I appreciate what everyone is saying here on this forum and all help is much appreciated, however i will say that this particular issue is not something i have ever heard of or even come across before. I do not intent to ignore or not follow people's advice, however it can be very challenging getting different opinions on the same issue and when my pocket does not allow too. I spoke to a mechanic who would charge me £100 to look at my car and find the problem then would try keep the cost downs with parts etc, will have to see what to do but please understand that it is upsetting for this to occur just 3 months into ownership.

3 hours ago, b4u2 said:

but please understand that it is upsetting for this to occur just 3 months into ownership.

I’ve only just come across this latest saga of woe in the history of your Lexus ownership, but there are a couple of questions that I think you have yet to answer.

Namely, from whom did you buy the car and how much did you pay?  For a start, it doesn’t sound like it came with a full service history and a bundle of service receipts!

If it was a cheap purchase from a private seller, then unfortunately the principle of caveat emptor applies.  If it was from a trade source, then you might have some means of redress or compensation.  But the time to take action is now!

As a general principle, if you have to buy an older car to run on a limited budget, you’re better off choosing, for example, a Ford.

 

6 hours ago, b4u2 said:

I appreciate what everyone is saying here on this forum and all help is much appreciated, however i will say that this particular issue is not something i have ever heard of or even come across before. I do not intent to ignore or not follow people's advice, however it can be very challenging getting different opinions on the same issue and when my pocket does not allow too. I spoke to a mechanic who would charge me £100 to look at my car and find the problem then would try keep the cost downs with parts etc, will have to see what to do but please understand that it is upsetting for this to occur just 3 months into ownership.

When you looked at the car did you take a check list with you? 

 

7 hours ago, b4u2 said:

I appreciate what everyone is saying here on this forum and all help is much appreciated, however i will say that this particular issue is not something i have ever heard of or even come across before. I do not intent to ignore or not follow people's advice, however it can be very challenging getting different opinions on the same issue and when my pocket does not allow too. I spoke to a mechanic who would charge me £100 to look at my car and find the problem then would try keep the cost downs with parts etc, will have to see what to do but please understand that it is upsetting for this to occur just 3 months into ownership.

Totally understand and empathise with you. As you have just bought the car. But it is a fairly common problem on aging lexuses even on relatively newer models like the gen3 IS. 

As others have pointed out already. The unfortunate reality is that no matter how reliable or well maintained a car is moving parts will eventually wear out. When buying an 18 year old car you would normally go into it with the expectation that being a lexus it will mostly work and get you from A to B but these types of niggles will keep cropping up and normally people buying older cars either DIY what they can... find hacks... just live with it...or set aside money for things like this when buying the car. 

As far has hacky low cost solutions go. Maybe get a 12v heater like this. The reviews are mixed so please do your own research before buying one... On the bright side they're just a tenner 

https://amzn.eu/d/gR6cYGh

Also buy 2 1kg bags of silica gel to absorb moisture and place it on the dash. I use this to prevent condensation on the rear glass in my car during winters and its worked well for me. 

Hopefully this helps. 

Tested everything in the car without an official checklist. 

44 minutes ago, b4u2 said:

Tested everything in the car without an official checklist. 

Private or dealer sale?

46 minutes ago, Bluemarlin said:

Private or dealer sale?

Dealer. But he told me clearly that 

From the seller:

Anything to do with heating / air flow is not covered under the bronze policy - the policy only only covers major engine / gearbox components due to major mechanical failure.

34 minutes ago, b4u2 said:

Dealer. But he told me clearly that 

From the seller:

Anything to do with heating / air flow is not covered under the bronze policy - the policy only only covers major engine / gearbox components due to major mechanical failure.

How long ago did you buy it?

2 hours ago, NemesisUK said:

How long ago did you buy it?

24 April 

55 minutes ago, b4u2 said:

24 April 

You have consumer rights on your side. Up to 6 months it's down to the dealer to prove the fault wasn't there when purchased. The dealer has the responsibility to fix it. After 6 month the onus is on the buyer to prove it was.

Take it back and ask them to fix it.

Follow the online tool from the Citizens Advice...

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/buying-or-repairing-a-car/problems-with-a-used-car/

 

23 minutes ago, NemesisUK said:

You have consumer rights on your side. Up to 6 months it's down to the dealer to prove the fault wasn't there when purchased. The dealer has the responsibility to fix it. After 6 month the onus is on the buyer to prove it was.

Take it back and ask them to fix it.

Follow the online tool from the Citizens Advice...

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/buying-or-repairing-a-car/problems-with-a-used-car/

 

Thank you.

