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I remember back in my youth when most cars on the road were either Ford or Vauxhall & the likes of BMW/VW/Porsche were the niche car manufacturers (even then with a reputation for being expensive to run). I also remember when the Japanese cars started showing the buying public that owning a car didn't have to mean putting up with unreliability, forcing all the manufacturer's to up their game. All things Japanese at that point for me were synonomous with quality, be it electronic or otherwise, so naturally I bought a Supra over a Sierra Cosworth/911 back in 1992 and for similar reasons to owning an F today. I had it for six years and it stayed in the family for a further 6 years without missing a beat. Back then you were spoilt for choice if you wanted a Japanese sports car until most of them disappeared after the recession in the 90's and the subsequent vacuum was filled by the German performance cars. People need to be reminded that there are alternatives to the Germans (albeit pretty limited at present) and to that end Lexus should continue developing ever better F models and keep plugging away with the marketing, product placement (movies/TV) and promotion of their presence/successes in the GT racing series. Hopefully the new Supra will also help further raise the profile of Japanese performance cars in the public's consciousness, although additional performance models from Mazda, Nissan etc would certainly help!! Now the Germans are the mainstream manufacturer's and have become the norm, I can't help wondering if there might be a shift at some point toward people wanting something different; in a similar way that peoples aspirations changed towards owning German rather than the likes of a Ford or Vauxhall. I'm sure a big part of the interest I see in the RCF is due to it being different from the usual German stuff people see every day - its styling clearly resonates with people. I have never experienced this level of positive interest in any car I have ever owned previously and people constantly stop to tell me what a great looking car it is, and ask about it. Last week even had a guy stop his car & park up next to me just to ask about it - maybe the shift has already started? Obviously it makes sense to want Lexus to be more successful in the UK as it would certainly be helpful to have a greater choice of dealers & a larger supply of parts etc. However part of me also thinks it would be a shame for them to become too mainstream. I like the fact that with the "F" I am part of a pretty exclusive group of enthusiasts who drive very rare cars and who have made their ownership decision based on a cars merits not its badge. I'm not convinced I really want that to change too much as the pros seem to out way the cons IMHO!! The one thing I would be happy to see change is the way our cars are being reviewed with this inbuilt bias which has already been discussed. It would be refreshing to know that a review of an F, or any other car for that matter, had been written impartially without the influence of any other agenda, but I suspect that's not going to happen any time soon!! It's a shame because I used to be an avid reader of car mags, but owning a Lexus opened my eyes to this issue, and as result I have little interest in them these days.

I guess Toyota could’ve taken a different approach and never created Lexus...after all the brand was strong enough to shift MR2, Celica GT4’s and importantly for the point you are making the Supra in big numbers back in the day and so they could have conceivably taken the car they developed in the shape of the original LS and left the Toyota logo on the grille. But sports cars and the UK were not the nuts they were trying to crack at the time - Luxury cars and the US were. And for that to work they needed a new brand and they were probably right. Now they could have gone the route of Acura/Honda and had a market specific brand in the US, but they didn't. I have to say my original response was more about 'why don't people know or care about F-cars' rather than 'why don't Lexus sell more F-cars'...after all Lexus sell (quite quickly) all the inventory they bring to the UK. If my response was more focused on 'why don't Lexus sell more F-Cars' then we get into quite complicated territory: - Firstly Lexus is not Lexus. The Lexus we all know and rely on is Lexus UK (actually its franchisees being co-ordinated by Lexus UK, but lets park that for now). Lexus UK is an independent entity to Lexus EU. Which is an independent entity to Lexus Japan (HQ). Lexus UK are supposed to work with Lexus EU and co-ordinate. But in reality they don't and historically the relationship has been patchy. Both Lexus EU and UK work to Japan. They receive their inventory from Japan. They receive the product from Japan and the brand guidelines from Japan. They have some autonomy in terms of marketing, advertising, dealership design and brochure-ware but that's about it. - Secondly why do they have an F car at all? The reality is they are halo cars. They help shift the perception of the brand and access different audiences. But mostly they allow them to sell the 'F-Sport'. In the UK they sold ten times as many RC F-sports as any other car in the RC line and five times as many RC F-Sports as RCF's. The F-Sport is a higher margin product and they want to sell as many as they can. - Thirdly. They sell as many as the dealers allow them to sell. Lexus UK compile the order they make from Japan based on the sales projections they get from dealers - Fourthly. Trade tariffs and some of the other bits from my other post and probably lack of sunroofs or something

