Problems With New Is Range

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

Sorry - ! I have never been a difficult "prospective" (or actual)customer (now or in the past), but have been constantly let down by the Lexus dealer on the simplest of promises hence my rants in the past and somewhat lack of confidence! I'm totally with Nicnac.

I have every right to question the "rejection" policy before taking delivery - you Lexus owners are the ones who keep telling surveys how wonderful the cars are. Then people make comments like "all Lexus are renowned for rattles..." You live and die by the sword in that respect - Period.

The hushed attitude ofr Mole and so on over this rattle problem has lost my confidence, and we are within our rights to reject the car if we feel Lexus will not be able to solve the problems.

I am yet to be convinced that Lexus acknowledge a problem with the New IS (poor build quality, becasue that is what it is). My dealer is oblivious to any problems what so ever, and believes the car is wonderfully economical in Diesel form :o ...

Either my dealer is lying that he knows nothing about rattles, or as I have mentioned several times before, there is a total lack of communication between dealers and LGB. It's as simple as that.

Cars are like houses - it's nigh on impossible rejecting them after you've handed the cash over (and when buying with your own beans then you have every right to be 100% satisfied).

The plan for me and the family is that the next new car (i.e. this Lexus) will be one we keep for 6 years/100k ('cos I've been told to grow up and start thinking about the kids education!).

If my new car has a single rattle tomorrow, I will walk out of the dealership with my deposit! I told the dealer to ensure that the rattle problem was communicated to the factory so that all new ones in manufacture would be checked out...it did not seem to me that Lexus with all of their "wonderful" satisfaction ethos' have a policy for that. It's just poor!

Like I said before, I was a very satisfied Audi, BMW, Honda, Mercedes and Peugeot owner. All dealers have been naff, other than the Audi/Honda all of the cars were badly made, and I expected them to be. They met my expectation and I was sort of happy.

Lexus have been put on a high pedastel by Lexus owners, and when things go wrong, Lexus GB and dealers go all quietly defensive. That's poor, especially if they have set up the LOC!

I'll have to wait for my rattle free car tomorrow...can't wait, 'cos the car's so damn good overall! So far I believe a smallish percentage of cars have this problem (early manufactures (55 plates), so I'll try my luck!

Current rant over (for now)

PS - anyone got an 06 that they actually ordered new from factory with a rattle?

[mattstheone]

Hello

i own a IS200 and doubt i will own the new one for a few years 3maybe 4 so by then i guess i will here a few rattles and noises.

But How many of these new IS250 or 220D Drivers Actually own the car :winky: and have paid for the car with there own Money. If you have paid for it then complain

Most of the ones i see on the road all have marks on the Number plates saying Lexfleet Or Lexus GB Fleet

or whatever Fleet company

So stop moaning all the Fleet boys n girls out there, all you are paying to drive it is the Tax. and in 3 years or less you will choose another car to drive.

AHHHHH glad i got that off me Chest :P

But i would love to know how many of the new owners actually paid for the car against how many are company owned

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

My own cash (my co car allowance does not come anywhere near funding anything beyond a basic Fiesta) so 70% my own money!!

However company car or not you don't want the hassle....

[javeeds@hotmail.com]

Hello

i own a IS200 and doubt i will own the new one for a few years 3maybe 4 so by then i guess i will here a few rattles and noises.

But How many of these new IS250 or 220D Drivers Actually own the car :winky: and have paid for the car with there own Money. If you have paid for it then complain

Most of the ones i see on the road all have marks on the Number plates saying Lexfleet Or Lexus GB Fleet

or whatever Fleet company

So stop moaning all the Fleet boys n girls out there, all you are paying to drive it is the Tax. and in 3 years or less you will choose another car to drive.

AHHHHH glad i got that off me Chest :P

But i would love to know how many of the new owners actually paid for the car against how many are company owned

Matts

Mine is not a company car - Its my money!

