, but it shows something. However, also check that you have the remote for the entertainment system (needed by the people/children in the back so they can watch/listen to something different to the Radio 4 that you've got on in the front), two sets of infrared headphones (again for the people/children in the back), plus also the keyless entry key.

The keyless entry key is part of the list for the SE L, and should therefore come with the car. Replacements are about £400. You may not want one (I think my one is great, because I don't need to carry any keys any more) but you can certainly use the lack of one for downward negotiation.

Incidentally, if you come across a car like your high mileage one, that has lost its history, you can still check with a Lexus dealer, who will tell you everything. Any Lexus attention the car has had is listed. I think they have more data than that as well.

Patience is everything! At this time of the year dealers are starting to accept that any LS they have now is going to be hanging around til next summer, and the closer you get to Christmas, the lower the prices will start to become. Just remember that you're keen, but they are desperate.

Good luck, anyway, with your search.

[karmaz]

William,

Just for reference, as i'm in Ireland too: The 600h can be VRT'ed for less than the 460, as it's co2 bring it under the top rate.

Next year, you'll be able to vrt a 2006 600h for 4,500 euro and a 2007 model for 6,500 euro

Considering you can buy a 2006/2007 600h, with 100k for about £17k, that means the car is landed and taxed for between 25-27k euro.

That's a very decent price for a cleared 600h, and with the improved mpg in the city it makes financial sense.

Obviously the major issue is moving on your own car as a private sale, at a decent rate, which may be very tricky.

Seemingly the VRT refunds (on exporting your own car from the state) that were proposed, will be coming in next year, so that would open the possibility of you trading in against your new car in the UK.

Best of luck whatever route you choose, but I just wanted to throw that out as an option for you.

[bilmac]

William,

Just for reference, as i'm in Ireland too: The 600h can be VRT'ed for less than the 460, as it's co2 bring it under the top rate.

Next year, you'll be able to vrt a 2006 600h for 4,500 euro and a 2007 model for 6,500 euro

Considering you can buy a 2006/2007 600h, with 100k for about £17k, that means the car is landed and taxed for between 25-27k euro.

That's a very decent price for a cleared 600h, and with the improved mpg in the city it makes financial sense.

Obviously the major issue is moving on your own car as a private sale, at a decent rate, which may be very tricky.

Seemingly the VRT refunds (on exporting your own car from the state) that were proposed, will be coming in next year, so that would open the possibility of you trading in against your new car in the UK.

Best of luck whatever route you choose, but I just wanted to throw that out as an option for you.

Thats good information, Thanks a lot I am very glad I joined this site. when I started looking there were quite a few possible cars now for one reason or another I have it down to two, but with this information it opens up all of the UK, so I can afford to be fussy. food for thought, thanks again guys