The fault was not there at the time of sale though.

3 minutes ago, b4u2 said:

Thank you.

The fault was not there at the time of sale though.

Did you bother to follow the link I posted? If you did you would have read the following...

"Because you bought the car in the last 6 months, the law says it must have been faulty when you bought it."

20 minutes ago, b4u2 said:

The fault was not there at the time of sale though

How do you know?  Did you go through a check list with the Dealer?  Obviously the Dealer made no mention of it but that doesn’t mean they weren’t aware of it.

The fact that you didn’t spot it before purchase is not necessarily relevant because you’re not an expert are you?  You’re relying on the honesty and expertise of the Dealer.

If you’re a member of the AA/RAC they can be very helpful in sorting out recalcitrant Dealers!

2 hours ago, LenT said:

How do you know?  Did you go through a check list with the Dealer?  Obviously the Dealer made no mention of it but that doesn’t mean they weren’t aware of it.

The fact that you didn’t spot it before purchase is not necessarily relevant because you’re not an expert are you?  You’re relying on the honesty and expertise of the Dealer.

If you’re a member of the AA/RAC they can be very helpful in sorting out recalcitrant Dealers!

Hi Len,

Because i used the airflow controls and the direct of vents worked fine. I did test the car out before purchase and it all seemed to work.

3 hours ago, NemesisUK said:

Did you bother to follow the link I posted? If you did you would have read the following...

"Because you bought the car in the last 6 months, the law says it must have been faulty when you bought it."

I did actually. Thanks

14 minutes ago, b4u2 said:

Hi Len,

Because i used the airflow controls and the direct of vents worked fine. I did test the car out before purchase and it all seemed to work.

It could be an intermittent fault, or one that only shows up in hot weather etc. etc. 

Just now, ColinBarber said:

It could be an intermittent fault, or one that only shows up in hot weather etc. etc. 

Meaning?

1 minute ago, b4u2 said:

Meaning?

You cannot fully confirm everything is working at time of purchase, hence why the law gives you 6 months for faults to appear and the onus is on the seller to fix. 

I just received this message from the seller:

 

Hello, thank you for your message.

As I mentioned previously, on an 18 year old / 125k+ used car, only a bronze policy is available, which covers all of the major mechanical components of the engine & gearbox due to mechical failure. All other parts would not be covered under this policy. 

I note your comments with regards to Consumer Rights Act of 2015, and I’m sorry to hear you may wish to exercise your rights under this Act.

As your request for any non warranty related repairs would be rejected in their entirety, you will now understand I have to do what is legally right for me and my business.

Therefore, as this matter may now escalate into legal proceedings I politely request that all further correspondence are by email only in order for both parties to have a paper trail. My email address ........................................

Unless I hear from you or your legal representative within 14 days from the date of this message, I will assume no further action will be taken against me.

 

Jonathan

I think you're in a grey area here. If the car was fairly new, I would expect everything to work. The sale of goods act is on your side in this case. As it's 18 years old, yes the car has to work, but is it reasonable that everything works ? - Would a court see it that way ? - should you wish to go down that route.  Mines 19 years old, the boot closer has stopped working, the passenger door mirror broke (The cogs that fold the mirror in broke). The CD player stopped working properly. The Screens in the rear headrests started flickering. I either repair/bodge or just put up with the failure. The car's old

 

Sales of goods act says this : - 

Key Points Regarding the Sale of Goods Act and Used Cars:

• Satisfactory Quality: The car should be free from defects and of a standard a reasonable person would expect, considering its age and mileage. 

•  
• Fit for Purpose: It should be usable for its intended purpose (driving). 
•  
• As Described: The seller must accurately represent the car's condition and any features. 
• Private Seller vs. Dealer: When buying from a private seller, you have fewer legal protections than when buying from a dealer. 
• "Sold as Seen" is Misleading: Phrases like "sold as seen" or "no refunds" from a dealer can be misleading, and you still have rights under the law. 
•  
• Fair Wear and Tear: Sellers are not responsible for natural wear and tear that is expected with normal use. 

 

So dealer could claim on an old car, its of satisfactory quality free of defects as a reasonable person would expect, as described and fit for purpose and on an 18 year old car has fair wear and tear.  If your car was a 2017 lexus, not a 2007 then there would be no quibbles with the sale of goods act. It should all work, but it's an old car.

 

My experience of car dealers at the lower end of the market suggests they won't budge, and even if you win at court won't pay - therefore it's often better just cutting your losses.

