Why are folk selling their is250's

[SeanR]

Aye, i dont think folk would buy an is250 for performance, just a quality runner.

 

More Mo Farah than Chris Akabusi 

[toffee_pie]

Cars have different meanings to different people - The IS250 is a good car indeed, I don’t know how long I had mine I think it was a few years, I sold it because it just wasn’t exciting and fast enough for me, it was too comfortable with lack of driver feedback and the gearbox was not good - this was a manual, on hindsight I probably would have got an auto but I as an old school manual driver I try keep away from autos while I still have two working legs. 

The Lexus went and a CL55 AMG arrived, the 500bhp variant, yes its auto but I was prepared to live with it for a few years because its not a run of the mill motor but it didn’t quite hold up, I had it a month and the dodge seller took it back - it was a dud with dodge MOTs - after I had the money back in my bank I went straight back to Japanese cars as I had a Honda Accord prior to the Lexus and that LED me down the road to the Subaru, a really amazing car - it was convenient that the seller lived in a B road area so I just winged it around that place and had my mind made up in 5 minutes and that flat 6 engine sounds amazing, which is reason enough to keep it.

The running costs of this are worse than a IS250, the fuel economy is worse but 34mpg can be done on a long run holding at 80mph. Crucially its reliable, in 6 1/2 years I replaced 2 CV boot joints, a sticky calliper and a wheel bearing (just last Friday actually) and the handling is astonishing, even with that engine sticking out the front. Bilstein suspension is fitted as standard, as is a torsen LSD. It’s a fantastic driver’s car and pretty old school with that gearbox and hydraulic steering and ABS, nothing else and has the renowned 6 speed transmission from Subaru - the OEM value of that part is 13K EURO itself. Only a handful of such cars ever sold in Europe and imports from Japan cost serious money, which are basically the same car with +5bhp due to the fuel map in Japan, mine is already mapped for 99RON anyway. It goes under the radar and nobody knows what is it, until they hear it.

So, cars are different to everyone - had I to get something else I secretly have demons telling me to get a Maserati, but I just keep ignoring them as I don’t want to end up homeless and sleeping in a broken Maserati with my wife calling over each day with ready meals.

[royoftherovers]

9 hours ago, toffee_pie said:

Cars have different meanings to different people - The IS250 is a good car indeed, I don’t know how long I had mine I think it was a few years, I sold it because it just wasn’t exciting and fast enough for me, it was too comfortable with lack of driver feedback and the gearbox was not good - this was a manual, on hindsight I probably would have got an auto but I as an old school manual driver I try keep away from autos while I still have two working legs. 

The Lexus went and a CL55 AMG arrived, the 500bhp variant, yes its auto but I was prepared to live with it for a few years because its not a run of the mill motor but it didn’t quite hold up, I had it a month and the dodge seller took it back - it was a dud with dodge MOTs - after I had the money back in my bank I went straight back to Japanese cars as I had a Honda Accord prior to the Lexus and that led me down the road to the Subaru, a really amazing car - it was convenient that the seller lived in a B road area so I just winged it around that place and had my mind made up in 5 minutes and that flat 6 engine sounds amazing, which is reason enough to keep it.

The running costs of this are worse than a IS250, the fuel economy is worse but 34mpg can be done on a long run holding at 80mph. Crucially its reliable, in 6 1/2 years I replaced 2 CV boot joints, a sticky calliper and a wheel bearing (just last Friday actually) and the handling is astonishing, even with that engine sticking out the front. Bilstein suspension is fitted as standard, as is a torsen LSD. It’s a fantastic driver’s car and pretty old school with that gearbox and hydraulic steering and ABS, nothing else and has the renowned 6 speed transmission from Subaru - the OEM value of that part is 13K EURO itself. Only a handful of such cars ever sold in Europe and imports from Japan cost serious money, which are basically the same car with +5bhp due to the fuel map in Japan, mine is already mapped for 99RON anyway. It goes under the radar and nobody knows what is it, until they hear it.