Lexus does sell in quite respectable numbers as a niche brand. If we're talking why Lexus doesn't sell in BMW or MB numbers then I think there are loads of factors here. Below comes from personal experience, as I used to work for the marketing agency that did all Lexus UK marketing, and my best friend made the LC500 launch film so knows the advertising team quite well. Beyond that its just my opinion: - We have a v.traditional and v.established car market in the UK where 'new' is not seen as a virtue - UK consumers are some of the most brand conscious consumers in the world. Furthermore our peculiar flavour of brand-centricness (not a word!) is closely aligned to heritage and history - For this reason no premium brand has made any kind of dent in the market...except at the mass/budget end of the market (Smart, Hyundai, Kia) - Product development takes place in Japan with American and domestic tastes as the basis of the brief. The resulting products are therefore delivered as a fait accompli to the UK, and are therefore often a little alien looking to the average household - The UK car market is one of the most valuable in Europe, therefore the established European brands guard it jealously - Historically cars manufactured in Japan have been subject to a 10% import duty to the EU, wiping out much of the profit and money that could otherwise be spent on marketing/advertising - Partly because of this and partly because of the influence of BMW/MB, Lexus haven't been able to break into the hire car market in Europe. Hiring a 'Premium' or 'Luxury' car in Europe will rarely result in you driving a car with an 'L' on the steering wheel. This is an enormous market and accounts for a large proportion of inventory coming out of Munich or Stuttgart, and how many business customers come to experience these cars - The German car industry have made it their business to 'control' Dennis (Auto Express, Evo, Octane) and the other magazine publishers by block buying the most important advertising space in the magazines (inside front, outside back pages, etc) - Lexus hasn't been good at 'playing the game' with the publishers and haven't been generous enough with the launch trips they organise. It is a bit of an industry joke that the reason the RCF didn't review well initially is that the journalists were 'only' flown economy to NYC for the launch, couldn't take spouses and were only put up for a weekend...whereas when Porsche (or MB or BMW) create any kind of iteration of their cars, they offer week long trips with WAG's to private estates and also allow journalists to jump waiting lists...interestingly Lexus fixed this for the LC500 and took the journalists away for a whole week, first class, with spouses and really showered them with hospitality - as a result reviews were a lot more generous - Outside of GT racing recently Lexus hasn't been near the track and haven't understood the link in European minds between success in F1 and Premium...in Japan motor-racing at any level is used purely to show sporting prowess, nothing more - Japanese products don't have much of a cache as premium products. Jackie Chan in the Cannonball Run didn't help. Nor did Infiniti. Nor does the newest Civic Type-R. Or Casio watches or anything else that the average UK Joe associates with Japan...rather than the reality which is: an attention to detail that borders on obsession, a natural affinity for craft, materials and engineering, a commitment to science being able to transcend art and a genuine culture of having petrol in the blood

Wrong badge on the RCF for those showrooms. Another offputting factor to the punters is that the indicators work faultlessly, they're used to intermittent at best ☺️.

This time I decided to take the 450h on a longer route to Spain. Bolton --> Maidstone (I like classy places) --> Troyes --> Evian --> Turin (via the St Bernard Pass) --> Monaco --> Nice --> Valencia (Spain) --> Orange (France) --> Reims --> Bolton. As usually, the car didn't miss a heartbeat. The only issue was leaving Reims, my tyre presses warning came on. Looks like driving at 140km/h in 30+ degrees heat and then parking overnight with temperatures dropping to 10 degrees caused the pressure to drop 0.4 bar on all tyres. Luckily I had my compressor in the car. My MPG over nearly 3,500 miles was an indicated 40.6. Considering the amount of miles I did driving at over 85MPH, going over the Alps (although going down the other side used very little fuel) and driving around cities... I am again impressed with the GS. No turbo = no noticeable loss of power at 2,500m up a mountain 🙂 Longest sprint was Nice to Valencia which was about 900KM and took 9 hours to complete. Parked up at the other end, a quick stretch and I was ready for a walk and some dinner. It is a shame the GS is no more as I would buy another. I am seriously considering buying my GS off Lexus in a few months at the end of my PCP and running it into the ground. The only other car which is currently interesting me is the RX450h. Whatever my next car is... it needs ventilated seats. Driving in 40 degrees heat and getting out without a sweaty back is lovely. SW.

