Is My Caliper Sticking?

[is200 Newbie]

On the old IS200 I had there was an emerging issue with a noise that sounded like it was from the front of the car but actually it was from the rear - there is a You Tube video that someone recorded in the states and it showed the noise that was spot on to the noise I experienced in mine - would be noticeable round corners and this started as a sort of ticking noise and progressed louder to a squeal.

It was found to be coming from the groove in the disc where the dust shield sat on the rear brake disc. All that was involved to get rid of the noise was to clean the groove out as it became, over time, rusted up and also the dust shield did the same in that it rusted up also. Cleaning with a dremil / wire brush / sand paper did the trick.

You would need to check this model to see if it had the same set up but it could be the problem??

[Ishaq]

Thanks Newbie...I will use your guide on removing calipers and grease slide pins this weekend.

Just another question on bleeding brakes...do you leave the reservoir cap on or take it off whole bleeding.

Thanks

[is200 Newbie]

You need to take it off as you need to add fluid during the process but don't run the reservoir dry. Just rest the cap on top of the resoviour to stop any dirt getting in.Do one depress of the pedal and check the level and top up if required, repeating as you go along. The cap on the reservoir is only a rubber push on / pull off type (not a screw on one.

Other people may have other ways of doing this but I have done it this way for years. Make sure you have a small funnel to pour the fluid into the reservoir as its quite easy to get the brake fluid on your bodywork if pouring from the bottle.

[Ishaq]

Thanks I was going to buy a one man kit from Halfords for £5

http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductMobileDisplay?catalogId=10151&storeId=10001&productId=204703&categoryId=255216&langId=-1

[is200 Newbie]

I use something similar - a one way check valve. Easier to do yourself without relying on someone elses help.

Let us know how you get on. What type of grease are you using?

[Ishaq]

I will be using CarLube copper grease. Got off eBay http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/170665120477?nav=SEARCH

To be honest I have never done anything like this before but really want to give it a go as I really want to do small bits and possibly service my one car.

So Newbie am I right that to grease the slide pins I only need to remove and access the caliper and no need to remove the carrier.

[johnatg]

I don't really understand how the pad guide pin can be tightened - it's just a push fit in the caliper. It is very easy to distort the pin hold clip when removing it - it's worth reshaping it with a pair of pliers before putting it back - usually the ends need bending in a bit to make the angle more acute. It should be quite hard to locate into the holes in the pins - if it's too easy, it will come out in service!

Before you remove the pins, look carefully at how the anti-squeal spring fits - otherwise you'll be puzzling about how it goes back!

You can remove the pads once you have taken the pins out - the pads need a bit of winkling to get them out. Now remove the upper (no 1) cylinder slide pin. The caliper should now rotate easily until the caliper is clear of the disc, then push it off the no 2 lower pin - if it's stiff, or if you can't push the caliper off the no 2 pin, you've got problems - it is the no 2 pin which seizes in the recess in the caliper.

One man brake bleeding is easy - you don't need any kits. The secret is to have the bottle into which you're bleeding fluid above the level of the bleed nipple - I put my catch bottle on a step stool next to the wheel arch. Then the pipe from the nipple to your catch bottle runs upwards. You need to secure the end of the pipe into the bottle - I use a bit of old brake pipe bent and hooked over the rim of the catch bottle.

Now when you release the brake pedal, some fluid runs back from the pipe into the caliper, but the bubbles have all gone the other way. Bubbles always run upwards - into the catch tank with my way, but into the caliper if you have the catch bottle below the nipple. Just be careful the bottle doesn't fall off the step stool or whatever!

There is indeed a drum brake system, but it's only used for the parking brake (cable operated) - the shoes shouldn't wear - you should only apply the brake when stationary.

The foot brake uses the disc brake (only).

[is200 Newbie]

Copper grease is the wrong type to use - its too abrasive and will soon turn into a dry sludge mess (when taking your pads off have a look at the squeal shims and this will be the result of using this type of grease on the pins - you will see how unsuitable it is.)

I used to use Castrol LM but have recently purchased the proper stuff from Lexus Birmingham at £10 a tube but worth it when you think it can save you up to £1000+ if your callipers seize. It can also be used for your next re-grease.

I posted a guide on how to re-grease the calipers (both front and backs) - you will need to remove the rear caliper , not just swing it out of the way to grease both pins.

Its honestly not a hard job and wont take you more than 20 mins per side if you take your time. Once you have done it you will realise how easy it is to do, As its your first time then just take your time.

As John has said above about the pins and remembering how they go back - if you take a photo of how they are on the caliper then you will have no issue in remembering the way they go back in.

[Exdee]

I think the OEM grease from Lexus is not up for the job either based on how the calipers still keep seizing even after alleged improvements in design.

I would recommend using something like the Pagid/Mintex Ceratec which, if you read up on it is an entirely different approach to lubricant for brakes. It's more of a gel than a grease.

I used it when I serviced my brakes last year and no problems so far.

[Ishaq]

Cool, wont use the copper grease then.

Pagid Ceratec is on sale at eurocarparts for £2.62, so will get that.

Exdee, did you use it ion the slider pins aswell? Thanks

Guys on a scale of 1-10 how hard is lubing the caliper slider pins 10 being the hardest

[Exdee]

Yeah, I used it on the sliding pins, the clips that the pads slide on, on the inside of the shims and a slight dab around the piston inside the caliper.

You will spend most of your time jacking the car up, removing the caliper and carrier, trying to break free any seized components and removing rust (hope not!!).

The lubing only take a minute so I would say it's probably a 1. :)

[johnatg]

I guess about a 2, but depends on experience - brake jobs need care and knowledge!

But if the no 2 slide pin is seriously seized, you're way up the scale. It can need a new caliper in the worst case. If you can get the caliper off the pin, you can clean the pin and the recess and lube as discussed.

