Using The Ls Too Much!

[Anthony B]

Hate to spoil anyone's enthusiasm, but not many people now believe Al Gore to be a reliable source of information or insight. His reportage in that film was so selective as to be unbalanced. Climate matters are a good deal more nuanced than he gave the impression.

Admittedly mankind is wasteful and we often have a damaging impact - but the factors causing climate change are dominated by the sun and the oceans, not by carbon dioxide. Driving quality cars, as Lexus drivers do, generating most electricity by nuclear reaction, helping poorer nations to develop as we have and spreading health and literacy, will achieve far more than Al Gore's simplistic and mistaken notions ever will.

Anthony

[Cotswold Pete]

Anthony - agree it is all far more nuanced than I think anyone really understands. I do recall reading somewhere that everyday the sun dumps as much energy per day on the planet than mankind has burnt since we came about. So I would surmise that not allowing heat to escape with the greenhouse effect must have some bearing, but that if the earth moves only a tiny bit away from the sun or a tiny bit nearer the sun, then the effect is more than anything that man can do.

These days meat eaters get the blame, because of all the cows breaking wind, rice eaters get the blame because of the gasses given off by growing rice is a problem, and then creating concrete and plasterboard get the blame because of the huge amounts of carbon generated.

I would love to think giving up driving my LS, having cold showers and eating recycled newspaper and living in a cardboard box would make the planet a nicer place for my kids, but it only takes a few volcanoes to go bang to cool the planet, and then enough go bang, they heat up the planet so even nature keeps oscillating between hot and cold.

But I do take a view that buying a solid second hand motor is greener than having a new one every few years, and would love to think i could bequeath my LS to my kids when my time comes to shuffle off this mortal coil (in a couple of decades or more!!)

[Bluesman]

Its the same with governments and coperate giants all over the world they all spread rumour which has no basis in fact whatsoever and they make fortunes out of it because the large percentage of humans still believe what they are told by these liars.

Sure man can make a right pigs ear of living on this planet with all the mess he leaves behind.

Everything has a beginning and an end and so it will be with mother earth but it wont be because something man has done it will be from far greater forces than we can begin to understand.

What did man have to do with the coming of the last ice age? Nothing, and those liars who try to fill our heads with their nonsense cant explain it either so they just dont talk about it, god forbid anyone who tries to drive a wagon and horses through their rediculous so called facts.

A case in point is the birth of windfarms which are now defacing our wondereful countryside.

These companies work on a flawed premiss and that is when they tell you how much a certain windmill can produce its worked out on the fact that the wind will blow at a maximum speed 24 hrs a day 7 days a week 52 weeks a year and of course that dosent happen, even those out at sea dont have that luxuray. Most of them dont produce enough power to boil a kettle for a cup of tea, but we are paying the companies vast fortunes out of our fuel bills to subsidise them and we will untill somone has the guts to stand up and say, its all a con it has to stop.

I could go on go on forever but thats the end End of todays rant. Mike

[I have a lexus too]

Gosh, Lexus owners really clever !

They know more about climate change than the IPCC, NASA, the UN, the US Global Change Research Program, the Arctic Climate Impact Assessment, and the HUGE majority of scientists in the fields of Physical, Chemical, Meteorological, Oceanographical, and Paleoclimatological sciences.

I guess it's just coincidence that the 13 warmest years ever, globally, have occured this century (which is only 14 years old) - at the same time as the level of atmospheric CO2 is higher than at any time in the last 20 million years ?

I'm not tree-huggy about this, after all I do drive a 4.3 litre car, but I do think it's time to stop denying it and perhaps take some responsibilty.

[Malc]

Hey guys, let's not get bogged down in this relative trivia .............. . whatever we say or do there's nowt that we individually, nor with our Lexii, are going to significantly do to stop, curtail, improve, lessen or whatever with global warming ... is there .. well. not in our lifetimes nor in those of our nearest and dearest. ........ Lexii are for enjoying and I guess we are the fortunate few who can afford the luxury of running our wonderful cars ....... the little us petrolheads use in our 4+ ltr limos and contaminate is insignificant by the standards of Govt / Council owned diesels that are still chucking out obnoxious black stuff.... that we see every day.

If the Govt really wants to stop this pollution it needs to do summat more demanding with it's own influence closer to home........ like using less vehicle movements either on it's own account or through contractors vehicles.

Malc

Now shoot me down in flames ........... . well, provided they don't add to the global warming that is :outforcount:

[I have a lexus too]

Agrred Malc. If I really thought it would make a difference, I would get rid of my car.

However, I don't think that dismissing the entire scientific comunity as "Liars" is a productive way forward.

It's the way the religious leaders of the day treated Galileo - and he was proved right!

[arfur45]

Blimey

All I said was that I seemed to be enjoying driving my lexus so much my other cars were becoming obsolete.

Now its a thread about global warming, who's to blame, government deception and cambelt costs.

Better think before posting such jocular musings in the future

[Bluesman]

Gosh, Lexus owners really clever !