1.yes 2. Just my car 3. Just me 4. No pork for me pls

Exactly the same as big rat😜

1. Yes. 2. 1 car - mine. 3. 2 people (Wife & I) 4. No dietary requirements. We also need to start talking timings if we are going to link up, convoy and be at Lexus Derby for 9am or thereabouts..... Going to be an early start, but will be an adventure for sure! 👍😎

Lol, no dietary requirements? Coffee n Cake? mine will be beer and bubble wrap please 👍

As I live local to Lexus Derby and they are my dealer is this meet just for ISFs or can I bring my Celsior along ( it is a V8 🙂 )

Thanks to all for their responses so far. Before I start, if I’ve forgotten anyone or missed anyone off the list below please do not take offence! It’s been a long day! So, I’ve checked back through all the previous threads and polls and it looks like the following people have confirmed their attendance or indicated interest at the very least. I know there are quite a few non-forum members also due to attend but these ( below) are members on this forum that I’ve been able to identify. If any if the below who have not yet responded can do the honours that would be great; @NothernDan @Big Rat @Warrington guy @Comedian Are you coming Sean? I think you were a yes. @Peter P18 + Mrs Peter P18 @Cezar B +3 @Arqum @YN57OCK @bobmc +1 @C.B @C.B‘s mate in the E63 @C.B‘s uncle in the ‘stang, did he ever confirm? @Womble72 @Bluethunder @DAW @Northern isf @Twellsie @d3ron Then @Womble72 had 4 potential mates in an RCF, GSF, SC430 and ISF So I make that 22 if all of the above show up plus whoever is coming that is a mate of the forum plus any other ISFers that know about the event, are coming but are not on here to advise. Please confirm or advise as required. All looking promising so far though!!

My local Audi garage has a Gym ...lol https://www.pooleaudi.co.uk/owners-area/poole-audi-gym My Lexus dealership has a coffee machine but they even struggle with that. They are good people though. The local Audi and BMW dealerships are dynamic, I hate to say it they are so far ahead of Lexus in marketing and selling cars its embarrassing. These places are absolutely buzzing. That said if you stuck an RCF in one of those showrooms people would be all over it like a rash. I really cannot get my head around Lexus in this country.

Hi Dan, Yes Just 1 car, mine Just 1, me I have no dietary requirements

Not only people wanting something different but with the 10% import tax coming to an end over the next few years there will be more of a level playing field. That advantage could even shift the other way with electric vehicles as the Japanese manufactures have easier access to large battery manufacturers such as Panasonic, Sanyo, NEC, Yuasa etc.

Wasn't always the case. The IS200 sport, GS sport etc. were designed and modified in Europe/UK from Toyota TTE and other European sourced parts (O.Z. wheels) - Lexus GB would order a standard GS300 for example and replace suspension, wheels, and body parts on import to convert it to a GS300 sport. That all stopped when TTE/Toyota Motorsport GmbH turned into the Formula 1 team. Back then, Lexus didn't exist in Japan and Lexus models had the Toyota badge, with TRD developing performance parts for them. The F division occurred very soon after Lexus launched in Japan, in part because they can't really use the TRD name on a Lexus, even though TRD as still producing the parts, and also in part to compete with AMG, M division, RS in the US - Europe has never really been a consideration for Lexus designers except for the CT.

William, it arrived today and fits like a glove, well worth it. The non slip bit in the middle as mentioned before is an improvement on the OEM liner too

To me these look as though they have been re built with new batteries, and valve stems. Magnifying the pictures if you look particularly at the potted area away from the batteries if I am not mistaken you can see some of the original white potting compound that has not been removed. However I see no problem with this as far as use is concerned, but they should not be advertised as new if they are not. One other point is that the cover has a metal strip attached, and this acts as an aerial for the transmitter. If this is not in place it could reduce the range, and reliability of the signals. John.

@NothernDan Dan I’ve sent @Warrington guy Dave a message 👍 Big Rat

1. Yes 2.1 car mine 3. Just 1 me 4. I have no dietary requirements Big Rat

Yes Just 1 car, mine Just 1, me I have no dietary requirements

Fewer isn't a bad thing, means you get more petrol per litre of fuel.