2 hours ago, Russell Wheeler said:

I think you're in a grey area here. If the car was fairly new, I would expect everything to work. The sale of goods act is on your side in this case. As it's 18 years old, yes the car has to work, but is it reasonable that everything works ? - Would a court see it that way ? - should you wish to go down that route.  Mines 19 years old, the boot closer has stopped working, the passenger door mirror broke (The cogs that fold the mirror in broke). The CD player stopped working properly. The Screens in the rear headrests started flickering. I either repair/bodge or just put up with the failure. The car's old

 

Sales of goods act says this : - 

Key Points Regarding the Sale of Goods Act and Used Cars:

• Satisfactory Quality: The car should be free from defects and of a standard a reasonable person would expect, considering its age and mileage. 

•  
• Fit for Purpose: It should be usable for its intended purpose (driving). 
•  
• As Described: The seller must accurately represent the car's condition and any features. 
• Private Seller vs. Dealer: When buying from a private seller, you have fewer legal protections than when buying from a dealer. 
• "Sold as Seen" is Misleading: Phrases like "sold as seen" or "no refunds" from a dealer can be misleading, and you still have rights under the law. 
•  
• Fair Wear and Tear: Sellers are not responsible for natural wear and tear that is expected with normal use. 

 

So dealer could claim on an old car, its of satisfactory quality free of defects as a reasonable person would expect, as described and fit for purpose and on an 18 year old car has fair wear and tear.  If your car was a 2017 lexus, not a 2007 then there would be no quibbles with the sale of goods act. It should all work, but it's an old car.

 

My experience of car dealers at the lower end of the market suggests they won't budge, and even if you win at court won't pay - therefore it's often better just cutting your losses.

I understand.

17 hours ago, b4u2 said:

I just received this message from the seller:

 

Hello, thank you for your message.

As I mentioned previously, on an 18 year old / 125k+ used car, only a bronze policy is available, which covers all of the major mechanical components of the engine & gearbox due to mechical failure. All other parts would not be covered under this policy. 

I note your comments with regards to Consumer Rights Act of 2015, and I’m sorry to hear you may wish to exercise your rights under this Act.

As your request for any non warranty related repairs would be rejected in their entirety, you will now understand I have to do what is legally right for me and my business.

Therefore, as this matter may now escalate into legal proceedings I politely request that all further correspondence are by email only in order for both parties to have a paper trail. My email address ........................................

Unless I hear from you or your legal representative within 14 days from the date of this message, I will assume no further action will be taken against me.

 

Jonathan

First off, the warranty is irrellevant in this case. During the first 6 months, any faults that arise are automatically assumed to have existed at time of sale under consumer law, and therefore the responsibility of the dealer to either prove otherwise, or resolve. The possible grey area is whether such a fault could be considered reasonable, given the age of the car.

The way I see it is that you have three choices:

1. Accept it and deal with it yourself.

2. Negotiate with the dealer to split the costs.

3. Push for the dealer to take reponsiblity.

You might also want to check if you have legal cover as part of your car or home insurance as, if so, they might be able to advise you on the best course of action, and provide the legal help required if they feel you have a case.

1 hour ago, Bluemarlin said:

You might also want to check if you have legal cover as part of your car or home insurance as, if so, they might be able to advise you on the best course of action, and provide the legal help required if they feel you have a case.

This is certainly the case with my Bank Home Insurance and my AA Membership - both of which I’ve used successfully in the past.  I have previously asked the OP if he has any motoring organisation membership, but I don’t think he replied - so I suspect not! 

I don’t think he’s ever confirmed how much he paid for this old car - and it clearly wasn’t from an Authorises Lexus Dealer.  As I’ve asked before, did it  come with any evidence of maintenance?  Did he do an MoT History check to see what had befallen it in the previous 18 years.  Was he sold it with a current MoT?  He could have the car re inspected now to check if there exist faults and fails that must have also existed at the time of sale!

As has already been emphasised, no self styled Dealer Warranty can override his legal rights.  But frankly if he bought an old car for very little money, then what it will cost to bring this Dealer to Court will leave him out of pocket.  And even then the Dealer may ignore any Court ruling.

I think the key question is: will it pass its next MoT?  If not, then the cost of trying to rectify these relatively niggling faults in the meantime will be wasted money.  Best cut your losses and buy something more appropriate to the budget - and next time take a mechanic along to check over the intended purchase!

8 minutes ago, LenT said:

I don’t think he’s ever confirmed how much he paid for this old car - and it clearly wasn’t from an Authorises Lexus Dealer.  As I’ve asked before, did it  come with any evidence of maintenance?  Did he do an MoT History check to see what had befallen it in the previous 18 years.  Was he sold it with a current MoT?