Should a new caliper be needed, check prices with your Lexus dealer - there are special offers on them!

Now we're all waiting with bated breath.......!

[Ishaq]

I guess about a 2, but depends on experience - brake jobs need care and knowledge!

Now we're all waiting with bated breath.......!

Haha!! I guess I will just start early in the morning and just take my time...also its an excuss not to hit the shopping mall with wifey!! (usual for saturdays)

So all my tools have arrived (wrench, rachet sets), need to get the lube tomorrow (pagid ceratec) and then hope its not raining

I would say my automotive DIY skills is around 3-4 on a scale of 1-10...remember when I installed the folding mirrors with Exdee. Man he was so calm and relaxed and taking his time step by step...while I just ripped through the door couldnt wait to get it working and rushing..LOL

[ChumpusRex]

The Pagid Cera tec is a conventional mineral oil grease, and so is not recommended for calipers and sliders, because it will accelerate the degradation of the rubber.

In practice, it's not really a big deal, as long as you inspect the rubbers regularly, and replace when getting brittle.

The recommended lubricants for slider pins are either a pure silicone grease (offers some, but not optimal protection), or preferably a polyalkylene glycol grease specifically formulated for caliper slider pins. (e.g. the toyota grease).

[is200 Newbie]

I have used the Castrol LM grease for the past 4 years on the caliper pins - I haven't had any issues with it in seizures of the callipers but what I have noticed is that it will attack the rubber boots etc in a way where they will lose their elasticity and hence the rubber boots wont seal onto the recesses on the pins letting dirt / water through. I now have new calipers all round and while I have used the Castrol on them I have recently purchased the proper stuff from Lexus which they describe as a Rubber Grease so I will be replacing the grease on mine soon with this grease.

Picture of this with the part number is on the post I made for cleaning the pins

[is200 Newbie]

ISHAQ ... how did you get on?

[Ishaq]

ISHAQ ... how did you get on?

Hi Newbie...the weather let me down this weekend.

However I did see that my rear driverside is gone. I had new pads on about 2 months ago. This is possible where the whoop whoop whoop noise is coming from.

I have attached photos. So the plan is now to buy new disc and pads from Lexus Edingburugh eBay. I will then attempt to do everything together...I suspect that the rear caliper must be the problem but making me to believe it's the front drivers side.

[johnatg]

Yep - that's a disc due for replacement. You'll need to replace both sides. But I would check the calipers before you go much further - see if they are seized. Frankly, I'd be a bit surprised if they aren't at least stiff to rotate - but you can bring them back from there - it's only if you can't move them at all you've got real problems.

You probably don't need to get the pads out to check that - just undo and remove the top pin, then see if the caliper will rotate a bit.

That looks like a solid disc?

[Ishaq]

I am not getting any heat from that particular wheel nor am I getting any heat from anymore the wheels so I do hope that I am in time for just a caliper service and lubing rather than a replacement.

Will double check thou, shame the weather is not allowing me to do much here in London

[is200 Newbie]

As with Johns comments - they look shot !

While you are ordering the discs, order the rubber grease also for the slide pins ... £10 for a toothpaste sized tube from Lexus.

If you have trouble in moving the calliper after removing the top pin then apply some heat to the slide pins housing - do not apply excessive heat - as you are heating it up try moving the calliper at the same time. It will definitely loosen, be patient (it should move downwards, pivoting on the other pin). I have used a plumbing blow torch (small flame) in the past and it has freed up a set of these on mine. The old grease will have gone to gunk and will hold the pin in like adhesive. In heating it a bit then it will help to breakdown the grease and free up the pin from its housing

It might be worth your while also purchasing a set of drum pads as you have no idea what state they are in without taking the disc off. While you have the disc off you may as well change them as they wont need doing again for quite some time. Peace of mind really.

If they have seized make sure to give them a really good clean as you don't want to strip them down again in a few weeks time.

While you have the wheel off write down the stamped number on the calliper as I have found there are two types of callipers for these cars (two differing part numbers) - write it in your handbook. It will be handy in the future.

Another tip - this is something I have always done and its up to you whether you do it or not ..., is to, while you have the wheel off is to spray all the moving parts with WD40. Things like rubber mountings / nuts etc as I feel it helps for future work on the car if needed??

Also, one last thing, if the calliper has seized and not knowing how long it has been like that for it will be worth your while in checking the bearings as the excess heat a seized calliper creates is unbelievable and may have damaged the lubrication on the bearings. Just check for play when the wheel is back on or a rumble noise sounding like the bearings are dry

If you are not sure about the disassembly of it, takes some pictures first so you can reference when re-assembling

[Ishaq]

Thanks I have enquired about the lube at edinburugh as they are the cheapest for the disc, mind you Birmingham ain't that bad either with their price.

[aly-g]

ishaq, if you need calipers for the rear of your car , Lexus Sheffield were selling on fleabay for £99.00 each side which i think is a pretty good price....my offside rear caliper was seized solid so i replaced both sides just to keep the balance, the parking brake shoes should be ok, probably just need cleaning up , thats all mine required.......

Allan

[Ishaq]

Thanks Allan.

Seen the caliper for £99 in Lexus Sheffield so this is one watch list.

Took the car for a drive on the A12 able to hit 50-60mph. Came back home. Inspected all the wheels and they where all cold and ok heat whatsoever. I hope that I do t have a big caliper change bill. Fingers X

Will let you guys know how I get on and what the outcome is.

Thanks for all your help....

[Ishaq]

Hhhmm....Solid or Vented rear disc?

Will have to check when I go home tonight.

[aly-g]

Ishaq, looking at the pictures you posted the rear discs look like solid discs.....

Allan