Hi all, Not long now till the event and I need to establish some pretty firm numbers on how many cars and how many people will be attending on the 29th. I'll also be posting this in the events tab so please do not move this post!! Our centre host at Lexus Derby, Alex, has been on the phone today looking to confirm two things; How many vehicles they need to arrange parking for (we will all be given priority parking spaces right in front of the dealership) and How many actual people will be in attendance (i.e. F-drivers, mates of F-Drivers in large red BMW's etc plus any passengers) The last point is because they are wanting to lay on breakfast for us (Woohoo!) and Alex needs to know if anybody has any dietary requirements (Vegetarian, Pescatarian, Caffeine-Free etc) and how much of whatever he needs to order. So, can everybody who is attending on the Saturday (and who will definitely be at Lexus Derby) please respond below and let me know the following things. I need to confirm numbers with Alex ASAP, ideally by the weekend but certainly no later than Monday the 24th PM; Confirm you will be present at Lexus Derby on the morning of the 29th Confirm if it is just your car or if it is not, how many non-forum-member mates (number of cars) will be coming with you (I need a total number of cars) Confirm a total amount of people the above will mean is in your mini-group Confirm if any have any dietary requirements as above If you can please reply to the questions in your post numbered as above (1-4) that would be a great help for me. For example, mine will be; Yes Just 1 car, mine Just 1, me I have no dietary requirements Hope you can all assist and by all means if you know the details for any people who you know will be coming but are not on the forum please let me know below. I need to be as accurate as possible with Alex so we are not causing a parking inconvenience for other Lexus customers and butchering too many innocent pigs in the process! Thanks all!! P.S. This means we may adjust the itinerary slightly with regards to the first stop. TBC so watch this space.

Open to all good sir. Bring the beast along!

Yes Dan, as far as I’m aware they will all be present on the Saturday, like u I’m an over nighter. Looking forward to it 👍👍

@DAW Another cracking post and I agree with you wholeheartedly 👍 🐀

Worked around it. Slowly. Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

The other interesting thing that comes from your experience is .... Beware Auctions!

£150 a year parked plus 3p a mile for me. I currently pay £170 ...If I did 5000 miles a year the total would be £300 . Agree about VED, its nonsensical .

I do road trips abroad as well but the car is left at home😉 Bloody cyclists !!! Pyrenees 2011 (Spain back UK ) Koln 2015 (UK to Switzerland and return via France) DDAY beaches 2017 Apologies back to car trips (I really should do some at some point - it will save the knees 🙂

True - These maginificent cars lose value because of this and are slowly being pushed off the road due to the high running costs and to be replaced by so called more economical models.

Been doing these trips twice a year for the last 13 years. Always take the Shuttle via Folkestone and Calais, then any of the 4 main routes down to Spain. Here are a couple of pics from my recent trip via Cleremont Ferrand, taking in the Viaduc de Garabit and the Via du Millau.

Measurable in laboratory testing but is it really significant in everyday driving, with all the inherent uncontrollable variants that come with it?

Agree totally The point I was trying to make is in the AMG the engine produced more power and more smoothly. No interest in mpg. In the RC again I've no interest in mpg and still believe the additional cleaning additives are beneficial, well certainly not detrimental but as I've never used anything but V-Power from mile 0 I cannot really compare performance. I believe the engine does adjust settings depending on fuel quality though.

With the display used in earlier cars turning the lights on and off three times in quick succession in accessory mode takes you to the hidden display. I believe on later cars you hold the menu button down, and the operate the lights three times. Not having a later version car I cannot confirm this, but no doubt someone will or give the alternative procedure. John

Forgive me for saying this, but that's like saying I put 2 stroke oil in my 2 stroke mower, and that runs perfectly on it. Because a given fuel runs in one manufacturers car does not translate into it will perform better in an other of a different make. To me that £5 or £6 pounds saved is another gallon of fuel that will take me another 40 miles rather than loosing 1 or 2 MPG using a higher octane fuel that the engine was not designed for. Yes cars with engines designed to run on high octane fuel will get better MPG from that fuel against a lower grade, but that does not translate into a higher grade will give more MPG in engines not designed for it in fact the reverse is the case. Check calorific values of petrol grades. John.

Nice post - very informative

The question is what is normal use? To some that is a daily drive covering 100 miles to others a 50 mile run once a month. It is generally the cars that get little use that suffer problems. Long stay parking at airports can be a problem to hybrids partially due to the small capacity battery used in many of them. With Hybrids the problem is there is no advance warning that the battery is getting tired or just discharged from lack of use. With a normal car you hear the engine struggle to turn over in the morning particularly in cold weather. A sure sign that the battery needs charging or replacing. With a hybrid nothing changes until the car will not boot into ready mode. A voltage display or simple green orange red display of battery state on the MFD would be very useful instead of hiding the same information away on a hidden menu that is not in the handbook, and that most people do not know exists. John

Spot on doog! An old friend of mine once told me he bought a Rolex watch and nothing else as everybody would recognize it as an expensive thing. there you go. now here's a thought.. hypothetical but.. What if the F cars would be sold under a different name, like for instance, TOYOTA RCF that will then operate under a well marketed Toyota Racing Division or something. Tom what's your take on this?