So, cars are different to everyone - had I to get something else I secretly have demons telling me to get a Maserati, but I just keep ignoring them as I don’t want to end up homeless and sleeping in a broken Maserati with my wife calling over each day with ready meals.

Someone once whispered to me that a Maserati was merely a Fiat with knobs on !

[Texas]

Have you read my Mates Maserati experience here?

Bargepole comes to mind😂

 

 

[toffee_pie]

3 hours ago, royoftherovers said:

Someone once whispered to me that a Maserati was merely a Fiat with knobs on !

Nah, thats nnonsens - Maserati are (or can be!) astonishing cars - they may share a few parts from Fiat in the same way Lexus share parts with Toyota but thats where it ends, they are made in assembly lines producing Maserati cars only. They are complex but due to the pretty resonably used cost its the devil talking to me - The downside is the bork factor but some people have had little or no issues with them

 

[toffee_pie]

3 hours ago, Texas said:

Have you read my Mates Maserati experience here?

Bargepole comes to mind😂

 

 

interesting, let me read -- I would have got a facelift QP with ZF box, not sure what one this is but having a cold beer now reading it.😁

[toffee_pie]

5 hours ago, Texas said:

Have you read my Mates Maserati experience here?

Bargepole comes to mind😂

 

 

Ive read it, nothing much to report - its a ZF looks to be a 4.2 - As the chap said they draw attention that not many a car can do and if you see one in your rear view mirror you will gently get out of the way in a manner you wouldnt do for most cars

For a daily they are going to wrack up huge bills however, but you want to drive a car with that engine them are the downsides but it sets you out from other motorists thats for sure.

I hope it contines to serve dandydons well.

[toffee_pie]

On 8/2/2022 at 12:19 PM, Flaviu90 said:

I was looking for a 2.4 CL9 Accord with manual transmission before getting the Lexus. These are so hard to find in the UK with the sedan platform( and expensive).The Euro R was around 9-10k£ at that time and i didnt want to spend as much again on a car as I did when I was modifying my Hondas.

Sorry but I don't fancy the estate cars even though I'm well aware of the practicality side of things. The IS 250 is a very nice car to drive but I'm missing the manual gearbox with the short ratios from the FN2.

i had a CL9 Accord, the Subaru 3.0 SpecB is a far quicker car with sharper handling. I had the Accord for about 2 years also - The Subaru feels far more special when you drive it and in terms of engine noise there is no comparison, but you need the manual box in the Subaru with the close ratios the auto takes away all the enjoyment - and speed since the torque convertor zaps power to the wheels. I can take some tight bends in 4th gear without even dropping down a gear and just floor it when you exit the corner, most cars would be just stuck back at the corner when you are way off - 50/50 torque bias is standard on the 6 speeds which explains the handling

You are like me in not being a fan of wagons / estates - its either a coupe or a saloon for me. I find the saloons more nimble and easier to throw around bends than wagons and they look great too

[Mr Vlad]

Mmmmm so you don't think you can throw a wagon/estate car round bends eh? Think super touring cars and the Volvo estate that beat everything on the track so much so it was banned a year later. Just a point.

[H3XME]

6 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

Mmmmm so you don't think you can throw a wagon/estate car round bends eh? Think super touring cars and the Volvo estate that beat everything on the track so much so it was banned a year later. Just a point.

To be fair, purposely built car cannot be compared to a normal road version. Subaru Legacy, even with the EZ30 flat 6 is not a performance wagon, it just happens to have a bigger engine in it.. There's only a handful of wagons built for the purpose out of the factory > Volvo 850R, BMW M5, maybe even older AMGs, Cadillac CTS-V, Golf R, RS4, RS6. Can't think of any other "super" wagons. 

[H3XME]

11 hours ago, toffee_pie said:

You are like me in not being a fan of wagons / estates - its either a coupe or a saloon for me. I find the saloons more nimble and easier to throw around bends than wagons and they look great too

I must be the underdog, because I'd pick a fast wagon over a fast saloon any day of the week and I have 0 use for either. I don't need a practical car, I just think they look better. Especially the 2004+ Legacy, but you are right. I was tempted by getting a 3.0l Legacy and it would only be the manual model. 

