Soarer No Match For The Supra?

[markgize]

Hmmmm, previously mentioned article:

http://autospeed.drive.com.au/cms/A_1187/a...?popularArticle

Includes the following:

On paper, it appears that the Soarer twin-turbo motor almost equals the awesome 3.0-litre twin-turbo six in the RZ Supra - but it's nothing like that when you hit the road.

Is this the case? Just that my Soarer seems so damn quick, so I've been searching for a technical reason why various other sports cars don't seem able to keep up.

Mark.

[Bazza]

think its all down to the communication cord, the one that runs from your brain to your right foot

[marx]

Hmmmm, previously mentioned article:

http://autospeed.drive.com.au/cms/A_1187/a...?popularArticle

Includes the following:

On paper, it appears that the Soarer twin-turbo motor almost equals the awesome 3.0-litre twin-turbo six in the RZ Supra - but it's nothing like that when you hit the road.

Is this the case?  Just that my Soarer seems so damn quick, so I've been searching for a technical reason why various other sports cars don't seem able to keep up.

Mark.

←

It maybe down to the weight of all the electric seats, extra sound proofing, infact anything that adds weight will effect performance, gear box ratios may be different etc. Try these comparisons first, it may make more sense then !

[dangerous brain]

Isn't the soarer a 2.5 tt?

[soramad]

and a V8 4ltr and a 6cyl 3ltr

[steveo]

Altho both the supra and soarer tt share a jz engine there's a fair bit of difference between the 1jz (soarer tt) and the 2jz (supra tt). The 1jz was designed and fettled(possibly built by them aswell??) by yamaha, where as the 2j was just your bog standard toyota job.

The 2jz has a larger bottem end giving it the larger 3ltr capacity, but due to this the pistons have to travel further each revoloution, meaning your 1jz altho smaller in capacity the pistons have less far to travel an less weight to move each time meaning that the engine can accelerate quicker :)

couple that with the fact that most soarers have a very good fast changing auto and when u boot it it takes something special to be able to keep up :D

altho i may (and very often am) be corrected :D

steve

p.s. more info can be found in 'up and running' editorial on lsoc forum if any1s interested

[Aristopheles]

I think the fact that the Soarer uses a parallel turbo setup while the Supra uses a sequential one goes some way to explaining why the Supra feels faster. It also has a lot of torque - around 320lb/ft - and 80% of this is available from just 2000rpm - the Soarer has significantly less torque, which peaks higher up the rev range and it makes its peak power higher up in the rev range too, which means that you don't need to rev the Supra as hard to extract all of its power.

[Steve]

when i had my TT Manual I joined a Supra convoy on the way to a meet and the power of the soarer matched the box standard supra no problems.

I also found the soarer was even better 60+

[Adie]

when i had my TT Manual I joined a Supra convoy on the way to a meet and the power of the soarer matched the box standard supra no problems.

I also found the soarer was even better 60+

←

Box standard do you mean the non turbo or standard RZ?

[chips229]

A friend of mine owns a Soarer TT manual and theres very little in it between my standard Aristo TT Auto and the manual TT soarer ;)

[Aristopheles]

I just wanted to say that they are all quick cars, let's be clear about that - we don't want this to turn into a 'my car's better than yours scenario.'

A friend of mine owns a Soarer TT manual and theres very little in it between my standard Aristo TT Auto and the manual TT soarer ;)

←

Obviously, we can't tell how hard each particular car was driven for sure. However, what Chips says would be an indicator of the 2JZ-GTE's extra performance over its predecessor - the fact that a slightly lighter, manual car was matched by a heavier, automatic one.

I think what Steve says highlights the fact that while there is some performance difference between the engines, this is marginal, and any advantages that the Supra may have over the Soarer will be measured in tenths of a second, which doesn't really mean much in the real world.

That's just my opinion mind.

[ColinBarber]

Altho both the supra and soarer tt share a jz engine there's a fair bit of difference between the 1jz (soarer tt) and the 2jz (supra tt). The 1jz was designed and fettled(possibly built by them aswell??) by yamaha, where as the 2j was just your bog standard toyota job.

The 2jz has a larger bottem end giving it the larger 3ltr capacity, but due to this the pistons have to travel further each revoloution, meaning your 1jz altho smaller in capacity the pistons have less far to travel an less weight to move each time meaning that the engine can accelerate quicker :)

couple that with the fact that most soarers have a very good fast changing auto and when u boot it it takes something special to be able to keep up  :D

altho i may (and very often am) be corrected :D

steve

p.s. more info can be found in 'up and running' editorial on lsoc forum if any1s interested

←

nearly all Toyota engines have Yamaha input, certainly any GE or GTE heads.

A UK Supra will beat a Soarer TT - maybe not to 50mph but from then on it will pull away. JDM Supra and Soarer are about the same.

[ColinBarber]

A friend of mine owns a Soarer TT manual and theres very little in it between my standard Aristo TT Auto and the manual TT soarer ;)

←

A Supra is lighter than a Aristo and available in manual too so that gives it the edge over a Soarer.

