17 hours ago, wharfhouse said:

Other then the SE all other trims of IS 300h were already in Band B so will stay there. That is currently £20 a year but gets discounted to £10 for hybrid (and alternative powered vehicles). For 2023 it says "rates for Alternative Fuel Vehicles and hybrids will also be equalised" - by that I assume it means the £10 discount will be dropped so will mean a doubling in annual ved to £20...!

Yes correct. Band A will disappear and everything there goes into Band B. Alternative fuel discounts will be removed.

For all Lexus hybrids up to 2017, whichever band they are in, it will mean an extra £10.

35 minutes ago, ColinBarber said:

Wasn't the same view held in the 60/70/80s about Japan, and yet here we are on a Lexus forum.

The difference is that Japan is democracy and the other country mentioned is dystopian totalitarian regime. I have not hear of Japan trying to rig elections in the west or mass survey neither it's own citizens (at home and abroad), nor foreigners. We are talking about the country here which killed 120 million of it's own people in peace time to get to where it is now.

In short - I don't think they are comparable... and I think we making big mistake trading with them at all, their ideology is very dangerous. I was lucky to visit China in 2016 before it turned for worse - even then my fingerprints were scanned upon entry and they had police checkpoints every 200m and xrayed everything on every entrance to metro. As far as I know it is getting increasingly worse with each passing year.

1 hour ago, ColinBarber said:

Wasn't the same view held in the 60/70/80s about Japan, and yet here we are on a Lexus forum.

Yes, but please do not be complacent CB .

Excellently said Colin. 1st it was the Japanese now the Chinese but herexwe are on a 'Japanese ' car forum. Funny ole world.

1 hour ago, Linas.P said:

The difference is that Japan is democracy and the other country mentioned is dystopian totalitarian regime.

Not comparing the countries or the way they are governed, just that both their car industries were/are seen as a thread to US and European car industries and in the past attempts to stop them with protectionist trade policies didn't work - and members here benefited from that failure with high quality cars as a result.

I understand the different opinions espoused on the EV / ICE debate. My concern is that it is becoming very partisan and fractious. I have no issues with someone wanting to buy an EV if they can afford it. The wealth issue is spurious to say the least - as some ICE models are far too expensive to purchase for many of us. 

There are many reasons to be wary of purchasing an EV car right now, but VED in 2025, is not one of them. Royoftherovers made an interesting political point regarding China, as did Colin Barber in reply.

Purchasing a £40 grand + car is very heavy on road tax. But if you have the money and that is your choice, then it is a free (not from tax!) country! If I had around £70,000 spare to buy a new car, then I would probably go for the electric RX. There are other reasons, apart from initial cost why I would be wary about buying an EV vehicle. 

1) Reliability

2) Model choice 

I will stick with my 4 litre V8 and 3.3 litre V6 for the time being - when they become too expensive ............... I will use my bus pass!

I feel there is unjustified criticism of EV's 

4 hours ago, ColinBarber said:

Not comparing the countries or the way they are governed, just that both their car industries were/are seen as a thread to US and European car industries and in the past attempts to stop them with protectionist trade policies didn't work - and members here benefited from that failure with high quality cars as a result.

That is fair enough and I think there are some similarities, you right - Japan was seen as "copycat" back in 60s and 70s, same as we see China now. I think there was one smaller step before China - that is Korea in 80s and 90s... and since ~2010 we have China. However, my point was more along the lines that having Korea and Japan copying some of western designs or technologies was only damaging to European/American car makers, yet it was beneficial for us consumers, China is different beast altogether - it getting on top of the game may risk our life or at very least freedoms.

Almost worst than anything compared to Japan and Korea was that most of western bands, not only failed to protect their IP, they willingly gave it away and continue to give it away to access Chinese market. As per Chinese laws to make or sells anything in China the company must be Chinese controlled ands that means all western brands (particularly German) lost control of their IP quicker than their could blink. I am not big fan of government intervention, but I think this is where governments should draw the line (i.e. block IP sharing). I think dealing with ruzzia is enough at this moment.

Sorry for making it political, it just feels to me the stakes here are way higher than it was with Japan and Korea. 

For same reason I will never own Volvo/Polestar and MG... especially when autonomy becomes more widespread. The last thing I want is for Chinese to spy on me when I drive... it is enough that they already have my fingerprints 😄 

 

19 hours ago, dutchie01 said:

Nobody with a right brain did believe EVs would be taxless until eternity no? Strange and biased article in my opinion. Also not taking into account the rapid development within the EV industry. Batteries will become cheaper and better, lighter more capacity faster charging,recycling. Cheaper cars are on the way, for example VW just announced an ID2 and ID1, Toyota is on a roll etc.

It's the ones with a left brain you need to worry about Bernard 😎

17 hours ago, Rabbers said:

I’m wondering if the good rabbi was not denying the value, indeed the very concept, of human ambition.  Extended, his thinking would mean that happiness lies in ignorance of the availability of better things.

Not quite so Renato, philosophers as far back as Socrates, "He who is not contented with what he has, would not be contented with what he would like to have" express similar thoughts. Today's society is driven by being discontented, sophisticated marketeers exist to make you discontent with what you have. And let's not confuse this with ambition, that's a whole different notion. 😎

13 hours ago, ColinBarber said:

Wasn't the same view held in the 60/70/80s about Japan, and yet here we are on a Lexus forum.

And how's the motor cycle industry these days? 

