Livelihood & Liberty

[JMRussell]

I'm probably opening a can of worms but am sitting here thinking I should be going to march but there are things on in my village today that need support too. I'm not pro hunting but I'd never stop those who want to do it. It's about the liberty to do what you want to do, when you want to without interferring with other people. Take Germany as an example they are not even allowed to have fishing competitions any more!

What a quandry 'to march or not to march' got about an hour left to decide.:?:

[Rodders_UK]

I guess it depends whether you think that marching will utlimately affect the outcome or not.

[JMRussell]

Like the wife says they're not going to miss one person but as I say I will know!

Will it make a difference I don't know but not doing anything certainly won't.

I'm going - decision made.

[Rodders_UK]

Have a nice day!:bounce:

[DaveEllen]

I went on the first two protests which were really good (lived in the countryside then) live in London now so will pop along later on.

Think its about more than fox hunting.

[Brian Berry]

I live close to the New Forest. How so called civilised people can mount a horse, go chasing a fox over open countryside and take pleasure in seeing the poor animal killed is beyond my comprehension.

I have seen the hunt in action and it is not a very nice sight.The demonstration is anti govt and is more than just hunting.

[JMRussell]

I too went on the rally and 1st March March and they were good. If it was just about hunting I would not be there even though I have sheep and have seen what foxes can do at lambing time. There are plenty of other ways of controlling foxes (all just as unpleasant for the fox if not worse) but done quietly out of the public eye.

Probably it is anti government though I prefer to think pro freedom of choice.

Anyway I went; it was worth the 3 hour queue just to start just to be with so many good humoured well behaved people.

[Brian Berry]

I agree that the fox must be controlled. It is the open spectacle of the hunt glorifying violent acts under the umbrella that it is a legitimate 'sport' that gets me.

[Rodders_UK]

Yeah - it makes me mad when I hear all these people complaining that they will lose their jobs if hunting is banned - I bet no-one complained about putting the Nazis on the dole!!!

[UltraViolet]

Originally posted by JMRussell

It's about the liberty to do what you want to do, when you want to without interferring with other people.

I'm sorry - but I disagree. There are many things we would all agree are wrong, but some sicko would argue "It's about the liberty to do what you want to do" - Coccain users? Dog fights? Child abusers?

I am not putting hunting in the same class - but I am sure you see what I mean.

The fox population declined during the war years (when there was no hunting), nature has her own way of exercising control. Plus the amount of foxes bred for the hunt go against this argument.

I think the fact that people are killing for pleasure is what sickens. When you delve deeper and learn more about how the dogs are trained, cubbing, and the life span of the hunting dog - it doesn't get any prettier.

Anyway - I don't think we should discuss political issues on here - not the place and issues like this tend to get heated.

[JMRussell]

Anyway - I don't think we should discuss political issues on here - not the place and issues like this tend to get heated.

I wholeheartedly agree with this and apologise for starting the thread. Just for the record I do not hunt and do not allow the hunt on my land. I used to do a lot of shooting but said I would never shoot unless I knew all the birds shot were going to be eaten. I haven't shot now for 6 years because I felt the sport was being taken out of it in favour of big bags. I do however manage my land with wildlife in mind and understand the value of game management.

[DaveEllen]

Don't think an apology is required as you did'nt get on your soap box.......Its called free speech !

I agree with the "leave us alone" argument & the comments made by HRH re ethnic minorities.......but am against fox hunting 100%.......Bit unsporting to have someone drive around blocking up all the fox holes in the area they propose to hunt over........Interested in your comments on shooting as I've been a beater for 20 years now working my dogs (lab & JRT) for the pleasure of seeing them work (travel 300 miles {round trip}to dorset evry w/end in the season !) Every shoot I've been on is family run with at most 100 bird days I hear about the commercial shoots and squirm.........

[JMRussell]

Originally posted by DaveEllen

Don't think an apology is required as you did'nt get on your soap box.......Its called free speech !

I agree with the "leave us alone" argument & the comments made by HRH re ethnic minorities.......but am against fox hunting 100%.......Bit unsporting to have someone drive around blocking up all the fox holes in the area they propose to hunt over........Interested in your comments on shooting as I've been a beater for 20 years now working my dogs (lab & JRT) for the pleasure of seeing them work (travel 300 miles {round trip}to dorset evry w/end in the season !) Every shoot I've been on is family run with at most 100 bird days I hear about the commercial shoots and squirm.........

A man after my own heart. I always used to sleeve my gun once we reached 100 but it is the commercial pressures. I used to work Gordon Setters on Grouse moors in Wales in spare time. To watch dogs working that far in front used to scare guns silly until they saw them set the birds. Image the horror down in my neck of the woods when I used them on shoots for partridge!

I feel good just remembering but my best dog died young and I decided not to replace her and never have.

As an aside if the proposed bill becomes law you would be breaking the law. 2 dogs working is classed as hunting with dogs! It's not just the hunts with horses that are hit.

[DaveEllen]

watching a well schooled dog always brings a smile to my face.

The shoot I go to had Max Hastings as a guest gun last year.........He had a really nice Lab but got a bit fed up when the picker ups dog kept nicking his birds !

If i remember right Setters are not long lived...pity as they are lovely !

5 weeks before the first days beating !! hope the sun shines.....

[JMRussell]

[

5 weeks before the first days beating !! hope the sun shines.....

Go for it.

[Claire G]

I'm anti-hunting but agree the Liberty&Livelihood issue extends to much more than that, and to that end, the demonstrators have my backing.

Quick question though, to those who say banning hunting will kill their jobs etc. what about 'drag' hunting. Isn't that where there is still a hunt on horseback using dogs, just without the fox being chased? Not sure I understand it completely but if people still want to hunt I can't see any difference using this method - just that the fox doesn't get mauled at the end.

Foxes do need to be controlled, but surely shooting is more humane and less stressful for the animal :?:

[dazzab69]

I think Will Self made the most eloquent comment on all of this in last week's Evening Standard.

He pointed out that the Tweed wearing mob are the most subsidised individuals in the country and that they and their political flunkies actively participated in the destruction of many of Britain's industries in the 1980's.

Now it's their turn to feel a bit of pain because they're no longer "economically viable" they don't like it.

I agree it's a shame that some people will lose their jobs as a result of this, but I assume that the braying-classes will find an alternative way to spend their weekends and money, so I guess that those people will find another job.