They know more about climate change than the IPCC, NASA, the UN, the US Global Change Research Program, the Arctic Climate Impact Assessment, and the HUGE majority of scientists in the fields of Physical, Chemical, Meteorological, Oceanographical, and Paleoclimatological sciences.

I guess it's just coincidence that the 13 warmest years ever, globally, have occured this century (which is only 14 years old) - at the same time as the level of atmospheric CO2 is higher than at any time in the last 20 million years ?

I'm not tree-huggy about this, after all I do drive a 4.3 litre car, but I do think it's time to stop denying it and perhaps take some responsibilty.

Of course the IPCC, NASA, the UN, the US Global Change Research Program, the Arctic Climate Impact Assessment, and the HUGE majority of scientists in the fields of Physical, Chemical, Meteorological, Oceanographical, and Paleoclimatological sciences and many other agencies too many to list are all on message because they are making huge fortunes out of it. If you are happy believing what they tell you then thats fair enough.

As LS owners especially those who run their cars on LPG do more for looking after this planet than those who drive around in Toyota Prius's and others like it thinking they are doing wonderful things for the planet, that is of course if you dont factor in the amount of polution created in making their cars in the first place especially the batteries and of course the the pollution caused once these batteries have reached the end of their lives, they are driving a lie. Keeping a car like the LS in good condition, serviced regularly, running on LPG is the greenest thing you can do. You bet us Lexus owners are cleaver.

Mike

What started the last ice age?

Mike

[Malc]

It's great to have a jocular debating chamber, after all, the Houses of Parliament do it every day !!! .... unless they're in Recess, when the buggers sod off on their jets and limos to enjoy the fruits of their labours spending their gotten gains on fine wine and dining and gaz guzzlers I'm sure.

Ho hum ................ let's enjoy our cars whilst we can, doubtless any Govt will find a way to curtail our limited pleasures soon enuf !

Malc

[Anthony B]

I guess we should stop the climate change debate on this site and get on with enjoying our cars. Thanks for the entertainment.

Anthony

[Cotswold Pete]

I guess we should stop the climate change debate on this site and get on with enjoying our cars. Thanks for the entertainment.

Anthony

The problem is that the LS is generally so reliable that we have to occupy our time with life rather than worrying about why the car is falling apart and failing each MOT.

Maybe we need to invent some problems for LS owners to discuss.

My problem is that you cannot fix a roof rack to LS400, any ideas??? then I could put my bike on the roof drive to somewhere nice like the Peak District and pootle up and down the Monsal Trail.

[Titch LS]

Hear hear. Climate change = endless debate. Enjoying one's LS = no debate.

[Gbneil]

My tuppence worth...like him or not, the al gore film I felt was particularly well balanced, does not deny that warming is cyclical,,but points out how much more warming etc has been caused by people and actually shows in idiot proof terms how, and why...it's easy to dismiss people like him as failed politicians and drum bangers with their own agenda BUT.."gore was independently wealthy before his political failure...he will be financially secure thru his pension as ex vp of America also....and it is pretty much political suicide what he continues to do..so I doubt it's self serving....if you haven't watched it please don't judge on the other knee jerk reactionary stuff that has been made. It's a grown up film with honest, clear opinions and facts.

Perhaps this is a bit contentious for some but I honestly believe that global warning deniers will become as historically decried as holocaust deniers. This is happening.....can we stop it...NO....can we slow it down and try to get it back to its natural, cyclical rhythm...yes, to an extent....the Kyoto treaty etc...is important and the fact that America still had not ratified it in 2008 is indicative of the land of the free's wholesale disrespect for everyone else's freedom....but then, we knew that, didn't we...

As for wind farms etc, I don't know enough to argue but from what I have read, I broadly agree with you bluesman, this is blind alley technology and akin to shutting the gate after the horse has bolted...the real futer lies in renewables, perhaps tidal energy generation and wind power does contribute, but not nearly to the level that some would have us believe....the technological advances made by diesel and petrol engineers is incredible, and electric cars have made bounds that make our present cars slow evolution from Karl Benz' first horseless carriages to the Maclaren p1 akin to the progress of a one legged man in the world ***** kicking championship....ie slow, and unsteady....if electric vehicles keep improving at this rate they will become viable for all

Now, im off to have a 50 mph , 36 mpg cruise in my ls400 and LI will feel good because I am not contributing to the created man made consumer cycle....

[Malc]

OK guys, Wind Farms ............ . I know, from reading an official report that was for public consumption a few years ago before they put the 25 or so turbines onto the Romney Marsh in Kent. A short, hidden almost paragraph that said, quite simply: In the event that you live within a mile ( I think that was it, or maybe 3 miles ) then you would be susceptible to carcinogenic thermals created by the turbines movement.

That is potential death inflicting today rather than an overall later effect for the population of global warming, new ice-age or whatever.

And that was fact at the time, don't doubt it's still pertinent today. And I don't doubt that it is totally glossed over by whomsoever as something just " not nice " to know.

Malc

[goldtop]

"Carcinogenic thermals"?

(insert pic of Roger Moore with one raised eyebrow here)

[Gbneil]

Yup, wind farms need to be offshore or in areas with no population....in the wind....top of mountains etc haha...cancer has been linked to high powered electrical cables etc also....power comes with it's own problems.....sometimes we should remember, power is nothing without control and with great power comes the need for responsibly....

