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Hello guys,

I've recently bought my 2007 GS450H with 130k miles. I'll skip all the details and just say that I serviced it at the dealer for £250 and it passed the hybrid Battery check. One week later the hybrid light came on.

So I got it back to the dealership for diagnostic (which usually costs £120), but free of charge because of the warranty, and it turns out it was the hybrid batteries... That was last Friday. The dealership told me they'll be sending some data over to Lexus "technical team" to analyse and they'll get back to me once they hear from the techs. Also mentioned that the batteries failing under warranty was something very rare (like twice in a year for the whole country if I understood correctly). So today is Thursday and they still haven't heard from the tech team.

Does any of you know if I should be concerned about this, or are they going to honour the warranty as they should. I did read the terms&conditions on the brochure but there was nothing particularly relevant to my case. Could there be something in the report that would void the warranty? I can only make a wild guess and say that the tech team are verifying whether the hybrid check was done properly and if the fault was in the technician (from the dealership) who carried it out, or it's a flaw of the system itself for not detecting a problem?! So that would be a case of who pays for it which they have to figure out by themselves which I suppose has nothing to do with me and repair still needs to be carried out as per warranty.

Curious to hear your thoughts on this!

Regards,
Nik

 

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Now that is an interesting Post Nikola.

On the face of it, it would seem that the legal principle of Estoppel means whereby someone ( in this case, the Dealer) cannot deny what they have said.

So. if it was warranted ,it was warranted.

Do please keep us all informed of developments

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Yeah, I'll probably go talk to the service manager in person if there's no update by the end of tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

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1 hour ago, nik95 said:

Yeah, I'll probably go talk to the service manager in person if there's no update by the end of tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

As it was purchased from a dealer, if its in the first 30 days, you have a right to a refund at worst.

Normally also within the first 6 months unless they can show it only became faulty after the first month.

https://www.car.co.uk/car-warranties/faqs/used-car-warranties/what-is-statutory-warranty-on-a-used-car

Is a good guide on the subject.

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3 hours ago, Steven Lockey said:

As it was purchased from a dealer, if its in the first 30 days, you have a right to a refund at worst.

Normally also within the first 6 months unless they can show it only became faulty after the first month.

https://www.car.co.uk/car-warranties/faqs/used-car-warranties/what-is-statutory-warranty-on-a-used-car

Is a good guide on the subject.

Yes, from a dealer (not Lexus). I don't trust him though as I haggled the price down with 50 quid and then later when I asked to pay for a warranty (which the company could only offer for the engine and transmission, no electricals etc.), he paid for it first with me knowingthe prices without VAT (235 quid) , and then later asked me for 330+, saying that was what he was charged. I pointed out that 235 with VAT should be 282 and so he rang the warranty company and as he was talking I could hear through what the agent was saying so he was reducing the volume of his phone as he was talking... After asking the agent multiple times what the price is I could faintly hear 280 something... after which he eventually agreed. So basically he tried to get that 50 quid back through the warranty. 10 minutes after I drove away the hybrid system light came up. Rang him, told him, and he pointed me to a known friend mechanic (well more like tyre,exhaust and suspension guy) of his. Read the codes and indeed it was the hybrid Battery. ECB and VSC also came up so both googled that and a possible cause was the 12V Battery failing to which he assured me was the reason. I knew it wasn't... At that point I should have insisted for a refund, but I wanted the car so bad that it clouded my judgement. After the codes were cleared, car drove fine. Halfway through the motorway, TPMS light came up and I said **** it, not too bothered about that. Got home and a few days later serviced it at Lexus. Came out with 3 bad shocks (500+ each), all bad TP sensors (for which to replace they charge 500 lol) an oil leak (which as I'm monitoring 500 miles later, oil is still at full, so not bad) and a few holes in the exhaust. So overall not too bad for 3750. I guess I should cram it all in and say that the car is great except the throttle response. Never mind the delay when you floor it. My problem is that there seems to be a lot of dead zone on the throttle so when pressing it makes little to no difference acceleration wise. Is this because of the CVT? Is it because the ECU adjusting the response based on previous driving pattern or is it something else? Putting it in sport mode improves it a bit but not much. So anyway, if anyone's still reading, what are thoughts on this? If they refuse to fix the Battery, guess it's reasonable to want a refund (even a bit extra as I serviced it) from the dealer. What are my chances of getting it? If he refuses initially, what should I do?

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34 minutes ago, nik95 said:

Yes, from a dealer (not Lexus). I don't trust him though as I haggled the price down with 50 quid and then later when I asked to pay for a warranty (which the company could only offer for the engine and transmission, no electricals etc.), he paid for it first with me knowingthe prices without VAT (235 quid) , and then later asked me for 330+, saying that was what he was charged. I pointed out that 235 with VAT should be 282 and so he rang the warranty company and as he was talking I could hear through what the agent was saying so he was reducing the volume of his phone as he was talking... After asking the agent multiple times what the price is I could faintly hear 280 something... after which he eventually agreed. So basically he tried to get that 50 quid back through the warranty. 10 minutes after I drove away the hybrid system light came up. Rang him, told him, and he pointed me to a known friend mechanic (well more like tyre,exhaust and suspension guy) of his. Read the codes and indeed it was the hybrid battery. ECB and VSC also came up so both googled that and a possible cause was the 12V battery failing to which he assured me was the reason. I knew it wasn't... At that point I should have insisted for a refund, but I wanted the car so bad that it clouded my judgement. After the codes were cleared, car drove fine. Halfway through the motorway, TPMS light came up and I said **** it, not too bothered about that. Got home and a few days later serviced it at Lexus. Came out with 3 bad shocks (500+ each), all bad TP sensors (for which to replace they charge 500 lol) an oil leak (which as I'm monitoring 500 miles later, oil is still at full, so not bad) and a few holes in the exhaust. So overall not too bad for 3750. I guess I should cram it all in and say that the car is great except the throttle response. Never mind the delay when you floor it. My problem is that there seems to be a lot of dead zone on the throttle so when pressing it makes little to no difference acceleration wise. Is this because of the CVT? Is it because the ECU adjusting the response based on previous driving pattern or is it something else? Putting it in sport mode improves it a bit but not much. So anyway, if anyone's still reading, what are thoughts on this? If they refuse to fix the battery, guess it's reasonable to want a refund (even a bit extra as I serviced it) from the dealer. What are my chances of getting it? If he refuses initially, what should I do?

Wow, after reading all that I've no idea how you didn't take this car back to the dealer. At least get a mechanical inspection done prior to purchasing? If you get a refund, they'll refund you for the cost of the car - any money that you put into the car is lost. 

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1 hour ago, nik95 said:

Yes, from a dealer (not Lexus). I don't trust him though as I haggled the price down with 50 quid and then later when I asked to pay for a warranty (which the company could only offer for the engine and transmission, no electricals etc.), he paid for it first with me knowingthe prices without VAT (235 quid) , and then later asked me for 330+, saying that was what he was charged. I pointed out that 235 with VAT should be 282 and so he rang the warranty company and as he was talking I could hear through what the agent was saying so he was reducing the volume of his phone as he was talking... After asking the agent multiple times what the price is I could faintly hear 280 something... after which he eventually agreed. So basically he tried to get that 50 quid back through the warranty. 10 minutes after I drove away the hybrid system light came up. Rang him, told him, and he pointed me to a known friend mechanic (well more like tyre,exhaust and suspension guy) of his. Read the codes and indeed it was the hybrid battery. ECB and VSC also came up so both googled that and a possible cause was the 12V battery failing to which he assured me was the reason. I knew it wasn't... At that point I should have insisted for a refund, but I wanted the car so bad that it clouded my judgement. After the codes were cleared, car drove fine. Halfway through the motorway, TPMS light came up and I said **** it, not too bothered about that. Got home and a few days later serviced it at Lexus. Came out with 3 bad shocks (500+ each), all bad TP sensors (for which to replace they charge 500 lol) an oil leak (which as I'm monitoring 500 miles later, oil is still at full, so not bad) and a few holes in the exhaust. So overall not too bad for 3750. I guess I should cram it all in and say that the car is great except the throttle response. Never mind the delay when you floor it. My problem is that there seems to be a lot of dead zone on the throttle so when pressing it makes little to no difference acceleration wise. Is this because of the CVT? Is it because the ECU adjusting the response based on previous driving pattern or is it something else? Putting it in sport mode improves it a bit but not much. So anyway, if anyone's still reading, what are thoughts on this? If they refuse to fix the battery, guess it's reasonable to want a refund (even a bit extra as I serviced it) from the dealer. What are my chances of getting it? If he refuses initially, what should I do?

Yeah I always drive in sports mode. The lack of instant response may be due to the Battery issues.
In sports mode mine is fairly instant. There is certainly no 'dead-zone' anywhere in the throttle.

With all that wrong... I'd return it or say he has to fix ALL of it AND certify its fixed. He should also refund your warranty if he refunds
the sale cost. That could be upwards of 5k in repairs..... 
If  he refuses to do either, tell him you are going to the ombudsman and do it if he refuses. I'd actually leave the car with him
and get the DVLA to assign the car back to him on the V5C if he tries to be at all funny about it and tell him its his problem.

The service money will be lost however. Why you bothered servicing it before having it checked over is honestly beyond me! 😉

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10 hours ago, nik95 said:

Yes, from a dealer (not Lexus). I don't trust him though as I haggled the price down with 50 quid and then later when I asked to pay for a warranty (which the company could only offer for the engine and transmission, no electricals etc.), he paid for it first with me knowingthe prices without VAT (235 quid) , and then later asked me for 330+, saying that was what he was charged. I pointed out that 235 with VAT should be 282 and so he rang the warranty company and as he was talking I could hear through what the agent was saying so he was reducing the volume of his phone as he was talking... After asking the agent multiple times what the price is I could faintly hear 280 something... after which he eventually agreed. So basically he tried to get that 50 quid back through the warranty. 10 minutes after I drove away the hybrid system light came up. Rang him, told him, and he pointed me to a known friend mechanic (well more like tyre,exhaust and suspension guy) of his. Read the codes and indeed it was the hybrid battery. ECB and VSC also came up so both googled that and a possible cause was the 12V battery failing to which he assured me was the reason. I knew it wasn't... At that point I should have insisted for a refund, but I wanted the car so bad that it clouded my judgement. After the codes were cleared, car drove fine. Halfway through the motorway, TPMS light came up and I said **** it, not too bothered about that. Got home and a few days later serviced it at Lexus. Came out with 3 bad shocks (500+ each), all bad TP sensors (for which to replace they charge 500 lol) an oil leak (which as I'm monitoring 500 miles later, oil is still at full, so not bad) and a few holes in the exhaust. So overall not too bad for 3750. I guess I should cram it all in and say that the car is great except the throttle response. Never mind the delay when you floor it. My problem is that there seems to be a lot of dead zone on the throttle so when pressing it makes little to no difference acceleration wise. Is this because of the CVT? Is it because the ECU adjusting the response based on previous driving pattern or is it something else? Putting it in sport mode improves it a bit but not much. So anyway, if anyone's still reading, what are thoughts on this? If they refuse to fix the battery, guess it's reasonable to want a refund (even a bit extra as I serviced it) from the dealer. What are my chances of getting it? If he refuses initially, what should I do?

All of that should have been within your first post Nikola. Ask Lexus for a brief report on the rest of the car as the Dealer who sold you the car needs to be pursued as Steven has suggested.

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11 hours ago, Steven Lockey said:

Yeah I always drive in sports mode. The lack of instant response may be due to the battery issues.
In sports mode mine is fairly instant. There is certainly no 'dead-zone' anywhere in the throttle.

With all that wrong... I'd return it or say he has to fix ALL of it AND certify its fixed. He should also refund your warranty if he refunds
the sale cost. That could be upwards of 5k in repairs..... 
If  he refuses to do either, tell him you are going to the ombudsman and do it if he refuses. I'd actually leave the car with him
and get the DVLA to assign the car back to him on the V5C if he tries to be at all funny about it and tell him its his problem.

The service money will be lost however. Why you bothered servicing it before having it checked over is honestly beyond me! 😉

It's not a 'dead' per se. Just not very sensitive/responsive. Will see how it is after an ECU reset.

Thanks for the advice Steven. I'm not very knowledgeable when it comes to customer rights etc. and how to deal with such situations, but I'm learning.

I didn't check it as I don't really know anyone that can do a proper one. I did check the discs/pads/fluids/visible leaks and such before buying and it wasn't bad.  I'm not too bothered about the shock absorbers as long as the drivetrain and electricals are ok. You've got to consider the price in the equation. I knew I wasn't going to get a perfect car at that price point.

Guess we'll see what happens after the dealership gives me an update.

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3 hours ago, nik95 said:

It's not a 'dead' per se. Just not very sensitive/responsive. Will see how it is after an ECU reset.

Thanks for the advice Steven. I'm not very knowledgeable when it comes to customer rights etc. and how to deal with such situations, but I'm learning.

I didn't check it as I don't really know anyone that can do a proper one. I did check the discs/pads/fluids/visible leaks and such before buying and it wasn't bad.  I'm not too bothered about the shock absorbers as long as the drivetrain and electricals are ok. You've got to consider the price in the equation. I knew I wasn't going to get a perfect car at that price point.

Guess we'll see what happens after the dealership gives me an update.

No offense mate, but that is NOT a good price for a car with that much wrong with it.

I got my 2007 SE for £1.7k, admittedly high mileage and they knocked it off £700 when the hybrid Battery turned out to be dodgy.
And that was with a clean check on all the other systems other than the exhaust pipes.

 

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3 hours ago, Steven Lockey said:

No offense mate, but that is NOT a good price for a car with that much wrong with it.

I got my 2007 SE for £1.7k, admittedly high mileage and they knocked it off £700 when the hybrid battery turned out to be dodgy.
And that was with a clean check on all the other systems other than the exhaust pipes.

 

Yeah probably. But then again I've been looking at Autotrader daily for the last two months and the cheapest one ever was £3.3k. Not sure how you find those sub 2k ones. As long as they replace the hybrid batteries and if anything can be done about the throttle, then I'd be VERY happy with the purchase.

Side question - now that I have the check hybrid system light, the engine works constantly. What kind of MPGs are you getting in town? I struggle to get over 20-25 even with gentle driving.

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30+ easily in any conditions, not driving gently. I'll say nothing about speed limit 🤣 
Ride is so smooth, don't even notice when I'm been "naughty"!

If the hybrid system is having troubles, it may be using more to try and restore the Battery.

Thing is, you can get one without all those issues for 4-5k...

Aren't the shocks MOT fails? If so by the time you've fix those alone it would be cheaper to buy 
one without all those issues. Sounds like you are looking at more like £10k with all those repairs.

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Find me one for up to 5k that you think wouldn't have such issues... The shocks aren't that bad to fail MOT. Even if I replace them at the dealership, it's £1.6k. Can live with TPMS till next tyre change I guess. If the oil leak is from an oil feed pipe as they say is common or timing chain cover gasket, neither of them should be more than £200 to repair.

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47 minutes ago, nik95 said:

Find me one for up to 5k that you think wouldn't have such issues... The shocks aren't that bad to fail MOT. Even if I replace them at the dealership, it's £1.6k. Can live with TPMS till next tyre change I guess. If the oil leak is from an oil feed pipe as they say is common or timing chain cover gasket, neither of them should be more than £200 to repair.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202011206324549?advertising-location=at_cars&make=LEXUS&postcode=bt11aa&radius=1500&price-from=500&onesearchad=New&onesearchad=Nearly New&onesearchad=Used&sort=price-asc&model=GS 450H&include-delivery-option=on&page=1

Seems good, of course you never know till you check it.

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2 hours ago, Steven Lockey said:

It has 122k miles so it's bound to have Battery issues soon...

I saw that one but the dealer reviews put me off. Read them and you can see why.  That's not to say that means that the car would be bad, but you know... Then again, the one I bought from - 'Alexander Motors' Cradley Heath currently has 31 5* and no 1* reviews and my experience with him, and especially him trying to scam me says otherwise... So you never really know...

 

On 4/15/2021 at 2:32 PM, royoftherovers said:

Now that is an interesting Post Nikola.

On the face of it, it would seem that the legal principle of Estoppel means whereby someone ( in this case, the Dealer) cannot deny what they have said.

So. if it was warranted ,it was warranted.

Do please keep us all informed of developments

 

Got a call from the dealership earlier. Said that the techs wanted more data sent to them lol. I asked the guy what's the point of the whole procedure and said even he doesn't know, as that's his first such claim. Said that it could as well go as far as needing approval from Japan lol. So anyway, it's going to be next week till I see another update.

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9 minutes ago, nik95 said:

It has 122k miles so it's bound to have battery issues soon...

I saw that one but the dealer reviews put me off. Read them and you can see why.  That's not to say that means that the car would be bad, but you know... Then again, the one I bought from - 'Alexander Motors' Cradley Heath currently has 31 5* and no 1* reviews and my experience with him, and especially him trying to scam me says otherwise... So you never really know...

 

 

Got a call from the dealership earlier. Said that the techs wanted more data sent to them lol. I asked the guy what's the point of the whole procedure and said even he doesn't know, as that's his first such claim. Said that it could as well go as far as needing approval from Japan lol. So anyway, it's going to be next week till I see another update.

Yeah but if its had Lexus Hybrid checks every year, then Lexus will replace/repair the faulty Battery free if it goes before 15 years. So thats 2 more years approx.
 

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15 hours ago, Steven Lockey said:

Yeah but if its had Lexus Hybrid checks every year, then Lexus will replace/repair the faulty battery free if it goes before 15 years. So thats 2 more years approx.
 

Or even just last year....

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4 hours ago, johnatg said:

Or even just last year....

Yeah, just like mine which is last week... Depending on the outcome, we will tell if the warranty can be relied upon.

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Just got a call from the dealership and so the repair has been authorised. Said he ordered the batteries and will give me a call once they've arrived. So I guess this brand stands up to its name once again.

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Lucky for you - great result.

Once the Battery is done it would be worth spending to get all the faults rectified

I think the selling dealer got away with selling a car with alot of faults

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2 hours ago, cruisermark said:

Lucky for you - great result.

Once the battery is done it would be worth spending to get all the faults rectified

I think the selling dealer got away with selling a car with alot of faults

Yes, he did indeed. Haven't ever really been that lucky when it comes to money in my life, so there's that first time for me. With the batteries replaced, I got a pretty good value I believe.

I'll start with the oil leak and possibly welding the exhaust first. Contemplating if I should get the transmission fluid changed as well. The service manager did say that it's for the lifetime of the car, but I somehow doubt that.

Can anyone recommend me a little bit cheaper alternative over the £400/per OEM shock absorber? I prefer comfort over sporty-ness so I can live with non-adjustable shocks I guess.

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I might be wrong but I think I read here on the forum that there are no alternatives to OEM shock absorbers for the GS.

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On 4/20/2021 at 1:57 PM, nik95 said:

Just got a call from the dealership and so the repair has been authorised. Said he ordered the batteries and will give me a call once they've arrived. So I guess this brand stands up to its name once again.

Great result 👍

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