[MacRS200]

Don't see what difference it makes who's money it is. If you have a car that is part of a fleet then you pay tax on the value of the car. Higher value more tax, if I was coughing up extra on tax for a Lex over a Ford I would want it to be right.

[Koenardinho]

But i would love to know how many of the new owners actually paid for the car against how many are company owned

My car is a company owned car. My own company, that is. So although it's a CO car, I DO pay for it myself. But IMHO, that doesn't make any difference. A car is a product. Either a company or a person pays for it, and it has to be without failure. The rest is just a matter of who has to express their complaints: the driver or the company fleet responsable.

[mattstheone]

Don't see what difference it makes who's money it is. If you have a car that is part of a fleet then you pay tax on the value of the car. Higher value more tax, if I was coughing up extra on tax for a Lex over a Ford I would want it to be right.

yes but the advantage to company against private owned is

in 3 years or however many miles

you get to pick another car and you dont have to hand over another 4-5K

you just tell the tax office and they adjust your code

But as i said if You paid for it and it is THAT bad then complain

I have never driven one IS220 or 250 that is, but next friday i will get my chance as mine is going in for

brake work

is the rattle that bad or do you purposly drive listening for noise

is it heard over the radio system

OUCH i will get a back lash from this

Matt

[Velcrow]

As an IS250 owner (yes, who paid with his own money!) whos car does have some rattles and some excessive wind noise , I feel its worth adding that while it has been an annoyance, it has not spoiled my enjoyment of the car or made me regret buying it for one second.

For me, the good things about the IS250 far outweigh the teething problems Im having.

I should mention that my dealer has been on top of the issue from the first phone call I made to them. They've already made a 100 mile round trip to pick the car up and carry out an inspection and they will be making the same trip again, with a courtesy car for me to use, while they take my car for 2 days to carry out the required remedial work.

I know the IS250 is an expensive purchase and Lexus do trade on their reputation for quality and refinement but don't get too hung up about the rattles thing or you'll be driving around straining your hearing and getting suspicious of the least little sound instead of enjoying the ride :winky:

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

Tin hat on your head and collins DIY manual in your back trouser pocket

Seriously, inspite of my ranting I am a happy bunny! I won't be if it rattles

Grrrrr :arrrggg-matey:

[MacRS200]

yes but the advantage to company against private owned is

in 3 years or however many miles

you get to pick another car and you dont have to hand over another 4-5K

you just tell the tax office and they adjust your code

But as i said if You paid for it and it is THAT bad then complain

I have never driven one IS220 or 250 that is, but next friday i will get my chance as mine is going in for

brake work

is the rattle that bad or do you purposly drive listening for noise

is it heard over the radio system

OUCH i will get a back lash from this

Matt

I know the advantages of having a company car, I have had a few in my time, "it takes the worry out of motoring" :D

My point is that the car should be right for the money being paid, just because it's company money makes no difference. I would not drive around in a car that is not up to standard at the same time as seeing the company being ripped off.

I don't have a new IS, it's the principal of value for money. Lexus is marketed as a quality car and that is just what it should be. Lexus will also be interested in fleet drivers being happy, the majority of the sales will be to fleet customers. They won't want one unhappy driver putting off 4 others in a company.

[Barry Lavin]

Crispy ....you are missing the point .The reason for this post is to draw attention to the fact that there are problems and they are as far as we know not being addressed at a production level.

THAT IS WHY I WROTE TO THE MD.

And yes I wont take the car until I am happy with it.

Also if more of you guys wernt so forgiving with Lexus perhaps they would get their act together and fix the probs BEFORE they occur!

Going back to nicnac's point before we all started fighting amongst ourselves. I think that he is correct and that the problem is lack of any reaction from Lexus UK/IRL to the comments made on this website. They have to be monitoring it or they are complete fools as this is the cheapest and easiest way for them to get a handle on Lexus customers thinking. Lets be fair they are no fools. Therefore they have to realise that their silence condemns them. What are we supposed to think if they don't even acknowledge our concerns. To be fair all a dealer can do is try to put right a problem that arises from someone elses mistake but the manufacturer should be listening.

