Inconsiderate Ignorant Useless Morons

[Maduggo]

Sorry for a start off, not a good way to start a post i know.

Went to a garden centre earlier to get some supplies for my tropical aquarium.

Parked away from the place so i had plenty of safety room.

You guessed it, came back to the car and some *&^&%%%&£"!£$!*& had scraped the drivers front corner, the managed to smash the corner parking sensor, scrape the wing and the lower and upper part of the bumper where the all meet, cracked the fog light lens.

So i went inside and asked politely if the had cctv on the car park, instead of saying yes or no the person went all defensive and stated you park at your own risk if you visit here, i never said anything regards parking.

Anyway the manager came along and said they did and repeated the rule of own risk, i asked if he could view the cctv to establish what car had hit mine and if the number plate could be viewed, he said no as i could be trying to make a false claim against them.

So i rang the police and reported it as a crash which really ****** him off, an officer is calling in later tonight to take a statement.

So anyway, i need a paint job, new sensor and a bloody large port & brandy.

Has anyone got a price on a sensor, and how easy are they to fit.

And when i find the culprit, they will be getting a scraped front corner from a 40ton lorry, revenge will be mine sayeth the mad bald one.

[Foulsbane]

We all know exactly how you feel and sympathise.

I know it's not PC, but I too would be out for revenge, in a big way.

Hope you get a good prosecution.

[Shiner]

If you see my post titled is LS430 good value....you'll see that Lexus dealers charge £270 to replace the inner sensor! ....but some members have sourced their lexus parts from this website

www.amayama.com

I haven't used it myself but am considering ordering 'rear monitor display &camers'...reversing camera to you and me mate!

Someone in USA took revenge by having a tonne of ready mixed concrete delivered to the other party's front door...I am not suggesting you do the same !

[Maduggo]

If you see my post titled is LS430 good value....you'll see that Lexus dealers charge £270 to replace the inner sensor! ....but some members have sourced their lexus parts from this website

www.amayama.com

I haven't used it myself but am considering ordering 'rear monitor display &camers'...reversing camera to you and me mate!

Someone in USA took revenge by having a tonne of ready mixed concrete delivered to the other party's front door...I am not suggesting you do the same !

If i find them i could fill their car with cement...

[cruisermark]

chris can the cops not go and view the CCTV Tape - surely a crime has been committed and they have a duty to follow this up

[The-Acre]

Sad to say, probably an old person at a garden centre. I was sitting in my car with my wife recently as we watched an elderly lady trying to park. She got stuck on the corner of one car, scraped the whole wing, tried again and then just walked away as if nothing happened! Needless to say we took her number which found its way to the owner.

[Foulsbane]

I have used a company called cheaptoyotaparts.

Chris has been a great help.

chris@cheaptoyotaparts.co.uk

[ManicMark]

You can make a formal request for the cctv footage I believe & it has to be supplied.

[Shiner]

Chris

Go and see your local citizens advice bureau...they have lawyers who give their time for free!..if that doesn't work ask Which the consumer organisation...they have a legal service for very reasonable prices...

The garden centre should not and must not in any way tamper with the CCTV footage...else they will be committing a crime....just make sure you have noted the names of people you spoke to and the fact that they confirmed the there is CCTV footage on the day of the incident!

I am not a lawyer but my lawyer is a Rottweiler! And expensive unfortunately...so always my last resort!

Good luck

[Lexmanic]

Why would they be concerned that you would sue them.............unless it was one of their vehicles or employees who caused the damage. Incidentally the disclaimer is invalid where their own employees negligence is concerned

[Lexmanic]

Also its important that you write & insist that they keep the CCTV footage as you will require it to establish who collided with your car. If after that they destroy the footage they WILL have committed a criminal offence namely 'Perverting the Course of Justice' and they themselves can be held liable for your damages. Suggest you deliver the letter by hand & have someone sign for it

[steve2006]

The information below is referenced from the ICO website.

When can CCTV images be disclosed?

You have the right to see CCTV images of you and to ask for a copy of them. The organisation must provide them within 40 calendar days of your request, and you may be asked to pay a fee of up to £10 (this is the maximum charge, set by Parliament). This is called a Subject Access Request. You will need to provide details to help the operator to establish your identity as the person in the pictures, and to help them find the images on their system.

• CCTV operators are not allowed to disclose images of identifiable people to the media - or to put them on the internet - for entertainment. Images released to the media to help identify a person are usually disclosed by the police.
• An organisation may need to disclose CCTV images for legal reasons - for example, crime detection. Once they have given the images to another organisation, then that organisation must adhere to the Data Protection Act in their handling of the images.
• Public authorities are subject to the Freedom of Information Act 2000, or the Freedom of Information (Scotland) Act 2000. This Act allows members of the public to request official information by writing to the public authority, who must respond within 20 working days. If the images are those of the person making the request, then the request would be handled under the Data Protection Act as a Subject Access Request. If, however, other people are identifiable in the CCTV pictures, then the images would be considered personal information and it is likely they would be exempt from the Freedom of Information Act.