18 hours ago, bernieeccles said:

Read many posts on the Tesla forums of people getting quotes for insurance in the thousands if at all. I don't know if this is an EV thing in general but it does seem that Tesla cars are having problems getting spares when damaged and are often written off because of it.

BMW i3REX £40K+ £254 FC, PNCB 👍

 

Obviously not.

16 hours ago, wharfhouse said:

Other then the SE all other trims of IS 300h were already in Band B so will stay there. That is currently £20 a year but gets discounted to £10 for hybrid (and alternative powered vehicles). For 2023 it says "rates for Alternative Fuel Vehicles and hybrids will also be equalised" - by that I assume it means the £10 discount will be dropped so will mean a doubling in annual ved to £20...!

Actually I missed that, mine being a REX but classed as a Hybrid on the DVLC means I won’t be paying £20 like other EVs but £10….great, thanks.

11 hours ago, Spacewagon52 said:

I understand the different opinions espoused on the EV / ICE debate. My concern is that it is becoming very partisan and fractious. I have no issues with someone wanting to buy an EV if they can afford it. The wealth issue is spurious to say the least - as some ICE models are far too expensive to purchase for many of us. 

There are many reasons to be wary of purchasing an EV car right now, but VED in 2025, is not one of them. Royoftherovers made an interesting political point regarding China, as did Colin Barber in reply.

Purchasing a £40 grand + car is very heavy on road tax. But if you have the money and that is your choice, then it is a free (not from tax!) country! If I had around £70,000 spare to buy a new car, then I would probably go for the electric RX. There are other reasons, apart from initial cost why I would be wary about buying an EV vehicle. 

1) Reliability

2) Model choice 

I will stick with my 4 litre V8 and 3.3 litre V6 for the time being - when they become too expensive ............... I will use my bus pass!

I feel there is unjustified criticism of EV's 

Your first paragraph is very true, in Sept we took the i3 in for its biennial service as I walked out of the showroom later in the day I noticed a price tag on one of the “sporty” saloons finished in a matt primer (fkg horrible) the price was £155,000……😱

 

The rest of your post is also true 👍

17 hours ago, Linas.P said:

how that will work with 2030 band on ICEVs.

Ban is ONLY in the UK and most of Europe  .....  and it's still some way to get to 2030 eh !

One can still pop over to somewhere on a cheapy flight and buy a brand new petrol car and import it ( drive it ) to the UK to drive   ....  Lexus / Toyota which coy will still be the biggest producer of cars globally whatever .....  the EVs will continue to be but a tiny part of their offerings I'm sure 

AND AS FOR CHINA .  well, when I visited on holiday in the early 90's it was a brilliant country and our Chinese Guide was a well USA educated chap who quite happily told us that he, along with many others were simply being sent to the West to be educated and to learn and to return ( quite happily ) to then bolster and develop the country's manufacturing and knowledge bases to help drive HIS country, China forward to become a great industrial base 

They got that right then some 30 years back and it's those same people, like our tour Guide, who is no doubt driving the status forward .......  just a shame they haven't moved away from having the Imperial Emperor again  ........ " Xi forever it seems "  .  that will probably be their downfall eh ! ........  Putinesque just don't work for the benefit of the People in reality ...  just for the very few now super rich

Malc

16 hours ago, ColinBarber said:

Yes correct. Band A will disappear to everything there goes into Band B. Alternative fuel discounts will be removed.

For all Lexus hybrids up to 2017, whichever band they are in, it will mean an extra £10.

Doh!  Thought I got a bonus for a bit then 😄

2 hours ago, Phil xxkr said:

And how's the motor cycle industry these days? 

Surprisingly well. BSA, Royal Enfield, Triumph, Norton,Royal Enfield are all doing pretty well and the best selling bike is not Japanese, its a BMW

On 11/18/2022 at 8:01 PM, Spock66 said:

The current Government policy is to raise taxes, if it was not Vehicle Excise Duty it would be something else going up.

I don't have an electric car, but even if I did I would think at £165 per year that's a fair cop.

How many of the new electric cars are mobility purchases where no RFL is payable ?

19 hours ago, Mr Vlad said:

I always thought happiness was a cigar called Hamlet. I wasn't happy after smoking one some years ago lol.

18 hours ago, Phil xxkr said:

Only if you have a comb-over hairstyle 😂

For younger members, the comb-over hero was Gregor Fisher who later achieved fame as Rab C Nesbit.
 

 

13 minutes ago, LenT said:

For younger members, the comb-over hero was Gregor Fisher who later achieved fame as Rab C Nesbit.
 

 

Brilliant len

They don't do funny TV adverts anymore. Such a shame. That ones a ruddy classic. Funny as duck.

10 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

They don't do funny TV adverts anymore. Such a shame. That ones a ruddy classic. Funny as duck.

 

54 minutes ago, markeyszoo said:

How many of the new electric cars are mobility purchases where no RFL is payable ?

No idea, how many Lexus are mobility purchases?

58 minutes ago, dutchie01 said:

Surprisingly well. BSA, Royal Enfield, Triumph, Norton,Royal Enfield are all doing pretty well and the best selling bike is not Japanese, its a BMW

Really? Selling a brand name isn't quite the same. As in MG to the Chinese doesn't make it a MG does it? 😕

28 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

They don't do funny TV adverts anymore. Such a shame. That ones a ruddy classic. Funny as duck.

Not allowed, might…..no definitely would upset the woke brigade.

2 minutes ago, Boxbrownie said:

No idea, how many Lexus are mobility purchases?

They recently became approved, there was earlier comments on this