If as someone suggested we are supposed to test drive them as the owners of the first ones are we not entitled to get them cheaper or can we expect a price increase when the niggles are sorted out.

On a lighter note I think the discussion,the investigation and the craic with other prospective owners is the best bit about buying a car as in my experience (Fiat 128,Fiat 124sport, Talbot Horizon, Mazda 323,Opel Kadett, Opel Ascona,1.6 and 2.0l, Peupeot 405, Mitsu Lancer GTI, 3 Honda Accords , Merc C Class, all from new except the first) non of them are near as good as we expect them to be. Hopefully the Lexus will prove me wrong. This buying a car always reminds me of when my old dad *** rest him got a new Lada years ago and brought my wife out to see it. He proudly opened the boot and showed her the full set of spanners that came free of charge. "They must be expecting you to need them was her reply" out of the mouths of babes etc

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

.....be fair all a dealer can do is try to put right a problem that arises from someone elses mistake but the manufacturer should be listening.....

You are right to an extent, but I have a "slant"on this:

The dealer makes a heck of a lot of cash from you for sales commission, selling you your money (i.e. commission on finance), servicing, parts etc. They make a wad for honouring the warranty claims too...

So I have no sympathy for them. They are in it to make money (and abviously do - just look at how sw4nky the showrooms are), and should be screaming at LGB on our behalf. Is that not what Customer Satisfaction is all about? Yet they always say - call customer services at (Manufacturer) HQ...

The manufacturer says "..talk to the supplying dealer.."

In Javeeds case at least Gill is sort of trying to help. That's a start!

[Arkanoid]

Tin hat on your head and collins DIY manual in your back trouser pocket

Seriously, inspite of my ranting I am a happy bunny! I won't be if it rattles

Grrrrr :arrrggg-matey:

I wouldn't expect any rattles when you pick up the car. My IS250 did not rattle at all at first.

It is starting to rattle/creak slightly from all around the dash and there is a noise behind the passenger seatbelt housing. (1700 miles)

The rattles seem to be gradually getting worse.

I also still have a loud clicking noise when leaning my leg against the centre console if the car is cold.

The dealer has said they know how to fix this but they will need the car for a few days.It will invlolve removing the centreconsole and possibly the seats which may introduce other rattles.

I could have had it done when I had the drivers seatbelt changed but wanted the car back.

Still very pleased with the car. Did your Audi rattle at all? I find it hard to beleive any car is completely rattle/creak free. Materials all expand/shrink with fluctuations in temperature.

Also remember the IS250 is very quiet inside so any slight rattle will seem relatively loud.

I haven't taken the rattles up with the dealer yet, but once it starts to p1$$ me off I will be straight on the phone.

[Rob]

with regard to the comment abou the mercedes quality, you will find that RHD mercs are made in south africa - there is the problem!

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

Arkanoid - 3yrs3months in an A4, from New, including a non OEM Satnav installation after buying it, not a rattle, peep, squeak or anything!! 02/52 plate - 46000miles...

It was an outstandingly well made car (honest), and very economical. The only warranty job was for 3 new wheels (sounds familiar), but I had to fight 'em for it...! One clutch recall fixed without me asking.

It was the dealers though, ignorant, arrogant, non courteous, left you feeling "Have they actually serviced the car...?" every time...and I tried 2 different ones (both identical). Always left oily marks on the seats, wheel etc!

The Merc C class was a disaster, and the BMW's a few years back were all iffy.

[Northern Boys Luv Gravy]

@NBLG

Would you be as happy if yours rattled like other poor sods on this board.the reason i opened this post was to highlight the apparent inaction by corporate Lexus or at least feedback, not any other reason.