[Malc]

Could be difficult then if you weren't personally in the CCTV footage at the time of the incident ! Maybe no obligation to hand it over to you personally BUT surely they could to the police investigating the incident ?

Malc

[Bluesman]

Hi Chris,

Sorry to hear the bad news. I can remember that sick feeling in my stomach when my own LS was damaged (story well known in the archives) which was 99% my fault but everyone was 100% to blame for it.

Keeping fingers crossed that you can get what you need from the CCTV. Mike

[harrylime]

Very annoying. Firstly, disclaimers are of limited value, as the premises owners have a duty of care towards all who use their premises. Secondly, there is clear guidance on the use of CCTV obtainable from the Information Commission website., including when CCTV footage should be shared. This is available at http://www.ico.org.uk/for_the_public/topic_specific_guides/cctv , there is a link on the second paragraph. As the CCTV footage is probably your best chance of finding the culprit (purely for financial redress, obviously), I would take the document to the garden centre.The chances are the manager does not have a clue about how to manage the data produced by the CCTV or what his legal position is. I would not count on the police, they will probably view it as a civil matter, private property and all that. An extract from the guidance reads:

............Any other requests for images should be approached with care, as a wide disclosure of these

may be unfair to the individuals concerned. In some limited circumstances it may be appropriate

to release images to a third party, where their needs outweigh those of the individuals whose

images are recorded.

Example: A member of the public requests CCTV footage of a car park, which

shows their car being damaged. They say they need it so that they or their

insurance company can take legal action. You should consider whether their request

is genuine and whether there is any risk to the safety of other people involved.

In my opinion, you are on solid ground.

Good luck

[ambermarine]

The problem we have with these situations arising from car park collisions is why is the cctv there and for who's benefit.Initially the cctv in the garden centre is there for the benefit of the garden centre and is mainly to prevent and prosecute theft and other crimes against them.They are not concerned with collisions between customers cars and that's why the Manager as taken the stance he as.The disclaimer says it all as their legal advisors advise them not to get involved with third party disputes.They are not obliged to turn over the cctv footage as they are not a Public body and the Public as not paid for or maintains the cctv.As as been stated already the police will not get involved unless there as been physical harm to a person.The other problem is proving negligence or even that the culprit was aware they have done the damage.I know you are sore and very upset but do not do your head in chasing a lost cause.

[harrylime]

It is true that the Freedom of Information Act only applies to public bodies, but I would hope that evidence that the manager has no legal problems in sharing the footage would, I hope, persuade him to do so. Given the damage caused, and the complete lack of integrity of the t**t who drove off, I would, personally, expend some time and effort before dismissing it as a lost cause. It's not acceptable.

[Bluesman]

It always puzzles me that if I drive down the side of Chris's car inflicting thousands upon thousands of pounds worth of damage in the garden centers car park and then just drive off its a civil matter but should I kick over a £4.95 pot plant at the entrance to the garden center that would be Criminal Damage.

Crap laws administered by crap people.

[dave1]

My car was damaged by another car when I was parked outside a Sainsburys store when I lived in Coventry. I was fortunate that a security guard noted the registration of the offending car. I went to the local police station and reported the matter together with a copy of a repair estimate.

The police traced the owner who was apparently "unaware" that he had hit my car but agreed to pay for the repair. He had failed to stop following a collision which is why the police assisted me in getting him to pay.

Even though the collision took place on "private property" because the general public have access to it then the police can become involved.

[harrylime]

I agree, the police can become involved, but in my area they rarely turn out for burglaries, let alone something like this

[Maduggo]

chris can the cops not go and view the CCTV Tape - surely a crime has been committed and they have a duty to follow this up

They came and took a statement and photos of the car, they agree that an offence of hit and run has taken place as long as it can be proved by cctv footage and not just by me saying it happened to make a claim, which i understand.

They then went off to the garden centre to speak with said manager idiot, the officer rang me this morning and left a message as i was driving, there is evidence that a car did hit my car, as the driver got out of his car to look at the rear corner of his car and the front corner of my car, exactly where the damage is, she said you can see he moved extremely close to my car and was guided away from my car by a passenger in his car, she has a reg plate and will be following it up, she stated she will ring me back with more info when she has it.

So not too bad at the moment.

Lexus want 140 quid for the sensor and 6 quid for the holder.

It seems like a not to difficult job to replace via the front wheel well behind the bumper i hope.

Lets see where it goes from here.

[harrylime]

That sounds like you will get a result Chris, that's great. Thee drive clearly knew what he had done, must have learned their scruples from our politicians. I was once parked in a supermarket car park and saw someone with a large 4 wheel drive reverse straight into another car. The driver inspected the damage on both, and then moved his vehicle to the other end of the car park. I left a note on the car windscreen with the make model and registration number of the offending vehicle.

[harrylime]

sorry about the typo, I am not a Quaker

[cruisermark]

good result chris - aslong as the clown has insurance you should be sorted - youve got the reg - you go the cctv evidence and police report will back it all up.

[dave1]

I would think he is insured. I am sure the police would have told you if he wasn't in order that you could go via your insurers. Most . insurers nowadays cover you for losses through uninsured drivers if they are caught. They also don't penalise you via loss of NCD.