Update: The troublesome reluctor ring has now been replaced with an £18 ebay part. Local garage changed 1.25 hours labour and I'm happy to report that all symptoms have been fixed, no anti-slip light under braking and brake pedal is nice and smooth as it should be. This is why I like owner forums! Case closed. Now to do something about that Victorian sound system...…...

Aye a friend asked if I had considered the isf when I was looking at m3’s. That’s how I found out and I thought I had my finger on the pulse of the car market!

In the text input box, bottom right there is an orange "other media" button. To the bottom left is a "drag files here" to attach or choose files link. This is good for uploading from one's pc. If one wishes to attach images from the web, simply copy the image address by right clicking the image, then just paste the address into the text input box

I think you can over complicate the analysis. For me, not enough people know the F brand. Therefore Lexus don’t sell many cars. Knock on effect, you don’t see many on the roads. Viscous circle. I also believe that the UK market (for F cars) is hardly a priority for Lexus. Unlikely to get better. Looking back at things, at the time of the F launch I was big into reading motoring articles and hence I knew about the ISF. These days it is highly likely the whole brand would be unknown to me.

I'm sure there's nothing 'wrong' with it per se just that it will have fewer or cheaper additives?

Can i ask what is wrong with it as i also have a GS300?

A few from a recent visit to Singapore 60 years after I was born there........ it’s changed some..... Oh and a few of Lexus Boutique Singapore..... just for good measure Big Rat

Hi all, thanks for all the help and suggestions - I have positive news! Something in me wasn't buying the earthing issue - all I checked on the multimeter was 100% good, and the aux battery checked out ok. Main issues that pointed to the Mass Air Flow sensor were lumpy tickover, dramatically increased fuel consumption, and (no idea about this but found it twice on YouTube) unplugging the connection to the MAF sensor when the engine is running doesn't cut the engine. So I thought I'd bite the bullet and replace it before I get Lexus involved. Bought a Denso one (same as the one fitted) online from Euro Car Parts for £153.99 - stayed away from the £30 eBay ones!! Arrived today. Before I fitted it, I tried switching on with nothing on (climate, radio, lights) to see if warnings were still there - had a thought the car washing guys may have got water in somewhere which mat have dried out... got the previous warning Check Hybrid System but a nasty new one Check four-wheel drive system. Changed the sensor, 2 minute job, switched on and bingo, all nasty warnings gone. Engine started and still ticked over rough so I took the car for a gentle run. Ran as sweet as you like, but the engine light still on. When warm I parked up twice and switched off, but it was still on when back home, HOWEVER I can't tell when the engine is running or not now. It cuts out as soon as I stop and there is no smell, or nasty electrical fizzing. Guys, all I have talked about would appear to related to the MAF sensor which I've read will go at around 120k if it is going to. My car is 125k. Such an easy fix if this is it (fingers crossed). I hope the engine light will correct itself and with it the only error code P0102, Mass air flow volume low. Is it possible a non Toyota MAF sensor will need resetting with better equipment than I have? I'll do some more miles and see - fuel consumption back to normal too as far as I can tell after a few miles.

Just using the premium grade from COSTCO, cheaper than anyone else locally.

The batteries in the hybrids are AGM batteries, but you do not need to pay dealer prices to get AGM batteries. Exide do a direct replacement AGM battery however the best AGM batteries to buy are mobility scooter batteries. These are available in the same dimensions as the OEM battery, but have a higher capacity typically 55 or 60 amp hours for the OEM 45 amp hour size. The only downside is the terminals are usually bolt on type, but this is not a real problem. They are deep cycle batteries, very ruggedly built, and cost around £75, John.

Just a phone snap of my wheels parked up in the Ordesa Valley Monte Perido National park in Spain. Everything that is right in life can be seen in this snap. Great scenery, great weather, good car and camera lurking [emoji6] Needless to say the cars been great on the journey down via the Alps, Dordogne and French Pyrenees over the last week. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

failures are rare but have occurred before http://www.lexusownersclub.co.uk/forum/topic/92120-sad-day-for-my-450h/