[goldtop]

There may be links between some types of electromagnetic field and cancer. But I want to know about carcinogenic thermals from the blades' movement at 1-3 miles.

I've got an open mind, but my spidey senses are telling me this one's BS.

[Titch LS]

All I know is that since the world went 'green' our Government sees 'environmental issues' as a heaven-sent opportunity to tax us to death. I'm still convinced that mankind's contribution to any global warming events are miniscule and the effects grossly exaggerated. It's scare-mongering at the highest level. Russian climatologists say a mini ice-age is on the way. Enjoy your LS before the blizzards arrive, that's what I say!

[Malc]

Gentlemen:

Wind farms and carcinogenic thermals

I was a parish councillor and school governor in Brookland on the Romney Marsh at the time. The Thesis/Paper/Report was that which was commissioned by the business developing the Wind Farm and was a huge publication left within the church ( the only publicly open place ) for all and everybody to read.

An enormous tome and maybe I was the only person to read it but that I did. AND furthermore that statement was duly hidden in the depths of the tome, more or less a throw away paragraph BUT it was there and clearly just accepted by planners and whomsoever.

These Wind Farms are potentially dangerous places to live within/close/near to....... unless there's been convenient subsequent changes to the science

I certainly won't ever do so.

It's interesting the number of HM Prisons where wind turbines are situated !! Def not BS goldtop

Malc

[goldtop]

Malc, if you can provide links/sources, I'd be interested.

Infrasound is real, and may be related to ill health. Alas, the activists seize on bad science too readily and that undermines credibility.

But I repeat, "carcinogenic thermals" is a dubious phenomenon at best. Perhaps you've misremembered it, because there are no hits at all for it on any Web search.

[Malc]

Heavens, wow, it was some time ago now, possibly about 1998 maybe. I know that the wind turbines were installed after 2005 on the Romney Marsh, we were trying to get the builders to use our facilities for storage of the hardware prior to installation, and that was from Dec 2005 thru to June 2007.

I think they were on farmer Clifton's site, just outside of Lydd.

The tome would no doubt have been archived by the developers or whomsoever.

Rest assured that I did really really read that about carcinogenic thermals and absolutely no-one was prepared to take one jot of notice of me. The phraseology was buried in the depths of the tome, a proper and officially prepared huge document, left for public appraisal ( not for discussion tho' if I remember ) in the local church. A village with a populatlon of only@500 at the time...... clearly a published paper ( maybe that was their legal obligation ? ) but with very limited public awareness .... wonder why !!!

Malc

[Gbneil]

I read many moons ago that this wind turbine syndrome type complaint was in fact widely, if not wholly discredited...this is the problem for the layman...we read something that sounds plausible and if we are willing to believe it, or it fits with our general belief, we will belief it as gospel....I know I am guilty of thois to some extent with 'an inconvenient truth' for instance....some will be at the opposite end of the spectrum. As far as I recall, wind farms could be said to be responsible for sleeplessness and minor breathing ailments that are manifested through a type of motion sickness, but I nothing like cancer. Even gore' s people's advice was a windfarm should be at least 2 miles from any settlement...

Anyhow, how are we all enjoying our lexus?....

[Malc]

Always as ever ....... I promise not to park it near a wind turbine,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, promise

Malc

[Bluesman]

For those of you who have driven past Reading there is a windmill at a new commercial estate called Green Park estate. You can pass that windmill on days when there isnt a whisper of wind or breeze around and yet mysteriously the blades are going round, how can this be? have they invented a type of windmill that still goes round even on days when there is no wind? No, its powered by electricity from the national grid, it has never produced electricity of any quantity its like the rest of the green rubbish, its a lie.

It does amaze me that as a country we dont ask questions of out lord and masters, we just accept whatever they say as true with this type of mindset come apathy and this is demonstrated by the huge numbers who cant even be bothered to vote.

We get what we deserve. Mike

[Gbneil]

One surely can't make sweeping generalisations like that....I'm sure much of what we hear or read is rubbish, just as much of the propaganda pit forward by naysayers is funded by oil companies etc....there is truth on both sides for sure....wind turbines can be productive but seem to blind alley technology for now....this does not make the rest of the green agenda to be rubbish, does it?....I am not knowledgeable enough to argue for or against but for me, the arguments I have seen for a against as far as I understand suggest that yes, global warming is cyclical, yes there have been ice ages and heat waves before, but yes, mankind is significantly shortening the space between these by our actions.....

It's easy to say oh well, this won't happen for millions of years....but what I like to think is, if our lifespans encompassed this amount of time....or put more simply, if our sons and daughters lifespan WAS millions of years,,would we not take greater care/have taken greater care of our environment....it's not easy to become impassioned about something that may or may not affect future generations who we will never know.....but what of it was your own kids?....I reckon we would sit up and take a bit more notice

NB, it's not just cars, energy etc...it's irrigation, deforestation, crop growing etc..etc...for which there are NO easy answers....but this does not mean we should ignore it....