[Mr Vlad]

It's surprising how some estate versions look better than their sedan brothers. I'll just state 2. Ford mondeo titanium x sport estate (mk4.5) and the VW Passat. 2 glorious looking cars.

[toffee_pie]

11 hours ago, H3XME said:

I must be the underdog, because I'd pick a fast wagon over a fast saloon any day of the week and I have 0 use for either. I don't need a practical car, I just think they look better. Especially the 2004+ Legacy, but you are right. I was tempted by getting a 3.0l Legacy and it would only be the manual model. 

Saloons for me all day - some cars are suited to manual and some to auto - the Legacy and the IS250 are good cases in point, the Lexus is far better with an auto but the Legacy cries out for a manual - the Spec.B launched way back in 2003 came with the 6-speed manual standard, Subaru knew what to do - the auto came about later on

A lot of people import autos from Japan but I secretly think they would get manual if they were less expensive and more readily available, I had a peep at Legacy B4 (basically the JDM equivalent of the UK Saloon) and they are not cheap - these are recent prices

https://subarumedia.co.uk/en-gb/releases/236

Year	Model	Type	CC	Shift	Mileage	Price in Japan USD
2007	SUBARU LEGACY B4	3.0R SPEC.B	3000cc	MT	14471	33,050
2005	SUBARU LEGACY B4	3.0R SPEC.B	3000cc	MT	75000	20,530
2007	SUBARU LEGACY B4	3.0R SPEC.B	3000cc	MT	97800	20,280
2004	SUBARU LEGACY B4	3.0R SPEC.B	3000cc	MT	101916	13,350
2005	SUBARU LEGACY B4	3.0R SPEC.B	3000cc	MT	135000	12,580
2005	SUBARU LEGACY B4	3.0R SPEC.B	3000cc	MT	92829	12,230
2005	SUBARU LEGACY B4	3.0R SPEC.B	3000cc	MT	153000	11,568
2004	SUBARU LEGACY B4	3.0R SPEC.B	3000cc	MT	91303	11,040
2004	SUBARU LEGACY B4	3.0R SPEC.B	3000cc	MT	130000	10,028

[toffee_pie]

11 hours ago, Mr Vlad said:

Mmmmm so you don't think you can throw a wagon/estate car round bends eh? Think super touring cars and the Volvo estate that beat everything on the track so much so it was banned a year later. Just a point.

You cant go comparing competition race cars with road legal ones, I am sure I can point you towards some V8 saloon race cars or the Subaru below that would ask your volvo estate to hold my beer. I think some countries has a bias towards wagons and more saloon type cars 

 

[toffee_pie]

On 7/1/2022 at 5:41 PM, J Henderson said:

Absolutely no intention of selling mine.

It still drives great. I still enjoy driving it, and it doesn't cost a ridiculous amount to keep on the road.

Plus, after all these years I'm still finding it pleasing to the eye whenever I walk back to it. Not just my own car, but the 2nd-Gen IS in general. It is ageing very gracefully in my opinion.

In fact, I'm thinking of throwing a few quid at mine to rejuvenate things and keep it looking sharp. The wheels don't look horrible from a distance, but they do need refurbished. I also want to repaint the brake calipers and get a PDR guy to treat a couple of dings that have been on the car forever.

Occasionally I'll wonder about getting something faster/newer, but when I look at what is actually out there that could be justified, it's a very small list, and any potential replacement would cost a fortune.

I think that resonates with a lot of people who have a Lexus or even any Japanese car and also with me - my Subaru is too rare and too good to sell and even thou I could get a newer car you always wonder what you are getting into regarding bills that could be coming your way and I have no space for another (second) car so that pretty much makes it a non event for me anyway. The IS250 FSport still looks great. 

[Mr Vlad]

Well I'm in Bowness on windermere and I've been coming here for years. This time I followed my cars satnav which took me off jnc 35 (normally I come off jnc 36) and I thought what the heck. The A5074 is now one of my favourite roads. Why? Who needs a roller coaster ride? If I was in a 3 series beemer no way would I have gone faster or felt safer. No Way. My is250 and I (not so much the better half's lol) felt as one and took everyone of those bends with consummate ease. The car handled sublime. Even an unexpected hump in the road where the car left the ground didn't upset the car. Basically what I'm saying is I don't care a diddly squat what younger car owners say. The is250 is one helluva muva ₩€¥$☆r great handling car. After this trip today that's changed my mind totally about my car. Its even better than I've ever thought. 

So why sell it? One needs an @##£%g good reason too or the owner is scared of just how good it is.

[H3XME]

4 hours ago, dking22 said:

Powerless engine, most cars burn lots of oil, very bad fuel economy, no room in the back, uncomfortable seats, no folding back seats, big mistake buying it the first place.

Alright, calm down 😉

Edited August 21, 2022 by janey

[F.A.]

1 hour ago, dking22 said:

Powerless engine, most cars burn lots of oil, very bad fuel economy, no room in the back, uncomfortable seats, no folding back seats, big mistake buying it the first place.

We had two IS250’s for several years a 2007 and a 2011 model, both SE-L spec. I found them to be a very comfortable car with adequate fuel economy for the engine. Yes it’s not the fastest car in its class but I don’t think that’s what the car is about. We ran it along side our RX450h so practically was good enough for us, although I agree the with the space in the back comment. We struggled with two car seats when our daughters came along. We swapped one of our IS250s three years ago for a GSF, which has been fantastic, however I don’t feel short changed during the everyday commute when I use our remaining IS250. 

[Texas]

1 hour ago, dking22 said:

I did mostly city driving and fuel economy was really bad, still within manufacturer spec tho. Seats dont offer any support for who has longer/normal legs, bottom pad too short and no adjusting like in BMW etc. On longer trips legs tired fast and began to cramp. During heavy cornering slide off the seat, no side support(bottom). Had these perforated leather seats, cooling/venting was very minimal, practically zero effect.

Yes the GSF is awesome upgrade over this. 👌

So……you don’t like 250 then?😂 but how you getting on with its big brother?

250 is plenty car for me here in UK where you get Hung, Drawn & Quartered for doing more than 10% over speed limit ( well robbed of £££££’s ) where in the world are you ( dking22) to be able to use you car to its full extent?

[toffee_pie]

The beauty about cars is that everyone has a different opinion and its why so many forums the world over are plastered with discussions and tit for tat backstabbing. 

The guy selling his ISF for a Maserati is a perfect example, few cars can match a Maserati for the stand out ‘wow’ factor and watch that road open up in front of you when you appear behind someone.

I sold my old IS250 as it was pretty slow and uninspiring but that doesn’t mean to say it’s not a good car, had I not ended up in the countryside where my Subaru excels with its close-range manual gearbox, I would most likely have some auto car and I wouldn’t say no to another Lexus - well maybe a LS460 this time. The Subaru is a backbreaking car to drive in the city, because you feel every gearchange going through your body as well as have the privilage of seeing the fuel gauge drop down in real time and if you are older than 40 years of age that does takes its toll but my city jaunts tend to be infrequent so for now I am good.

[SeanR]

Depends where you are in life.

 

Had a WRX estate, was a brilliant car, going back some years now. Nippy and reliable, had bit of an image though, felt like a spotty teenager driving it even though i was in my late 30,s.

Not really bothered about how fast a car is or how well it goes around corners these days, so long as its not **** at it.

With age, views change.

Jeez, im a boring******* haha

[LenT]

 

On 8/17/2022 at 9:09 AM, Mr Vlad said:

Mmmmm so you don't think you can throw a wagon/estate car round bends eh? Think super touring cars and the Volvo estate that beat everything on the track so much so it was banned a year later. Just a point.

I remember it well, Vladimir.  Watching it race in the BTCC meetings was a hoot!  Apparently the other drivers hated it.  It wasn’t just that it was surprisingly quick around the circuit, it was that it was comparatively so much larger than its competitors that overtaking was not a straightforward business.