I wish my car to arrive rattle free.

im glad yours did but how about some solidarity for those whos car didnt :P

At what point did I display any lack of solidarity? I was merely adding my point. If someone wants to organise a placard waving protest outside Lexus HQ I'll be there dishing out sausage butties. I do think that some people are winding themselves up into such a frenzy that if a sparrow farts as it flies past their new IS they'll have it straight back to the dealer for a fix.

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

If from inside my new car I hear a sparrow fart as it flies by and the windows are up then you're right - straight back to the dealer...

You don't work for Lexus do you?

[nicnac]

nblg

yes at 60,000 euro i would also expect not to hear the sparrow fart :D

[Northern Boys Luv Gravy]

If from inside my new car I hear a sparrow fart as it flies by and the windows are up then you're right - straight back to the dealer...

You don't work for Lexus do you?

lol - I wish..

[Noel]

I think it's unrealistic to expect any Dealers to come on here and explain or address any of the issues raised......

The only response possible would be an offical statment from Lexus GB/ IRE and they would probably need permission from Japan first...

no dealer is going to put his head on the line and end up being quoted back to his "bosses" as such and such said this!

Hopefully they are monitoring this site though and passing the general concerns back to Japan.....

But at the end of the day it is a new model so you should expect teething problems.......... which will be sorted in time.

I still want one..... but can't afford it just yet.

[nicnac]

i cannot agree...sure if your going tto pay€15000-20,000 for a new car you might expect the workmanship to be less than perfect but were paying 3 times that in ireland.

if you bought a tv would it be acceptable for the speaker to rattle or awashing machine with a noisy bearing.

its this resignment to "it will do" attitude that fosters this standard.I am an engineer by profession and shudder to think of this type of attitude being used with aircraft etc.

[Gord]

i cannot agree...sure if your going tto pay€15000-20,000 for a new car you might expect the workmanship to be less than perfect but were paying 3 times that in ireland.

if you bought a tv would it be acceptable for the speaker to rattle or awashing machine with a noisy bearing.

its this resignment to "it will do" attitude that fosters this standard.I am an engineer by profession and shudder to think of this type of attitude being used with aircraft etc.

Well said :D you/we pay to price, so you/we want top products :D

[IanB]

But at the end of the day it is a new model so you should expect teething problems.......... which will be sorted in time.

Just a thought, but I bought my first Lexus (IS200SE) when the car had only been out a few months. I didn't have a single problem with it's construction. Not even a rattle.

I wasn't aware of the LOC (if it existed then) so I heard nothing about others having problems at the time, but I had the car for 3 years and didn't have a single issue with it.

There were a few design quirks that made me look elsewhere when I changed the car, but the manufactured quality was superb.

So here I am back again with a car that now addresses my design concerns :) :) :)

IanB :D

[IanF]

I don't want to sound like I'm leaping to Lexus's defense here, but they obviously didn't set out to make a car that rattles.

When it was designed, somebody made a judgement on the number and location of pannel mounts, clips, etc - no doubt supported by a reasonable, but still small scale amount of testing.

Now that the cars are out in the field in much bigger numbers, it's coming to light that the original design is not adequate. However, to prevent the rattles in subsequent cars is not as easy as the dealer letting the factory know about the problem.

Lexus will have made enormous investment in moulding tools to manufacture the components as designed - adding more clips or mounting points is a massive job, and may cost many millions and takes many months. In the very early days of a new product, they may feel that for a non-critical flaw (eg a rattle), it isn't reasonable to make the change until they are sure that no other issues will come to light (and then do everything together as a face lift).

I'm not saying that the rattle isn't a problem in a car supposedly built to exceptional standards, but I think that expecting the dealer (or even Lexus GB) to be able to have any influence in the factory in the short term is not reasonable.

Just my tuppence worth

Ian

[Noel]

But at the end of the day it is a new model so you should expect teething problems.......... which will be sorted in time.

Just a thought, but I bought my first Lexus (IS200SE) when the car had only been out a few months. I didn't have a single problem with it's construction. Not even a rattle.

Yes but the car was launched in Japan the year before.........