[chips229]

I just wanted to say that they are all quick cars, let's be clear about that - we don't want this to turn into a 'my car's better than yours scenario.'

A friend of mine owns a Soarer TT manual and theres very little in it between my standard Aristo TT Auto and the manual TT soarer ;)

←

Obviously, we can't tell how hard each particular car was driven for sure. However, what Chips says would be an indicator of the 2JZ-GTE's extra performance over its predecessor - the fact that a slightly lighter, manual car was matched by a heavier, automatic one.

I think what Steve says highlights the fact that while there is some performance difference between the engines, this is marginal, and any advantages that the Supra may have over the Soarer will be measured in tenths of a second, which doesn't really mean much in the real world.

That's just my opinion mind.

←

Agreed....I was just giving a idea of performance between them,ive driven that manual Soarer i was talking about,seems to have more Turbo lag if you short shift but if you drive using more mid range/higher revs then the TT Soarer does pull real well.Ive not driven a Auto Soarer TT,but the sequential turbos on the Aristo Auto does suit the autobox really well,id rather had a manual though :D like your getting dangerous brain :winky:

[steveo]

I think what Steve says highlights the fact that while there is some performance difference between the engines, this is marginal, and any advantages that the Supra may have over the Soarer will be measured in tenths of a second, which doesn't really mean much in the real world.

yep thats pretty much what i was trying to say,

Soarer No Match For The Supra?

there is not much in it between the jz cars, and iv struggled to keep up with a gs before (did take me by suprise as how quick it was before i realised what engine it had!)

an i think the standard uk tt has an extra 40 bhp over the jdm version, but how did toyota achieve this? was it just larger injectors? or is the ecu mapped differently? in which case surely to swap the ecu an injectors would be a good upgrade?

steve

oh or did they just run higher boost on the uk?

[Steve]

certainly not much in it at all due to the fact that my Soarer had no problems keeping up with an RZ.

But may vary to another RZ.. who knows. Just my experience.

[chips229]

certainly not much in it at all due to the fact that my Soarer had no problems keeping up with an RZ.

But may vary to another RZ.. who knows. Just my experience.

←

Do you miss your Soarer Steve compared to your GS?,how do they compare just out of interest?..Handling,brakes,power,fuel etc

[Steve]

The soarer was miles better handling... suspension on mine was quite stiff so handled like it was on rails.. of course the power will always be missed.

Soarers (well 92 model) did not have any traction control.. so in the wet it was really hair raising when the wheel spin in 3rd and 4th when turbos spooled.

But in the dry was very nice.

GS is cheaper to run on fuel... Soarer was very juicy

I was offered a good price for soarer and the guy really wanted my car so i agreed to sell.

Gs is not a bad car at all.. drives lovely in a straight line.. cant fault it at all. Just doesnt like corners.. but still has a bit of poke

[Steve]

oh look.. photo of that day

motor is now based in Stockholm

[ColinBarber]

an i think the standard uk tt has an extra 40 bhp over the jdm version, but how did toyota achieve this? was it just larger injectors? or is the ecu mapped differently? in which case surely to swap the ecu an injectors would be a good upgrade?

steve

oh or did they just run higher boost on the uk?

←

it's not 40bhp because the JDM supra always put out more than the 280bhp in the spec.

There are many differences between the Euro/US and JDM engines. Most of the changes don't increase power but make the engine much better to mod. Injectors are larger (not really needed because the 440cc JDM injectors are not running at 100% anyway), stronger steel turbos, larger bore exhaust, MAF rather than MAP sensor, difference ECU mappings (Euro puts out more power and does better mpg). Boost may be a tiny bit higher.

[peter026]

oh look.. photo of that day

motor is now based in Stockholm

←

As snapped by Gasco

[Steve]

oh look.. photo of that day

motor is now based in Stockholm

←

As snapped by Gasco

←

LOL

[steveo]

oh look.. photo of that day

motor is now based in Stockholm

←

Looks the same as mine!

i believe the traction control was an option on 91 on, s i know a few people with it, unfurtunately not mine :tsktsk:

[chips229]

The soarer was miles better handling... suspension on mine was quite stiff so handled like it was on rails.. of course the power will always be missed.

Soarers (well 92 model) did not have any traction control.. so in the wet it was really hair raising when the wheel spin in 3rd and 4th when turbos spooled.

But in the dry was very nice.

GS is cheaper to run on fuel... Soarer was very juicy

I was offered a good price for soarer and the guy really wanted my car so i agreed to sell.

Gs is not a bad car at all.. drives lovely in a straight line.. cant fault it at all. Just doesnt like corners.. but still has a bit of poke

←

Thanks for the comments.

Did you know the guy in the Supra or was that just a chance picture

[Steve]

did not know any of them... apart from 10 mins before i met in a car park before heading off with 20 other supras

found that pic somewhere that displayed pics of that meet