I’ve tracked down this editorial that might bring back some memories!

https://www.media.volvocars.com/global/en-gb/media/pressreleases/143336/twenty-years-since-volvo-made-its-debut-in-the-btcc-with-the-850-estate

[toffee_pie]

On 6/25/2022 at 9:54 PM, Linas.P said:

First reason - simply because it is old car. As the times goes by people want some change and IS250 can't just be used forever. Yes they are amazingly reliable cars and comfortable cars, good value for money, well equipped, but with little bit of neglect they are starting to show signs of wear and tear as well. Overall model was released 17 years ago and most of tech is easily over 20 years old, not even facelift helps. 

Second reason (at least for me), IS250 is comfortable car, but fast it isn't - for 2005 car it was borderline acceptable, but many want a little bit more umphhhh... I have argued that around 5-6s to 60 is sweet-spot... and that has always been the reason why I was trying to find something else. Still looking...

Third reason - practicality is lacking as well, for example for unknown reason IS250 does not have folding seats, boot is not massive and opening isn't even allowing use of what it has easily. Rear headroom and legroom isn't great either (thought that never bothered me much), so I could see that some cars are upgraded when family grows.

Cost of ownership... I kind of doubt it. I guess it depends - for me it was never an issue, but I do a lot of stuff myself or at least I figure out what needs doing myself, so service guys can't upsell me for what I don't need, less car savvy owner my find it difficult when every service bill is £1000+ if you just let it be. Fuel economy is good for the car it is, but for with current prices it could be concern, ever increasing tax does not help either. So I would say - cost of ownership shouldn't be the reason, but for some owners it may be.

IS250 mk2 key strength is amazing value for money and it does everything well, but nothing exceptionally (maybe except of reliability). When I tried replacing my IS250 I really struggled to find anything that would do... sure for me RC350 was that car, but we don't have it here. GS450h would be my next choice.

Good summary, that is what I would say also. I have looked at GS450h's but the CVT is a no for me, plus that navi interface is meant to be a bit of a faff. 

A lot of car for the money however, just not this one 😗

[BC99]

On 8/17/2022 at 9:09 AM, Mr Vlad said:

Mmmmm so you don't think you can throw a wagon/estate car round bends eh? Think super touring cars and the Volvo estate that beat everything on the track so much so it was banned a year later. Just a point.

The Alfa 155 dominated 1994, when the Volvo Estate raced. They used a homologation special (Silverstone Edition) to allow them to use an adjustable front spoiler, and a raised rear wing, apparently several of the parts weren't installed, just put in the boot. 🤣 Although according to Gabriele Tarquini it was the differential that made the biggest difference over the competition. (Interview with 1994 BTCC champion, Gabriele Tarquini.)
The following season aerodynamic aids were permitted, which the estate couldn't use, something like the rear wing wasn't allowed to be visible from the front of the car, It wasn't banned, it was just no longer able to be competitive under the new regulations.

[Linas.P]

8 minutes ago, toffee_pie said:

Good summary, that is what I would say also. I have looked at GS450h's but the CVT is a no for me, plus that navi interface is meant to be a bit of a faff. 

A lot of car for the money however, just not this one 😗

What doesn't help either is that GS450h prices got stuck like 4-5 years ago and they haven't depreciated even a bit. 5 years ago they were like 14-15k, now they are 12-13k. It is just ridiculous that in first 5 years those cars depreciated by 75% (I mean they were £60-70k new) and for the second 5 years, they literally stuck with the price and didn't depreciate even 10% more. I guess inflations does amazing things. If the trend would have followed, now they should be £4-6k and that would be no brainer, but for £13k there is quite a few cars to choose. I guess the other big reason - Lexus barely sold few 100 and almost none of the facelift ones, so supply on mk4 GS in UK is just non-existent which keeps the prices-up.

I know it is repetitive, but imagine if we had GS350 in UK, same gearbox as IS-F, they even had AWD (although that used standard 6-speed auto and generally RWD is better to drive) - how amazing would be that?!