Steering wheel off centre and 4 wheel alignment.

[Chris111]

Hi,

Can anyone point me in the right direction to rectify this please?

As the title off my thread states my steering wheel is now slightly off centre to the right after having a 4 wheel alignment and all wheels being rebalanced by ATS. It was perfectly centred beforehand. The car was very unpleasant to drive before the work was done but it now drives the best I can remember in well over 12 months. At first I wasn't overly worried as I am positive I have read somewhere (although typically I can't find it now!) that the steering wheel self centres after this type of work is carried out, and indeed, when the tracking was done by Lexus during a past service the wheel then was also off centre to the right. However, on that occasion, by the time I had driven the car home the wheel had centred. This time the work was done 4 days and now over 100 miles ago and it is still off centre. I have turned the wheels onto full lock left and right when stationary and even found a deserted car park yesterday and drove the car in circles on full lock both left and right but it this hasn't cured the problem.

I am not a mechanic and do not claim to understand the science of suspension geometry, but I was able to watch the process being carried out on a monitor in the waiting area and everything seemed to me to line up (there were a lot of arrows in red zones at the beginning, green at the end) and as I have said the car now feels great to drive. I have read other websites that seem to indicate that only Lexus can fix this problem but I thought I'd ask on here if anyone has any other ideas I can try.

Many thanks

Chris 

[steve2006]

When front tracking is adjusted the steering wheel is normally centred and then locked to prevent any movement while the adjustments are made, if the wheel is not set exactly or moves during adjustment this will produce an off centre steering wheel, I think also the track rods have to be adjusted equally both sides to maintain centre steering wheel position.

It does happen and I'm pretty sure ATS would sort it for you without any further expense.

[wh05apk]

Be interested to see how you get on,  I have an is, and the wheel is slightly offset to the right,  but the steering seems very twitchy,  initially I thought it was tramlining  badly but I  think because it is off centre it lacks the normal play at dead centre which would normally make it more stable. 

I have taken it back 4 times for tracking,  as well as having it checked at the service when they rebalanced the wheels to no effect. 

[Chris111]

Thanks for your response Steve. I did take it back and they centred the wheel no bother. However, I am still after some pointers as to what might be still wrong as the car still feels like the wheels aren't balanced.

The day before I took the car back to ATS, I took it onto the M6, and found that the vibration above 45-50 mph was still there. Not as bad as it was, but still bad enough not to want to drive at a constant 60, never mind 70, on a motorway. Not good! ATS did rebalance the wheels and the car did feel better. But, that was 2 weeks ago now and I had been unable to take it on a decent run until yesterday when I unhappily discovered that I still experience vibrations through the steering wheel and the seats when I go above 50. I am also aware of the steering 'tugging' at lower speeds and driving at town speeds (i.e. a steady 20-30 mph) the steering wheel seems to 'sea-saw' in my hands when going round a left or right bend.

I notice the some of the original balancing weights remain on the wheels, others have been removed and new ones have been added in different places but I am going to take it back again and ask that all the balancing weights are removed and the wheels are balanced from scratch. The front left for example has weights on top of weights. This might be ok but I have never seen it before and I am sure I have read somewhere that an over weighted wheel can be just as bad.

However, I am beginning to suspect that as the car can be left standing on the drive for days, the tyres might be the problem as they may have 'flat spotted' (it is not used for a commute as I work from home and my wife's is less than a 5 minute walk away). I did experience this a few years back with an MGF we bought which had covered less than 500 miles in 2 years. We kept balancing the wheels with no joy and then decided to change the tyres which cured the problem. I have written a thread last year asking for views as I said that I could hear and feel a constant noise / vibration that felt exactly like something was stuck in a tyre. Looking back on that now the symtoms did start after the car had been stationary for over 2 weeks and the car hasn't driven right since. I am positive I can still detect it now so maybe the tyres are at fault. For info the tyres are Goodyear Eagle F1, 2.5 years old, done 20k and have approx 3.5-4 mm tread all round.

I have done a general search of the web and lots of things are mentioned as to what might be the cause. I am going to go with the balancing first as that is a cheaper option than 4 new tyres but would be grateful to hear if anyone has any other suggestions.

Many thanks

Chris

P.s. Sorry for the long thread but trying to get as much info in that makes sense as poss.

