The high price of style and sophistication

Barry14UK · February 6, 2020

I was reading the thread which mentioned the need to change a complete headlamp in the event of a bulb failure and the very high cost of doing so and also having looked into it the amount of work necessary to make the change. Furthermore, if we go back to cars of a few decades ago a failed headlamp bulb was something most people could readily do, even where it involved changing a sealed beam unit. Of course headlights have improved considerably over the years and this is most welcome and they have also become more stylish but all at considerable cost. This is true of other manufacturers too but I do question whether more uniformity and better standardization as well as easier installation/replacement and being able to just replace a bulb could be achieved if there was the wish to do so. But altering the shape of headlights and grilles is a relatively easy way for manufacturers to carry out a 'Face Lift', help sales until a much changed new model is marketed.

Headlights are of course only one item and one can think of many things that have changed which have been of great benefit, improvement in braking systems, and to suspension systems, power steering, safety features of various kinds and to engine efficiency and management and transmission systems being the main ones. Also, air conditioning has become pretty standard along with ever more sophisticated infotainment systems. So if you want all this you have to expect to pay for it but why should parts that are essentially the same be so much more expensive now even allowing for currency depreciation and devaluation? It is understood that there are more components to house under the bonnet such as aircon compressor fan and radiator, ABS unit, power steering reservoir and pump although this can partially be offset by relocating the Battery in the boot. Notwithstanding this, when it comes to replaceing a component, so many other parts frequently have to be removed to facilitate this. It is almost as if the car is designed to provide extra time for mechanics to do this. (I appreciate additional space is required to accommodate the hybrid system but the same applies to the non hybrid system when it comes to changing the rear plugs of the rear bank for instance.) Then there is extraordinary time and cost involved in replacing a water pump as discussed on another thread. I contrasted this with my experience on a MK2 Humber Septre I had about 46 years ago. We were about to go away on holiday and I had done all my checks the previous day. I started the car and noticed a small amount of water on the drive as a few last minute things were loaded. A slight trickle was coming from the water pump. Luckily Grimes at Coulsdon who stocked Humber parts were only about 15 minutes walk from where I lived at the time and I purchased a new pump and fitted it and was ready to go within the hour. I also got a allowance for my old pump in due course. My car lacked power steering, air con and electric windows and just had a radio. It was an automatic with solid rear axle and leaf springs. I replaced the standard carb with a Webber and it would cruise comfortably at an indicated 85mph, probably a genuine 80mph. (It had disk brakes up front). Apart from normal maintenance the only other thing I replaced was a noisy universal joint on the prop shaft. How simple it was in those days! My car was in a fairly dark metallic green. My father had the same model in maroon. It was an attractive car in it's day and still better looking than some even today. Here is a red example of the model when cars were so much easier to work on. It shows various aspects. Almost every car I have had since has become progressively more complicated and difficult to work on and require more tools. http://mrdarcysclassics.com/car-classified/preview.php?controller=pjListings&action=pjActionView&id=39

katabrontes · February 6, 2020

I can echo this! I remember having a water pump fail on a Ford Transit based motor caravan in France in about 1978. After topping up a few times to keep going we found a Ford agent in Valence who had the part but could not fit it quickly. They lent me a few spanners and I fitted the new pump on the forecourt. it took about 45 minutes. I don't remember how much it cost but it didn't seem much at the time.Happy days.

rich1068 · February 6, 2020

I've not owned a Lexus newer than 2006 ('02 IS, '06 RX, '02 GS) but I have been struck by how much easier they are to work on for basic jobs. I can't imagine they're as straightforward as your Sceptre but compare with newer vehicles or European vehicles of the same period and you quickly notice the difference. Thought has actually gone into how general maintenance tasks are carried out. Obviously there are always jobs that are a complete arse but try changing a headlight bulb on an '05 Volvo V70 and you'll know what I mean.

I'm not sure which thread you're referring to that required the headlight to be replaced but I assume it's one of the newer Lexus with fancy LEDs or somesuch? Sadly this nonsense is becoming more prevalent.

Delphius1 · February 6, 2020

I know that some of the modern LED adaptive headlamp units being fitted to cars these days can cost North of £1000 per unit and you have to replace the whole unit, not replaceable bulbs. Eye-watering. And they're not just fitted to high-end cars. If you're buying a new car these days, it may be a prudent thing before you buy to walk into the spares dept of the dealer and attempt to order something a low-flying Pheasant is liable to take out on it's Kamikaze run across the road.

Headlamps, fog lamps and Daytime running lights, cruise control radar, the grille and possibly mirrors.

As cars get more complicated and these parts move to being motorised, or include sensors, cameras and the like, it's worth checking how much that technology costs if you need to replace it.

Barry14UK · February 6, 2020

8 hours ago, Delphius1 said:

I know that some of the modern LED adaptive headlamp units being fitted to cars these days can cost North of £1000 per unit and you have to replace the whole unit, not replaceable bulbs. Eye-watering. And they're not just fitted to high-end cars. If you're buying a new car these days, it may be a prudent thing before you buy to walk into the spares dept of the dealer and attempt to order something a low-flying Pheasant is liable to take out on it's Kamikaze run across the road.

Headlamps, fog lamps and Daytime running lights, cruise control radar, the grille and possibly mirrors.

As cars get more complicated and these parts move to being motorised, or include sensors, cameras and the like, it's worth checking how much that technology costs if you need to replace it.

Now there's a thought! In the event of an accident Insurers often insist on new parts being fitted (pattern parts if they can get away with it but still much more expensive than buying parts from breakers). This results in the very high cost of replacement parts and of fitting them so many good cars are written written off or repaired at great cost. The cost of all this is reflected in the high insurance premiums we have to pay, so we pay again for sophistication.

As regards the cost of a new headlamp for an RX, this was mentioned in this thread :-

I did a search to find what was involved in replacing a headlamp and after extensive searching found a helpful video but failed to bookmark. It looked more involved than I expected.

Unfortunately, I double posted this thread so have asked the Moderators if they would consolidate into one.

Garth-1 · February 7, 2020

I know it's not helpful to Lexus owners, but if you want the right combination of driveability and simplicity you can't beat my wife's MX5 Mk2 (10th Anniversary edition). It has everything you need but nothing you don't. I've just checked my service records and in the last 12 years I've only needed the assistance of a garage/workshop twice - totalling £400. I've been able to do everything else myself, very economically.

Malc · February 7, 2020

9 hours ago, Garth-1 said:

I know it's not helpful to Lexus owners, but if you want the right combination of driveability and simplicity

My Mk3 Ls400 fills that criteria for sure .......... simplicity itself, driveability, reliability AND availability of simple cost effective spares ............ incl a £4.50 headlamp bulb every 20 years or so :wink3: