Sign in to follow this  
JFB2

Is220d Slated - Everywhere

Recommended Posts

Oh my ***, I think I just made another ****ty car decision.

Finally got to grips with choosing a new car in February. Almost went for a 320d, good discounts on offer, but then had a change of heart. Placed an order for an IS220d SE several weeks ago (incidentally, heard nothing at all from the dealer).

Since then all the press coverage of the new diesel has been unanimously negative - coming last in both this month's Test Drive magazine, and today's Autocar. Even my local paper gave it the thumbs down for stupid gearing and bad turbo lag.

What have I done. Can I get my £1,000 deposit back? :sick:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

HI I have not driven the diesel but the fuel economy seems very poor I have driven the new BMW 320 d se and it is lovely to drive. You may get you deposit back if you are lucky If you paid on your credit card contact them they have much more clout in getting you money back

alan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

have you driven one yet,

i would not believe much the press say,

if you have driven and your happy what does it matter whats in the mags

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh my ***, I think I just made another ****ty car decision.

Finally got to grips with choosing a new car in February. Almost went for a 320d, good discounts on offer, but then had a change of heart. Placed an order for an IS220d SE several weeks ago (incidentally, heard nothing at all from the dealer).

Since then all the press coverage of the new diesel has been unanimously negative - coming last in both this month's Test Drive magazine, and today's Autocar. Even my local paper gave it the thumbs down for stupid gearing and bad turbo lag.

What have I done. Can I get my £1,000 deposit back? :sick:

As the owner of an IS220d I can say that it is a wonderful car except for a couple of things:

* Fuel economy nowhere near Lexus figures - I've taken this up with my Lexus dealer and it will be monitored.

* Gearbox gearing takes some getting used to, especially as sixth can only really be used from 75mph+

I will say that the gearbox is loosening nicely now and performance when you push hard on the accelerator is improving all the time. Boot it in second, quick change to third and you hit 60mph in no time. Also acceleration in fourth has improved considerably.

Turbo lag, as above, I don't really notice it any more, did at the start, but not now I've done 1500 miles.

However, the positives far out-way the small negatives that I've found so far and at the end of the day it looks a damm sight better than a 320d.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the suggestions. If the diesel only gives 5 more mpg than the petrol, I'd rather have the V6 auto to be honest. Think I'll call the dealer...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I had a 220d for a day last week and found it very good. No turbo lag, gearbox was fine and the mpg on the computer was 33.5 average when I picked it up from the dealer. Dunno if you think that good or bad, but I drive an LS so looks good to me. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I had a 220d for a day last week and found it very good. No turbo lag, gearbox was fine and the mpg on the computer was 33.5 average when I picked it up from the dealer. Dunno if you think that good or bad, but I drive an LS so looks good to me. :)

33.5, mine is now DOWN to 32.5 average.

30-35 is now what hearing everywhere :angry:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lexus website quotes 44.8MPG for the 220d (39.2 for the 220d Sport).

I achieve an average of 47MPG with my 320d against a quoted figure of 49.6.

Seems the 220d actuals are very low :huh: Hope our fleet departemnt don't reading this thread :shutit:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are all these figures coming from the in car computer or are you all doing a proper check by filling up ,driving then refilling and calculating!....I wonder???

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Since taking delivery of a 220d SE I have done about 500 miles. Gearing IS strange, chiefly because below about 1500 rpm theres no pick up at all, at least at the moment, so in urban areas you spend a lot of time shifting into second, which is very sticky, and therefore not a pleasant driving experience.

The other thing which is very odd is that the engine is so noisy cold and so quiet hot, but it takes ages to get warm in the kind of weather we have had this week, so its noisy quite a lot of the time on short journeys. Ive never known such a difference with a diesel.

Fuel economy - too early to tell, but around 35 mpg in mixed driving.

Ride quality strange too, very low speed bumps are smoothed out, but rough surfaces you feel it all, and on one stretch of dual carriageway near me, on the inside lane I got about a mile of a curious bobbing sensation, the car never settled and my passenger began to feel quite sick. This is on 17 inch wheels with dunlops if anything slightly underinflated when I checked to see if they were too hard!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Are all these figures coming from the in car computer or are you all doing a proper check by filling up ,driving then refilling and calculating!....I wonder???

Mine are based on the in-car computer. There are two figures, one since I've had the car and the second is reset every time you fill-up - happens automatically. Since I've had the car: 33.5 mpg, current tank: 32.5 mpg. 98% of my driving is dual carriageway and motorway.

One thing to note is that the figures on the Lexus web site aren't Lexus figures but those provided by the government (according to my local dealer).

I'm waiting to here from someone with over 40 mpg.

shifting into second, which is very sticky, and therefore not a pleasant driving experience.

I had this for the first 1000 miles or so, still slightly sticky in second, but much better than new.

The other thing which is very odd is that the engine is so noisy cold and so quiet hot, but it takes ages to get warm in the kind of weather we have had this week, so its noisy quite a lot of the time on short journeys. Ive never known such a difference with a diesel.

Yep, very noisy, but I can't here it inside which is the main thing.

Ride quality strange too, very low speed bumps are smoothed out, but rough surfaces you feel it all, and on one stretch of dual carriageway near me, on the inside lane I got about a mile of a curious bobbing sensation, the car never settled and my passenger began to feel quite sick. This is on 17 inch wheels with dunlops if anything slightly underinflated when I checked to see if they were too hard!

I don't get any bobbing sensations at all - I've got the bridgestones. Strangely, my IS300 had the dunlops and one of my passengers always complained of feeling sick, but since the IS220d he is now fine!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Since taking delivery of a 220d SE I have done about 500 miles. Gearing IS strange, chiefly because below about 1500 rpm theres no pick up at all, at least at the moment, so in urban areas you spend a lot of time shifting into second, which is very sticky, and therefore not a pleasant driving experience.

The other thing which is very odd is that the engine is so noisy cold and so quiet hot, but it takes ages to get warm in the kind of weather we have had this week, so its noisy quite a lot of the time on short journeys. Ive never known such a difference with a diesel.

Fuel economy - too early to tell, but around 35 mpg in mixed driving.

Ride quality strange too, very low speed bumps are smoothed out, but rough surfaces you feel it all, and on one stretch of dual carriageway near me, on the inside lane I got about a mile of a curious bobbing sensation, the car never settled and my passenger began to feel quite sick. This is on 17 inch wheels with dunlops if anything slightly underinflated when I checked to see if they were too hard!

Im waiting on a 220d and am also getting concerned at what I am reading.

On the test drive I found the car noisy and the gearbox poor, but put it down to the fact that I was driving a petrol auto and thought it sounded like what it was, a diesel.

However I wonder if there is anyone from Lexus reading these comments who could advise us on why there is no power under 1500 revs and why the gearbox is so notchy and why you need a sixth gear that does not work under the speed limit and maybe reasure us a little bit. I mean there must be good reasons, right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Since taking delivery of a 220d SE I have done about 500 miles. Gearing IS strange, chiefly because below about 1500 rpm theres no pick up at all, at least at the moment, so in urban areas you spend a lot of time shifting into second, which is very sticky, and therefore not a pleasant driving experience.

Im waiting on a 220d and am also getting concerned at what I am reading.

On the test drive I found the car noisy and the gearbox poor, but put it down to the fact that I was driving a petrol auto and thought it sounded like what it was, a diesel.

However I wonder if there is anyone from Lexus reading these comments who could advise us on why there is no power under 1500 revs and why the gearbox is so notchy and why you need a sixth gear that does not work under the speed limit and maybe reasure us a little bit. I mean there must be good reasons, right.

To come up with the class topping power, perhaps they have fitted too large a turbo and that's the cause of too much lag ? Could also be why the fuel economy not that great.

Thanks for all these comments on the diesel...makes me glad I went for the 250 auto. :whistling:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are all these figures coming from the in car computer or are you all doing a proper check by filling up ,driving then refilling and calculating!....I wonder???

Mine are based on the in-car computer. There are two figures, one since I've had the car and the second is reset every time you fill-up - happens automatically. Since I've had the car: 33.5 mpg, current tank: 32.5 mpg. 98% of my driving is dual carriageway and motorway.

One thing to note is that the figures on the Lexus web site aren't Lexus figures but those provided by the government (according to my local dealer).

I'm waiting to here from someone with over 40 mpg.

shifting into second, which is very sticky, and therefore not a pleasant driving experience.

I had this for the first 1000 miles or so, still slightly sticky in second, but much better than new.

The other thing which is very odd is that the engine is so noisy cold and so quiet hot, but it takes ages to get warm in the kind of weather we have had this week, so its noisy quite a lot of the time on short journeys. Ive never known such a difference with a diesel.

Yep, very noisy, but I can't here it inside which is the main thing.

Ride quality strange too, very low speed bumps are smoothed out, but rough surfaces you feel it all, and on one stretch of dual carriageway near me, on the inside lane I got about a mile of a curious bobbing sensation, the car never settled and my passenger began to feel quite sick. This is on 17 inch wheels with dunlops if anything slightly underinflated when I checked to see if they were too hard!

I don't get any bobbing sensations at all - I've got the bridgestones. Strangely, my IS300 had the dunlops and one of my passengers always complained of feeling sick, but since the IS220d he is now fine!

Are all these figures coming from the in car computer or are you all doing a proper check by filling up ,driving then refilling and calculating!....I wonder???

Mine are based on the in-car computer. There are two figures, one since I've had the car and the second is reset every time you fill-up - happens automatically. Since I've had the car: 33.5 mpg, current tank: 32.5 mpg. 98% of my driving is dual carriageway and motorway.

One thing to note is that the figures on the Lexus web site aren't Lexus figures but those provided by the government (according to my local dealer).

I'm waiting to here from someone with over 40 mpg.

shifting into second, which is very sticky, and therefore not a pleasant driving experience.

I had this for the first 1000 miles or so, still slightly sticky in second, but much better than new.

The other thing which is very odd is that the engine is so noisy cold and so quiet hot, but it takes ages to get warm in the kind of weather we have had this week, so its noisy quite a lot of the time on short journeys. Ive never known such a difference with a diesel.

Yep, very noisy, but I can't here it inside which is the main thing.

Ride quality strange too, very low speed bumps are smoothed out, but rough surfaces you feel it all, and on one stretch of dual carriageway near me, on the inside lane I got about a mile of a curious bobbing sensation, the car never settled and my passenger began to feel quite sick. This is on 17 inch wheels with dunlops if anything slightly underinflated when I checked to see if they were too hard!

I don't get any bobbing sensations at all - I've got the bridgestones. Strangely, my IS300 had the dunlops and one of my passengers always complained of feeling sick, but since the IS220d he is now fine!

The ride quality on 17inch wheels affects them all I think tries two now both the same you feel every bump! I aim to try one with 16inch wheels and willpost on Friday

alan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi JFB,

I have just taken delivery of an IS220d, and its the first Lexus I have had. I have to say I would agree with many of the posts on here, yes the gearbox is "quirky", yes there is a turbo lag, yes economy does not appear to be fantastic. However that is after only 900 miles and one week.

I have been lucky enough to be used to nice cars over the last too many years to mention, (as I'm sure we all have been on this site), and in comparison the Lexus feels one of the most sophisticated, comfortable and ergonomic cars I have ever sat in.

I can feel the gearbox loosening and the engine becoming more responsive with every mile, and trust me, when it wants to go, it does go, the handling is great, the ride a little harsh but mostly comfortable. You can compensate for turbo lag with double declutch, and it does look great. For me plus' outweigh minus'.

I don't think you made a major f$&% up as I too usually suffer from buyers remorse, and its minimal with this car, but I'll post again at about 5000 miles, (a few weeks), and we can compare. I hope economy will be up, and that the low rev range has eased up and revs come more freely, it feels like they will.

Good Luck

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Woody, that does make me feel a little less concerned. Maybe I should keep away from WHSmiths. For what it's worth, the dealer has assured me that the gearbox, rev range and fuel economy all improve with mileage. I need to accept that this car is never going to drive like a 320d. I know I'll be thankful that it doesn't look like one!

JFB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm also waiting for delivery of an company IS220d (june) and a bit worried about all the negative feedback on gears/mpg. Many people are suggesting it gets better with mileage so I hope thats the case. When I did my test drive I did manage to get 44mpg on a motorway run but that took some doing. If the mpg is genuinely as bad as it seems to be versus published figures then surely the people with cars should complain to lexus directly to try and get some answers. I have to say that the engine/gearbox in 320D was superb (shame about rest of the car) and I got 60mpg on the same motorway run..... oh well lets hope it gets sorted as the car is superb in all other areas..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Guys - I compared the BMW320d almost back to back with the IS220d and posted on it earlier. The thing is that the Lexus is just so much better made and value for money. The BMW is plain not....you only have to look at how many there are on the roads...and when you add the extra's it becomes stupidly expensive, or too basic if you don't.

The BMW engine was smoother etc. I was really looking forward to driving the 320d...my family (and I) are normally German car mad...but no longer... it was the most unmemorable feeling in driving that I can recall. They rave about the ride, but it was knobbly in my view on those standard 16" wheels, whereas the IS on 16" wheels is fine. The ride is hard on the 17". It's no worse than anything else with 17" and /45 or /55 profiles...

However, the rest of the IS just exceptional. Serious value for money.

I toyed long and hard over this, and did consider the 250 Auto. The auto is wonderful, but the car felt a bit "disconnected" in petrol guise, and it's so refined in Petrol/auto that there was no fun for me.... The diesel engine gives it feel which it lacks in Petrol mode. I would be bored in no time with the petrol, hence I have stuck with the oil burner!! The engine makes a wonderful howl in normal driving ranges, far sportier than the V6 (which is not bad). At above 4000 RPM there's more noise than speed though...

From my experience, the acceleration was awesome between 2-4000ish RPM...below and above it's poor. Like Scott says, the speed limit is there in no time...It's a full second quicker than the beemer. The turbo could be too big...and you have to remember that all diesels do suffer from pre/post lag to some extent, but I think it's the gearing which is main problem. Lexus have shoved a big turbo and screwed the gearing to make it the fastest and most economic and to some extent failed...

I dunno how the Sport would be to drive, but the final drive ratio is different and that may help it.... (or not on the economy stakes)

The BMW had lag too, but that car was "cleverer" with it's gearing.

The car on the whole is a heck of a lot better than the 3 series. The nearest contender is the A4 which is as well made, albeit lacking in the "kit" dept and a bit staid inside.

Incidentally, the mag's are heavily funded through advertising. Most come from Haymarket Publishing (What Car/Autocar etc), and it's a known fact that they rely on heavy BMW advertising.

Final thing is that the fuel economy does worry me slightly. The government tests may be done in "lab" conditions...i.e. optimal economy...which does not help me and you!!

I'm still looking forward to the arrival, which hopefully is only a few days away now (!), in spite of my grumbles above, for me (and I tested everything within the price bracket) it was the best car overall....MHO!

PS - fuel economy should improve by 10% max within 10,000 miles...and remember if thisis the first oil burner on your drive, check the oil level regularly. It's not odd for it to get through half a litre for every fortnight in the first few weeks/months...

PPS - how a bout a twin turbo...a smaller one comes in sooner, so you get a flatter curve!!??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You are right, Jamboo. A lot of reviews are written under "commercial stress" (BMW trying to temper the Lexus enthousiasm of people; and it seems to work here and there because some people start having doubts).

I've noticed that sometimes one review says just the opposite of a different review. Some people complain about the "plastic" interioir parts. What do they want? Wooden buttons? Globally, I think the interior and dash is one of the nicest I've seen lately (in that category).

I have had a test drive with the IS220 and I knew immediately I wanted this car. My Saab 9-3 needs replacement, has almost 200.000 km.

So if anyone is in doubt: test drive it yourself, compare, take your time. The car will proove itself.

And heck, I don't mind if this car isn't being bought excessively, because that way it stays something - in a way - like a seldom gem on the road...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Oh my ***, I think I just made another ****ty car decision.

Finally got to grips with choosing a new car in February. Almost went for a 320d, good discounts on offer, but then had a change of heart. Placed an order for an IS220d SE several weeks ago (incidentally, heard nothing at all from the dealer).

Since then all the press coverage of the new diesel has been unanimously negative - coming last in both this month's Test Drive magazine, and today's Autocar. Even my local paper gave it the thumbs down for stupid gearing and bad turbo lag.

What have I done. Can I get my £1,000 deposit back? :sick:

I have traded in an IS 200 for the IS220d SE model and can safely say im impressed.

The diesel is quicker than my old car and has a lot better fuel consumption. On the IS 200 would get around 370 miles to a full tank. In my IS220d i get around 470miles.

Yes the gearing is hard to get use to but sixth gear is really for motorway driving, i mostly drive in 4th and 5th between sppeds of 40 and 60mph.

You could get a BMW, but i look at it this way, every other car on the road is a BMW.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Haven't driven the 220 D yet but drive an Avensis with the same motor on a regular basis.

Besides it's looking extremely boring (imho) I get much better mpg values as the ones mentioned here and don't recognize all of the complaints about the gearbox

Wonder if both modells share more vital parts besides the D4D motor.

All I can say is that the Avensis has a ridiculously high topspeed (I had over 245 on the clock and still gaining speed) and stays stable untill it gets there. Besides that I liked the version with 140 bhp version more.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been reading this thread with interest and having had my IS250 for nearly 2 months and 3000 miles would like to make the following comments.

There is no question that if your main criteria for buying a car is the driving experience, then BMW is the car for you. Out of all the cars that I have owned, the 3 BMWs were the best to drive. But they were not the best cars overall. This honour goes to the 3 Lexus's (Lexi?) - a 200, 400 and now the 250, followed by Honda, Mercedes and finally BMW. The fact is that now, rather than emulating BMW, Lexus have carved out their own path. I own a Lexus to have the Lexus experience not BMW or Mercedes. Most motoring journalists look at handling/driving experience first and then everything else. That is why BMW always win the comparison tests and why, as I said at the beginning, if this is your main criteria then BMW should be top of your list.

Regarding the motoring press pamporing to their advertisers; I'm sure a little of this goes on, but basically, BMW are very good at building cars that journalists (but not everyone else) like. Bare in mind also that more 3 series are sold than Mondeos. How clever are BMW that they can make a mass market car 'exclusive' and more expensive? And people buy it.

As regards the diesel, I personally did not look at it because it did not come in an automatic and with the traffic now days, I did not fancy going back to a manual. But I do not feel that I have lost out. I average 30 to the gallon (and I'm not light footed!) with more on a long run. The 6 speed automatic is the best automatic I have ever used and has the steering wheel tabs (a la Ferrari) if I ever want to indulge myself. If you are worried about the diesel, then I would seriously consider switching your order to a 250 which is, without doubt, THE best car that I have ever owned.

Other threads have gone into lots of detail about why the IS is so good, but I will just say that it gives me imense pleasure to look at it, to own it, and to drive it. I cant think of three better reasons to own a car.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I've been reading this thread with interest and having had my IS250 for nearly 2 months and 3000 miles would like to make the following comments.

There is no question that if your main criteria for buying a car is the driving experience, then BMW is the car for you. Out of all the cars that I have owned, the 3 BMWs were the best to drive. But they were not the best cars overall. This honour goes to the 3 Lexus's (Lexi?) - a 200, 400 and now the 250, followed by Honda, Mercedes and finally BMW. The fact is that now, rather than emulating BMW, Lexus have carved out their own path. I own a Lexus to have the Lexus experience not BMW or Mercedes. Most motoring journalists look at handling/driving experience first and then everything else. That is why BMW always win the comparison tests and why, as I said at the beginning, if this is your main criteria then BMW should be top of your list.

Regarding the motoring press pamporing to their advertisers; I'm sure a little of this goes on, but basically, BMW are very good at building cars that journalists (but not everyone else) like. Bare in mind also that more 3 series are sold than Mondeos. How clever are BMW that they can make a mass market car 'exclusive' and more expensive? And people buy it.

As regards the diesel, I personally did not look at it because it did not come in an automatic and with the traffic now days, I did not fancy going back to a manual. But I do not feel that I have lost out. I average 30 to the gallon (and I'm not light footed!) with more on a long run. The 6 speed automatic is the best automatic I have ever used and has the steering wheel tabs (a la Ferrari) if I ever want to indulge myself. If you are worried about the diesel, then I would seriously consider switching your order to a 250 which is, without doubt, THE best car that I have ever owned.

Other threads have gone into lots of detail about why the IS is so good, but I will just say that it gives me imense pleasure to look at it, to own it, and to drive it. I cant think of three better reasons to own a car.

Well said! alan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I've been reading this thread with interest and having had my IS250 for nearly 2 months and 3000 miles would like to make the following comments.

There is no question that if your main criteria for buying a car is the driving experience, then BMW is the car for you. Out of all the cars that I have owned, the 3 BMWs were the best to drive. But they were not the best cars overall. This honour goes to the 3 Lexus's (Lexi?) - a 200, 400 and now the 250, followed by Honda, Mercedes and finally BMW. The fact is that now, rather than emulating BMW, Lexus have carved out their own path. I own a Lexus to have the Lexus experience not BMW or Mercedes. Most motoring journalists look at handling/driving experience first and then everything else. That is why BMW always win the comparison tests and why, as I said at the beginning, if this is your main criteria then BMW should be top of your list.

Regarding the motoring press pamporing to their advertisers; I'm sure a little of this goes on, but basically, BMW are very good at building cars that journalists (but not everyone else) like. Bare in mind also that more 3 series are sold than Mondeos. How clever are BMW that they can make a mass market car 'exclusive' and more expensive? And people buy it.

As regards the diesel, I personally did not look at it because it did not come in an automatic and with the traffic now days, I did not fancy going back to a manual. But I do not feel that I have lost out. I average 30 to the gallon (and I'm not light footed!) with more on a long run. The 6 speed automatic is the best automatic I have ever used and has the steering wheel tabs (a la Ferrari) if I ever want to indulge myself. If you are worried about the diesel, then I would seriously consider switching your order to a 250 which is, without doubt, THE best car that I have ever owned.

Other threads have gone into lots of detail about why the IS is so good, but I will just say that it gives me imense pleasure to look at it, to own it, and to drive it. I cant think of three better reasons to own a car.

Glad you like the car....Same as mine and I have to say it's the first car I've owned for a number of years where I just can't wait to get in and drive somewhere....anywhere !. My last car was a 320SE which was a great car, the IS250 is just more special.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this