[hondansxr]

I pulled into a garage with a punture  as it happen just down the road from the tyre place ( had my own tyre place at the time but was miles from there)

and the young lad replaced the tyre and as I watched him balance the tyre I questioned why he was doing in side and out side balancing ? "  that's how you are supposed to aint it "   and I showed him the settings on the machine to put the weights only in the centre of the rim we used to do the tyres and wheels for a well known Porsche specialist who never complained

ask them to removal all weights and balance in the centre only

hope this help .... p.s take your car to an indy tyre place  who have been trading for along time  ats quickfit Halfords inmho are not worth the cost ?

[steve2006]

A cost free (apart from a bit of human effort) experiment is to swop the wheels front to back and see if the problem is eliminated or changes, don't forget the tyres are directional so only move the tyres front to rear,rear to front on the same side.

Suspension component wear can also cause wheel balance effects also.

[cpk]

I've also got a very slight vibration in my GS450H at similar speeds to you.  It's not actually bad at all but I can feel it's not perfect.

I too thought it was tyres+wheel balancing.  I had some £30/piece Chinese crap tyres on when I bought it and have recently swapped them all for Dunlop Sports all round.  I had read reviews the Chinese tyres had poor tolerances and caused lots of vibration issues for people, I also thought the new tyres+rebalancing would help. 

Now, despite the car being a hell of a lot quieter and not lighting up the TC at 30mph the vibration is still present. 

I suspect if your problem is like mine, it's not the tyres.  I would be very surprised if your tyres have flat spotted - never heard of that with modern tyres over such a short period as long as pressures are ok.

I'm guessing mine is a suspension problem but don't know where to start.  It was serviced at a dealer 4k miles ago and clearly not picked up.

Any advice or an update on your progress will be appreciated. 

 

 

[Chris111]

Update. It's not fixed, but here's what has happened...

I took the car back and all weights were removed and the wheels balanced from scratch. Unfortunately although it was better there was still a steering wheel wobble above 50 mph. So, a couple of days later I swapped the wheels as per the handbook i.e. FL to RR, RR to FR, FR to RL and RL to FL ( I don't have directional tyres fitted), and took it out for a drive. Good news, the steering wobble had virtually gone, but, this does mean though that I have a wheel(s) on the rear which is still not balanced. Upon checking the wheels I noticed the one that was on the FL (now RR) has a row of weights approx 10 inches long exactly opposite the valve. I had new wheels fitted by Lexus last October so I'm guessing when they transferred the tyres to them, on this particular wheel, the heaviest part of the tyre is also in the same place as the heaviest part of the wheel ( i.e. the valve) which is why so many weights are needed to try and balance it, and it can't be. I am also thinking that because the tracking was so much out, maybe the tyres have worn unevenly. From research I have done into this would indicate that this may cause the symptoms I have.

However, when I swapped my wheels around I found that the FL wheel did not spin freely, in fact there was quite some resistance. I suspect the calliper is seizing and this could also cause these symptoms. It's going in for a service and MOT to Lexus in a couple of weeks so I'll find out then. If it needs replacing that will be the full set I have had done!

I will also be getting new tyres soon as these ones are now tram-lining horrendously on anything but the smoothest roads ( and in north Cumbria there aren't many of them!).

I am really hoping that I will get this sorted soon as other problems are starting to appear, but those are for another thread. In the meantime if anyone has any further suggestions I shall be very happy to hear from you.

Chris

[wh05apk]

Chris,

Can I ask how many miles/tread depth your tyres have?

I also think the tyres are causing the tramlining/sensitivity, my tyres still have 5-6mm after 26,000 miles seeming hardly worn.

[Chris111]

Hi Tony,

After checking the tyres have approx 3.5 - 4 mm tread left and have done approx 15000 miles (not the 20 I stated above). However one that was on the front is nearly completely bald on the inner edge due to the tracking being out. 

[hondansxr]

get your track control arms checked and a proper tyre place who does tracking

the amount of places I know of who cannot use the equip they have is unreal

there is a place in atherstone where I used to have my tyre place they set up Porsche's they are dear but superb if you fancy a trip / or new suspension / lowering etc  they are centre gravity  chris and the technician pete

tell them pj sent you :)